HOW-TO: 95-00 Coilover install
07-05-13, 05:10 AM
#31
Nice write up, Thanks
SB104
I just changed my rear shocks keeping the factory setup on my 1996 LS 400 and found that........
KYB Sb104 rear boot is not the correct part for this. It does not have the thick rubber flange that the originals do, and has no means of holding it in place even if it is used. Wish now I would have gotten the Lexus part. I managed to cut up the old boot and mate it to the WRONG boot in a way that should be fine but still I'm peeved at KYB for selling the wrong parts.
KYB #s FOR THE REAR 341269 for the shock is a good number as is SM5177 for the top mount are good numbers.
From KYB's website:
http://showmetheparts.com/kyb/
Sewells:
http://lexus.sewellparts.com/images/...000/483012.jpg
The old shocks were a little weak but not as bad as I would expect and the top mounts were still in good shape but I installed the new ones since I already had them. The springs were in good condition still and everytheing came apart and went back together OK.
SB104
I just changed my rear shocks keeping the factory setup on my 1996 LS 400 and found that........
KYB Sb104 rear boot is not the correct part for this. It does not have the thick rubber flange that the originals do, and has no means of holding it in place even if it is used. Wish now I would have gotten the Lexus part. I managed to cut up the old boot and mate it to the WRONG boot in a way that should be fine but still I'm peeved at KYB for selling the wrong parts.
KYB #s FOR THE REAR 341269 for the shock is a good number as is SM5177 for the top mount are good numbers.
From KYB's website:
http://showmetheparts.com/kyb/
Sewells:
http://lexus.sewellparts.com/images/...000/483012.jpg
The old shocks were a little weak but not as bad as I would expect and the top mounts were still in good shape but I installed the new ones since I already had them. The springs were in good condition still and everytheing came apart and went back together OK.
Last edited by Lexinky; 07-05-13 at 08:50 AM. Reason: typo
09-09-13, 07:28 AM
#33
Originally Posted by Yamae
remove the fuse indicated by the red oval [in the picture below].
[Look for the] fuse panel with a lid under the dash [on the] driver's side which is also under the air vent next to the door mirror [control pad]. It is a 20A fuse. To see and remove the fuse you need to remove the lid. At the lid side "エアサスペンション" is [or may be] printed and you can confirm it. "エアサスペンション" means "Air suspension" in English.
Don't know if anyone (Yamae?) is still following this thread but I just went thru this process this weekend and pulling this fuse will in fact deactivate the "VRS Off" dummy light but now the "Headlight Aiming" dummy light will not go off. My next step is to go back under the car and unplug all 4 connectors for the leveling sensors. We removed the aperture arms but the electronics are all still there. Hope this works.
remove the fuse indicated by the red oval [in the picture below].
[Look for the] fuse panel with a lid under the dash [on the] driver's side which is also under the air vent next to the door mirror [control pad]. It is a 20A fuse. To see and remove the fuse you need to remove the lid. At the lid side "エアサスペンション" is [or may be] printed and you can confirm it. "エアサスペンション" means "Air suspension" in English.
Don't know if anyone (Yamae?) is still following this thread but I just went thru this process this weekend and pulling this fuse will in fact deactivate the "VRS Off" dummy light but now the "Headlight Aiming" dummy light will not go off. My next step is to go back under the car and unplug all 4 connectors for the leveling sensors. We removed the aperture arms but the electronics are all still there. Hope this works.
10-27-13, 08:46 PM
#35
So, since I was back under there today I was determined to stop this "headlight aiming" nonsense once and for all by unclipping any existing wiring from the air/coil-over swap. FAIL! That didn't work. Then I removed the drivers' side headlight unit and behind it was another large (20 amp?) fuse labled "air sus". Thought that was my "a-ha" moment; pulled it and - FAIL again...not only did the warning light NOT go off - it activated another one so I put it back. Fresh out of ideas 
09-15-14, 11:14 AM
#37
Pole Position
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Alberta
Posts: 265
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hey man tried to PM you but you are on restricted contacts.
Just wondering how those BC coilovers ended up working out for you in your LS400. I had a set of Megan EZ streets in my 93 Celsior and it was horrible, they had such a short stroke that it would bottom out vicously on bigger bumps, the height adjust was terrible as well, I don't even think it was designed for that car, terrible, ruined the car.
I have a 97 Celsior VVti now and the stock ride is crazy soft, feels like it has 8 in of travel how far up and down the car goes over large dips (hence the very soft ride I think!) how did those Coilovers end up working for you? similar amount of travel compared to the stock struts? bottoming out problems? I'm looking for that factory sport tuning firmness that still retains some ride quality, I'm no teenager anymore.
Your advice is appreciated!
Just wondering how those BC coilovers ended up working out for you in your LS400. I had a set of Megan EZ streets in my 93 Celsior and it was horrible, they had such a short stroke that it would bottom out vicously on bigger bumps, the height adjust was terrible as well, I don't even think it was designed for that car, terrible, ruined the car.
I have a 97 Celsior VVti now and the stock ride is crazy soft, feels like it has 8 in of travel how far up and down the car goes over large dips (hence the very soft ride I think!) how did those Coilovers end up working for you? similar amount of travel compared to the stock struts? bottoming out problems? I'm looking for that factory sport tuning firmness that still retains some ride quality, I'm no teenager anymore.
Your advice is appreciated!
09-15-14, 11:29 AM
#38
kingsoup, i too am running on BCR coilovers (though i replaced the springs with bags) on my 97. shmee did the same thing converting his coilovers to run on bags.
keep in mind that all aftermarket coilovers have a much shorter stroke than OEM struts. if your megans were bottoming out, you may have been too low or you did not adjust the height setting properly. hopefully you did not mess with the preload of the springs. only adjust height using the lowest perch setting. that or you are right that they were not intended for the car.
i can tell you that even with bags, which usually provides a softer ride, the coilovers are much stiffer than stock. i do have my damper settings at mid level (20 front , 15 rear) so that contributes to the ride quality. they will be slightly stiffer with coilover springs. i don't have bottoming out issues at all, other than the upper a-arms banging at the strut towers from being too low.
if you want factory sport firmness, i suggest a good set of aftermarket struts with a progressive rate lowering spring instead of going with full coilovers.
keep in mind that all aftermarket coilovers have a much shorter stroke than OEM struts. if your megans were bottoming out, you may have been too low or you did not adjust the height setting properly. hopefully you did not mess with the preload of the springs. only adjust height using the lowest perch setting. that or you are right that they were not intended for the car.
i can tell you that even with bags, which usually provides a softer ride, the coilovers are much stiffer than stock. i do have my damper settings at mid level (20 front , 15 rear) so that contributes to the ride quality. they will be slightly stiffer with coilover springs. i don't have bottoming out issues at all, other than the upper a-arms banging at the strut towers from being too low.
if you want factory sport firmness, i suggest a good set of aftermarket struts with a progressive rate lowering spring instead of going with full coilovers.
09-15-14, 12:21 PM
#39
Pole Position
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Alberta
Posts: 265
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hey Timmy0tool, thanks for the feedback! I had the coilovers more or less and their very highest setting. I'm not into running flush, I had like a 1in gap or a bit more so I can drive it around the city without scraping etc. I had them on the softest compression setting, it was like I went over a big dip on the highway and it would run out of stroke and hit the bump stop or bottem end of the compression hard, it was horrible, as long as I didn't need much travel, small bumps, it was ok, but those things were not great for me I think they were setup more or less to totally slam the car or nothing, which would make sense with the greatly reduced suspension travel.
I didn't have the tool to adjust the spring repload, I was just winding the struts up and down to adjust it, the front I think was almost as low as it could go and it was a 1in gap, the rear was as high as it could go and it was a 1in gap, it was like it was designed for the 95+ and not my 93 car.
That was my original idea, to get a full length stroke Strut that is much firmer and a set of mild drop springs that up the rate from the outrageously soft air suspension. I don't really want to slam the car, although jacking it up is nice in the snow and for repairs. Do you think a much firmer set of dampners would help offset the ultra low spring rate the air suspension has (I get the feeling in Japan these guys were riding around Hella-Flush and may have blown the struts, its missing the front inner-fender liners...) might fix it enough? I feel like the car is made to operate on a certain amount of suspension travel, like the 6-8in I suspect it has (I researched everywhere I could on the internet for a real # of travel but came up empty) and I'd like to retain that. I imagine the coilovers are made to go pretty low and have reduced the stroke, like you say, to compensate for the shorter springs.
I really appreciate the feedback! I love the look of the car and seats etc, but the suspension is making me very sad as is! need to firm it up
I didn't have the tool to adjust the spring repload, I was just winding the struts up and down to adjust it, the front I think was almost as low as it could go and it was a 1in gap, the rear was as high as it could go and it was a 1in gap, it was like it was designed for the 95+ and not my 93 car.
That was my original idea, to get a full length stroke Strut that is much firmer and a set of mild drop springs that up the rate from the outrageously soft air suspension. I don't really want to slam the car, although jacking it up is nice in the snow and for repairs. Do you think a much firmer set of dampners would help offset the ultra low spring rate the air suspension has (I get the feeling in Japan these guys were riding around Hella-Flush and may have blown the struts, its missing the front inner-fender liners...) might fix it enough? I feel like the car is made to operate on a certain amount of suspension travel, like the 6-8in I suspect it has (I researched everywhere I could on the internet for a real # of travel but came up empty) and I'd like to retain that. I imagine the coilovers are made to go pretty low and have reduced the stroke, like you say, to compensate for the shorter springs.
I really appreciate the feedback! I love the look of the car and seats etc, but the suspension is making me very sad as is! need to firm it up
09-15-14, 01:59 PM
#40
megans were prototyped after a 90-94 car so they should be the right length. only thing i can think of is that you installed the rears in the front and vice versa, or they weren't for our cars to begin with. out of the box they are pretty short (so they can be packaged in a smaller box). most folks readjust and lengthen them. also not having the spanner wrenches makes it that much more difficult to adjust.
if your celsior has OEM air suspension, chances are the japanese owner has an air controller to bypass the sensors for driver controlled adjustability where they would drive the car super low. anything newer than the super old and probably dying OEM air suspension will be a world of difference, even if it's as simple as a strut/spring conversion.
the car can function fine with 1-2in of suspension travel. i feel with coilovers, the car can be very comfortable and sporty. my mate with a 97 has megan LP coilovers and the ride is very nice, even with 19s! of course your threshold of comfort may differ from mine. the best comparison i can give is that it feels as stiff as the newer BMW 3-series cars.
if your celsior has OEM air suspension, chances are the japanese owner has an air controller to bypass the sensors for driver controlled adjustability where they would drive the car super low. anything newer than the super old and probably dying OEM air suspension will be a world of difference, even if it's as simple as a strut/spring conversion.
the car can function fine with 1-2in of suspension travel. i feel with coilovers, the car can be very comfortable and sporty. my mate with a 97 has megan LP coilovers and the ride is very nice, even with 19s! of course your threshold of comfort may differ from mine. the best comparison i can give is that it feels as stiff as the newer BMW 3-series cars.
09-15-14, 02:25 PM
#41
Pole Position
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Alberta
Posts: 265
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Interesting! I do remember very much checking the front and rear to make sure it was right, as I remember, the strut body length on the rear is a lot longer then the front and a narrower unit, anyways I sold that car a few years ago, although I guess the Bad taste from Megan's hasn't left me, perhaps its unfounded.
My car does have a 16way air controller, there is no doubt it was riding around slammed, the struts are likely blown, I should have a look under the skirt of the air bags.
I don't mind a sporty ride, I've had a lot of sports cars that are quite firm and I like that sort of thing, although some comfort is nice too. That is interesting that you can compare it too the 3 series BMW, I have 19's that came on mine with chinese tires that are ultra stiff sidewalls, they really crash over bumps and the massive weight of the chrome seems to affect the handling.
I'll do some more research into suspension stroke and coilovers vs strut spring, I'd perfer adjustable compression/rebound and the ability to get the height just right vs non adjustable, but maybe a KYB/H&R setup would be best, thanks again for your input and info!
Update: I did some more reading, the Megan's have a lot more info now then 3years or so ago when I got them for the 93. They list 115mm/135mm rear stroke now on the 95-00 coilovers, they don't list the 89-94 anymore, perhaps a good reason for that. Seems that amount of travel is pretty normal for sports cars and hot rods, so should totally work, most coilovers sets are using the same spring rate front and rear, I might not buy Megan's again, but really you're looking at the same Taiwanese/Chinese made parts with whomever you choose who aren't uber-expensive coilover systems.
My car does have a 16way air controller, there is no doubt it was riding around slammed, the struts are likely blown, I should have a look under the skirt of the air bags.
I don't mind a sporty ride, I've had a lot of sports cars that are quite firm and I like that sort of thing, although some comfort is nice too. That is interesting that you can compare it too the 3 series BMW, I have 19's that came on mine with chinese tires that are ultra stiff sidewalls, they really crash over bumps and the massive weight of the chrome seems to affect the handling.
I'll do some more research into suspension stroke and coilovers vs strut spring, I'd perfer adjustable compression/rebound and the ability to get the height just right vs non adjustable, but maybe a KYB/H&R setup would be best, thanks again for your input and info!
Update: I did some more reading, the Megan's have a lot more info now then 3years or so ago when I got them for the 93. They list 115mm/135mm rear stroke now on the 95-00 coilovers, they don't list the 89-94 anymore, perhaps a good reason for that. Seems that amount of travel is pretty normal for sports cars and hot rods, so should totally work, most coilovers sets are using the same spring rate front and rear, I might not buy Megan's again, but really you're looking at the same Taiwanese/Chinese made parts with whomever you choose who aren't uber-expensive coilover systems.
Last edited by Kingsoup; 09-15-14 at 04:21 PM.
09-15-14, 09:46 PM
#43
I'm not sure what sort of response you are looking for...
But.....
I'm beyond happy with my BC's! They were great with the coil springs and they are holding up fantastic to my bags, too bad the rest of my suspension needs to upgraded now! Haha!
But.....
I'm beyond happy with my BC's! They were great with the coil springs and they are holding up fantastic to my bags, too bad the rest of my suspension needs to upgraded now! Haha!
09-15-14, 10:03 PM
#44
Pole Position
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Alberta
Posts: 265
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I saw people make cutouts for the UCA's but I was running as high as they would let me, wheres that picture...
Rest of suspension upgraded? are you running it super low?
I think coil-overs is the right solution to me, it sounds like my experience with the Megan's was just me on the 93, either they shipped me the wrong set, nothing seemed quite right on them....and my current dampers are blown on my stock air suspension (waves fist in air at gangsta japanese owner who owned this car, what a fool I was not to buy a bone stock old man driven car...) They'll probably work totally fine, since BC makes Megan coilovers and they are very simliar, if yours are working out, they probably would for me as well, especially since I won't even be Flush and have them cranked up for a small wheel gap like in the photo I am going to post, this is with the EZ streets on my old, perfect car....I miss you baby! Also pic of current car with horrible 19" wheels that look nice but perform terribly.
Rest of suspension upgraded? are you running it super low?
I think coil-overs is the right solution to me, it sounds like my experience with the Megan's was just me on the 93, either they shipped me the wrong set, nothing seemed quite right on them....and my current dampers are blown on my stock air suspension (waves fist in air at gangsta japanese owner who owned this car, what a fool I was not to buy a bone stock old man driven car...) They'll probably work totally fine, since BC makes Megan coilovers and they are very simliar, if yours are working out, they probably would for me as well, especially since I won't even be Flush and have them cranked up for a small wheel gap like in the photo I am going to post, this is with the EZ streets on my old, perfect car....I miss you baby! Also pic of current car with horrible 19" wheels that look nice but perform terribly.
09-16-14, 01:34 PM
#45
what usually happens with stiff suspension is that the bushings get worn out faster. lexus/toyota utilizes soft rubber bushings for that nice plush ride. they start to deteriorate and tear at this age, and having stiffer suspension only speeds this up. most folks need to replace those bushings, where the front strut bar bushings are a common starting point.
love your older car with the OZ wheels! newer car is nice too, but i agree with heavy wheels the car will handle differently. coilovers will definitely give a much more positive ride quality over worn out air suspension. i highly recommend BC Racing coilovers BR-type.
love your older car with the OZ wheels! newer car is nice too, but i agree with heavy wheels the car will handle differently. coilovers will definitely give a much more positive ride quality over worn out air suspension. i highly recommend BC Racing coilovers BR-type.