Gbp

I don't think there's an objective answer to touchscreen vs controller and which is superior. It comes down to personal preference. For me, I like the combination of the buttons and touch screen, and I like the touch screen closer to the driver (and passenger) than the recessed screen with the controller. The buttons and closer touchscreen provide a more direct and efficient user interface for me than the controller does. The closer screen position and view also provides less distraction from the road for me.

However, I like the graphics, information presentation, and some of the features better in the newer generation Lexus navigation systems. Not being able to see the current speed limit on the screen isn't good. When playing music from the radio, the song title and artist scrolling makes it hard to tell where one begins and the other ends, and so on. Also, not having my direction of travel simply display, as in N, NW, etc is inconvenient. I want to have both the map orientation in the current direction of travel and that direction displayed instead of calculating it from wherever North is pointing to!

Johnny Rad

I hear you on the simplicity and straightforward-ness of a touch screen. Then again, wider navi screens set further away from the driver seem to require some sort of an interface. I think the decision to to leave touch screen tech behind is more aesthetically-driven than Lexus' belief that controllers / mice / pointers are better.

From my perspective, I think the 2013+ F-Sport looks great inside and out. Its peerless reliability, quiet ride and top quality materials are strong points. Too bad its power plant output, mpg and handling is severely out-dated IMHO. On a lease, the big BMW appears to solve those issues while offering the intriguing gesture control, multi-function key fob, etc.

Enjoy your cross-country drive and best wishes on your new 7.

CJITTY

After selling my 600 last month, I've been looking for the next vehicle. I'm in love with the 2013 750Li with M Sport package. It has the spacious cabin and all the tech I want. Plus it looks better bone stock than a stock LS by far. And if I understand correctly, BMW offers leasing on their CPO vehicles in are a handful of states including here in GA. That may be an avenue to pursue for me to get a BMW while under warranty but hand it back after the lease with what I would assume to be a cheaper payment then a finance purchase

Helmar

I guess I just don't get it.

While driving somewhere in the southwest, I spot a POI in the distance that looks interesting.

I touch the POI and am presented with it's name, address, distance(time and miles), and phone #.

I touch the phone # to call them to find out if they're open, or even still exist.

That's two touches and less than 5 seconds with minimal distraction from the road. These are things I do frequently on road trips, looking for interesting attractions, the occasional grocery store, etc.

What controller actions would be necessary to accomplish the same task?

SW17LS

All you would do it touch the POI with the cursor on the screen controlled by the mouse...the same action such as clicking on something on your computer with your mouse. You just replace your finger with the mouse cursor. The mouse doesn't just snap to buttons, when you move it it creates a visible cursor on the map you use to scroll the map, click on POIs, etc.

With the screen up high on the dash you can do this with less distraction from the road than looking down at a lower touchscreen.

Note this is just the Lexus RTI, iDrive doesn't work that way.

The new system actually has a mode that has a split screen and lists out all the POIs at each exit along the highway which is kinda cool. I use that on trips.

Helmar

Hmmmm, well based on the comments in this thread (thanks to all posters) I'll be going in for a test drive on Tuesday.

I plan on trying out the nav system to see how close it is to a touch screen. As to the spindle look, well, .......

One other Lexus plus I forgot to mention is that it's not as huge, at least in the SWB version....

HBH

SW17LS

Yeah its pretty much the same nav system that Lexus has had forever, the difference is that you interface with it using a mouse instead of a touchscreen. The 2016 actually has an even more upgraded system than my 2015, you can have a full widescreen map which would be nice for your road trips. The BMW has a full widescreen map too, screen isn't as big though I don't think.

For inputting destinations, you click the keyboard using the mouse just as you do with your finger on your 2008, its not a rotary type input system like you see with BMW or Mercedes. What I do actually is use destination assist. It connects you to a live operator who will input the destination for you and send it to your car. They can also tell you about upcoming restaurants at exits, etc. So I never even use the keyboard really.

But I came from multiple Lexus vehicles with touchscreen nav and this is now my second vehicle with the RTI, and I find them very similar.

Be sure to adjust the sensitivity of the controller before you really get into testing it. On the base settings I found it too sensitive.

I too like the dimensions of the SWB.

This is an RX but the nav is the same:



This is an ES, which doesn't have the big wide screen but in this picture you can see the cursor that comes up on the map when you move the mouse. You simply hover over the POI with that cursor and click, and theres all the info you wanted. You click on the map with the cursor to scroll around, just like you do now with your finger.



BMW and MB have no such cursor.

AKoch

I'm a current F01 750 owner, and just have spent full week in the G12 750 as mine is in service. Besides the sales guy is trying to switch me over to the G12 (2016 the new gen long wheelbase). I'm also a Lexus owner. So I'll chime in.

The 750 is not quiet, by any stretch of imagination. The engine is OK, though noiser than the LS but still acceptable. The road noise isolation was pretty poor in the F01, is actually worse in the new G12. Not entirely unacceptable, but pretty poor. Think Toyota Camry level. But as we age our hearing degrades, may be it will be fine at some point

Yes, the 750 drives fine and is a pleasant car to be in and ride around. The G12 has lighter and less communicative steering, now pretty much on-par with the LS. The F01 has better steering, more communicative and weighted just right.

The G12 750 body is very noticeably lighter than both the LS or F01, it does actually drive more like GS or BMW 5 series.

The electronics is a stronger point in the new G12, I hate touchscreens but they did it right - everything can be accomplished via idrive dial/buttons if you like me don't want any finger prints on the screen. Best of both worlds I think.

The new TFT instrument panel looks cheep, the graphics is rudimentary and does not look nice. It also does not look very nice in bright sunlight. I would rate it as a downgrade from the previous panel.

The HUD is excellent, a must have IMO. Same for the night vision. The radar cruise control is even better than the LS's, the steering assist feature does not work very well (looses the line 40% of the time, you grow not to trust it).

The interior standard is almost is nice as on the current LS. The Individual option gets it to the same level as the current LS, may be better in some ways (more colors, decent merino leather, a bit more customization possible).

So I have had mine for over 4 years now, did not have too many issues with it. Overall happy. But an LS600hl is a considerably better vehicle. The LS460 is a more direct comparison and one can argue one way or another.

So purely IMO, take it as such.

SW17LS

I love my LS but I have to disagree here. The new 7s that I have sat in (I have not driven one) have interiors that are notable steps above the current LS, and an individual level 7 series has an interior that is literally heads and shoulders above the best interior you can get on an LS.

The LS is a very nice vehicle, but I'm disappointed with the base leather quality that I feel is a downgrade from the leather I had in the GS (which was semi-aniline) or even the base leather on the GS (my business partner has an F Sport GS), even the basic leather in the 7 series is significantly better than what is found in the LS, and the merino leathers certainly are. Its not that the LS doesn't have a nice interior, it has a really nice interior, its just been surpassed in this segment IMHO.

As for noise, like I said I have not driven the new 7 but the previous 7 is significantly louder than the LS I agree, and reviews and sound level tests also reflect that. The 7 series is something like 5dB louder at 70MPH cruise than the LS.

Nospinzone

Excellent post Alex, very informative.

I didn't know you could choose between touch screen and controller. That satisfies everybody!

As far as the HUD option. When I first read about this for cars I thought it was a must have for me. Then I drove my friend's Corvette with it and surprisingly I didn't like it at all. However this was several years ago and perhaps it has been improved. I would certainly try it again if I were buying a new car.

AKoch

Well, that's why I said, IMO. Those are my observations. A lot of it can be attributed to the fact that you owned your LS for some time and got used to it, so your reaction is not "fresh" anymore. While the 7 series looks new and exciting to you, a change from your norm. Same happens with me: when I get to the LS from the 7 series my first reaction is "wow" regarding the interior.

The Individual/merino interior is certainly the way to go on the 750. I am waiting to see what is the next LS is going to look like before making a decision. But I may end up with G12 750, and it will certainly be the brown merino interior option. I have this one on my G12 loaner at the moment and it is nice enough to keep me happy for the next 5-6 years.

So if you find the F01 noisier than the LS (I do), the G12 will be even more so. I pretty much described how I feel about the noise levels in the 750, it is one of my biggest issues with the car. If it was fixed I could embrace it much more wholeheartedly. And it is a flaw that I found hard to ignore, never got used to it. The somewhat better handling goes some way to compensate for it but only partially. This is one of the reasons I keep going back to Lexus.

Helmar

It's hard to reconcile these comments with the following quotes about the BMW 750i from the latest Consumer Reports, which I just received today:

"Highs: ... Ride, quietness, seat comfort ..."

"... courtesy of the standard air suspension and a tomb-quiet interior". As I remember they also used "tomb-quiet" in describing the 2008 LS600hL

I'll need to take a test drive of the 2016 LS and another ride in the 2016 750 to check out respective noise levels at 70MPH, an import aspect for long road trips......

HBH

SW17LS

Its not that its loud, its just that its not as quiet as the LS. The only car I've ever driven that I would say is as quiet as the LS is the Mercedes S Class.

I'm a pretty objective person. I look at a lot of cars and enjoy comparing and contrasting them. Materials are on the whole better in the BMW, leather quality is higher, the 7 has real leather on the dash, door panels and console the material in the LS in those areas is synthetic leather. BMW has a leather upper dash, Lexus is molded vinyl unless you have a 600. Lighting is much more custom, dynamic and dramatic in the 7. Styling and "look" is subjective, I'm just talking about the quality of the materials themselves.