SW17LS

If anybody's interested I posted a review in the CarChat forum:

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/car...ntinental.html

VERY impressed with the car, they really delivered.

2v1g

Have you compared with 16' ls460?

SW17LS

My 15 LS460 is identical to a 16 LS460. There's no difference aside from the 16 having the newer generation navigation system.

2v1g

Wow Korean underdog is really catching up.

I don't like the front though. Looks like a ford

SW17LS

Yeah the front is my least favorite part of the exterior...

superdenso

Nice write-up, but Hyundai Kia has less heritage/pedigree than Toyota. At least Toyota is guilty of building some good stuff once in a while. The G90 has Hyundai Elantra in its lineage:
https://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylc...p=mss&ei=UTF-8

Let's see if a world leader or Fortune 500 CEO/CFO chooses this G90 to arrive at engagements.

SW17LS

Absolutely it has less heritage and pedigree, but everybody starts somewhere, and that's why it's $20,000 cheaper than the LS which is already $10k or so cheaper than comparable other competitors because of its relative lack of pedigree.

Like I said, anybody looking for something in this segment owes it to themselves to drive this car.

I think you'd be surprised the number of wealthy people who would buy this car if they were presented with it and testing one was easily accessible. People said the same thing about Lexus and remember that Warren Buffett and Bill Gates were driving them almost immediately upon their inception, lack of pedigree and all.

How many world leaders arrive in Lexus vehicles? Very unusual, yet the success is there.

The challenge will be access. I had to drive 30 miles one way from my office in very affluent Bethesda to even drive one because so few dealers are Genesis dealers. How many people will go to that length to give Genesis a chance?

superdenso

Does the name **** Cheney sound familiar?

http://m.tmz.com/#article/2016/05/18/****-cheney-driving-video/

Further, it looks like plenty of execs and. Celebs go in for Lexus

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/car-chat/300316-famous-people-who-drive-lexus-17.html

****Toyota has some pedigree with the go anywhere survive anything Land Cruiser. Further, the Cressida/Crown is a big part of their history. They just don't have 150mph+ road cars like the Europeans

SW17LS

**** Cheney had an LS400 when he was a private citizen, the US does not use Lexus vehicles to transport heads of state.

No doubt plenty of execs and celebrities drive Lexus vehicles, that's my point. Lexus is only 26 years old, and many of those high profile people bought in when Lexus was a lot younger than that. When you build a good product people take notice, fast forward a few years and who knows, people like that might buy Genesis products too.

superdenso

you present good points. But when Toyota went into Lexus they had race cars and a long history of building reliable vehicles. So you knew that if the car sucked at least it would rarely break. That's pedigree that HyundaiKia doesn't have. Ok, I'll be fair, they seem to be getting better.

Look at the list of vehicles this company supplies for heads of state...around the world Toyota/Lexus transports leaders

http://www.asc-germany.de/head-of-state-vehicles/

SW17LS

People still really thought Lexus was a joke though. Remember too that at that time Toyota was not that removed from the 70s when they really made crappy economy cars, much like Hyundai is about 10 years removed from building really crappy economy cars. Lots of people "would never buy a Toyota" too.

The big hurdle IMHO is dealers. Toyota invested in strategically placed, beautiful high end dealers. Hyundai hasn't done that with Genesis, and that makes it hard for the customer to have the vehicle exposed to them so that they have a desire to try one out. In those dealers they had parties, art events, wine tastings etc and exposed the cars that way. Genesis can't do any of that.

Like I said, I drove 30 miles. Would an ordinary guy who just buys nice cars do that? I don't think so.

You should drive one though, the product is excellent, nobody would drive the car and come away wanting. They just need easy access to drive the car.

roadfrog

I dont care what heads of state drive, if the Genesis delivers, I'd get one. I saw many heads of state driving in Crown Victorias, but I never bought one. I don't see them driving in Cadillac CT6's either, but apparently some think they're just great.

droclex

I remember when Lexus emerged in 1989. Toyota, while synonymous with "Economy," more or less was revered as a paragon of reliability, perhaps loathed by those who resented the Japanese for overtaking the big 3, right here on our home turf. My initial thought was that it's absurd to just "invent" a luxury car out of an everyday model, I felt that such a moniker had to be earned and was tied to a enduring legacy of prestige. And that line of thinking led me to believe that Lexus was just rebadging ordinary cars like Camry and calling it a day, which likewise seemed ridiculous to me. Throughout the next decade and beyond, I couldn't help but notice that the LS and ES were handsome, popular vehicles and that they gradually changed people's minds, banking on build quality, service, and related dependability, enticing the right demographic that was willing to save a little. As a result and although more recent reliability can be debated, I really believe that Lexus has in fact earned its status as a true luxury marquee. And I think that we can all agree that it didn't happen overnight, that it required much investment, innovation, and perseverance.. My point is that while Hyundai in 2016 isn't collectively viewed quite as favorably as Toyota was viewed in 1989, the Korean brand isn't too far off from a general perception of competitive quality and value, making it an adequate foundation for the introduction of a related, premium product. Equus notwithstanding, I think Genesis can succeed similarly if it follows Lexus' gameplan; however, they really can't overlook the dealership experience in that pursuit. We'll just have to see how it plays out over the next decade, but success is not guaranteed, IMHO. For now, the G90 seems to make a damn good case for itself and the brand..

If you have the time and haven't already seen it, I'd like to recommend this local review of the Genesis/G80:


Best reaction to the Genesis: "Look at what the Italians have been able to do with Chrysler!"

Enjoy..

superdenso

About those Crown Vic's. The LS has the tech, but the basics are very similar to the Crown Vic. and if you were in Europe with a Crown Vic you would have to have affluence because they don't come cheap. Easier to buy a used LS. The newer LS460 you revere so highly is near free in the UK. LOL
http://www.carscoops.com/2011/07/for...tors-find.html
http://www.parkers.co.uk/lexus/ls/for-sale/

The CT6 looks good and has commanding proportions without installing an audi-esque grill and uses LED lighting in a stunning fashion/no copy-cat work. Cadillac style is a thing that is part of their pedigree, H.O.S.'s owned them all over the world as well as celebs. It was once inseparable from the "American Dream"; a significant status symbol. Maybe you don't understand but Cadillac is a special product to some of the people who grew up touring in them on vacations
Let's try to keep the discussions reasonable

satiger

iTrader: (1)

Steve - as always nice and informative write-up.

Toyota/Lexus have to wake to remain in completion. They already lost the battle with big German cars when it comes to technology integration. If Koreans were to offer the same as Lexus at $20k less, no brainer.

If one were to ask me, Lexus should stop recycling interior/exterior/technology no more than 3 years. Invest in new technology and integration. Please note original LS400 (project F1) inception cost is $1 billion in 80's value. How much do they allocate/spend in R&D?. Does any one know?.