Doublebase

^^^This!!

Yup, you can't furnish a dealership with bear skin rugs, granite, mahogany and private chefs by charging mom and pop prices. So do what everybody else does...take it some where reasonable or learn to work on cars

Dryrunner

iTrader: (1)

$269 represents 0.38% of the purchase price of your car.
Do you also find the cheapest Dentist and ask him to use a rusty drill or tin instead of silver. Maybe just put braces on half your kids teeth?

Lord, you folks are cheap.

CRowe14

Cheap??
For something that can be done for under $50???
So where are the boundaries of the "cost of a dealership" line crossed when speaking about repairs?

Is it $800+ for a brake job?
$700-$900 for a water pump?
Obviously not $270 to simply drain some fluid and refill it...that's just insane to NOT let a dealer rip you off, right??
Its often not as simple as someone being "cheap".
There the element of one simply having a desire to know more about their vehicle.
The ideal that, God forbid, someone may not have the money to spend nearly $300 for someone else to simply drain oil from a cavity, but they can spend $50 to do it themselves and spend the other $120 on something else, or even better, keep it in your pocket!
Its the same rationale behind just about anything DIY!
Why do you think the advent of DIY, especially regarding home improvement has become such a huge market, that there are countless shows on television to help you do something as simple as change a water faucet, sand and restain a table, or install crown molding!
Its about wanting to learn.
Its about having that rewarding feeling of doing it yourself and obtaining confidence to do other things.
Its about saving money.
And for people who have a solid background in repair/improvement, its then a matter of assuring its done correctly.
Depending on the situation, it just makes more sense to do certain things yourself, if your able.

zeyger

Amen. Growing up in a mechanic shop and witnessing the countless dealership nightmares for shoddy work and overcharging is the cherry on top for me. DIY or trusted mechanic for me.

Having a Dentist with a flashy office and a diamond laced drill doesn't mean the Dentist has competency.

SW17LS

This line of thinking makes no sense.

Think about it this way, would you use two dentists that are equally as good, and pay twice as much for one because his office has a nicer waiting room? Thats what we're talking about here.

Here's another question, would you pay twice as much to the dentist with the nicer waiting room if you knew the cheaper dentist was actually....better?

I will defend the position all day that my independent mechanic does a better job, and treats my cars better than the dealership. He's a Lexus certified master tech, uses all OEM parts and fluids, I know who is working on the car. I know how they treat my cars (I've had cars damaged at Lexus dealers numerous times).

Should I pay more for what I know to be less careful and courteous service, because the waiting room is nicer and "its Lexus"?

Its not about being cheap. if I was getting something that was truly better I would pay. Anyways, all us LS owners are in reality just "too cheap" to buy MB S Classes aren't we?

dal20402

This... My independent mechanic has been working on Toyotas for three decades, everything from LS460s to bat$#!+ modified AE86es. He's got a fantastic reputation among a customer base that is mostly made up of hard-core car people. After having him do control arms and a few other little things on my '08 it drives better than any of the new cars I've bought. Would I really prefer an unknown Lexus dealer tech to that pedigree? I might get a tech who's just as good, or I might get one who's going to get fired the next week.

I'm not too cheap to buy an S-Class, but I'm definitely too cheap to pay to maintain it!

Unsober1

Amen brother !!!!

CRowe14

"Its not about being cheap. if I was getting something that was truly better I would pay.

Couldn't agree more.


"Anyways, all us LS owners are in reality just "too cheap" to buy MB S Classes aren't we?"

Or, as others have said to me in the past or feel/think about Lexus, the fact that we are simple minded enough to think we are actually driving a quality luxury vehicle and not a "re-badged" Toyota.

I was actually just told earlier today:

"Your car is pretty nice, especially for an older model. Never really gave much attention to this model. I don't see it much. How much are these brand new?"

I replied:
"Anywhere from about 70k to 90k. They also have an LS600 that's a hybrid model that can be north of 110k".

He replies:
"For a damn TOYOTA AVALON! YOU GOTTA BE KIDDING ME!!!"

dlbuckls10

There's nothing wrong with saving money on auto repairs as long the repairs are done right and you are satisfied, whether you DIY or a independent shop. Automobile dealerships aren't known for reasonable repair prices. Cheap are those Lexus owners who never have anything checked or no routine maintenance done but complains when repairs are needed. You'll see more Lexus, BMW, MB S-class, Audi, Escalades, etc at McDonalds than Starbucks. Lexus the pursuit of perfection. Each to their own.

Doublebase

I think there's a big difference between being cheap...and being blatantly stupid.

Devh

Toyota carries a negative stigma to those that don't really understand. I see Toyota as a company like Sony which has a wide range of products from the budget consumer all the way to their high end what was once called their ES series and then their Qualia brand which is akin to Lexus.
The Toyoda story is one of prestige and the LS is the car of Japanese Royalty and a car for their heads of state. I also think their Century line of luxury automobiles is divine and it would be something to see if they brought that car here in limited numbers.

Devh

I have seen more wealthy people argue over being overcharged and behaving cheap compared to those financed their car like a mortgage.

Vansibel

I am by no mean cheap and willing to pay the dealer premium, but I do expect a better service and repair than any average independent... but so far as other said I have failed to see from past experience this philosophy expanding from the desk to the shop. When I got to Lexus to service my car I expect that they know the car better than your average mechanic, are used to work on them, have tools specific for their models, follow headquarter procedure for a repair and are careful not to damage your car. As some may have know my past experience at the dealer have been pretty dreadful, at least here in Quebec. Just a few week ago I have been to the last dealer I haven't tried yet in my area for a 5k rear suspension job from my own pocket and when the car was returned to me the trim part from the rear pillar were hanging down and not attached correctly, pillars had grease and dirt all over them, rear console was still open with the two headsets just thrown on the seat, rear driver seat missed the seat belt assembly and the car haven't been wash. Just when they were ready to cash in a 5k bill... And it doesn't stop there. The guy actually told me that his technician had to remove the shocks using his torch and he damaged the link kit. Apparently he said that replacing them had to come from my own pocket. I looked at him and said no. So he agree to handle the labor and I'll pay only 200$ for 2 new link kit. I also told them before the repair that I wanted to keep the old shock parts as the left one was still good but since they used a torch to remove them the top steel ring have been cut and both the old shock are not usable anymore. I also noticed that the suspension haven't been adjusted evenly so my car look like it's on sport on the rear and comfort on the front... it really look silly as if my car have been slammed on the rear only. Service rep tell me that the suspension is adjusted automatically with the actuator and that there is no manual adjustments. The thing is, I have access to the workshop manual BY LEXUS used by their technicians and it clearly state that there is a step for shock replacement that require manual adjustment of the suspension. So I showed it to him the detailed step and he said yeah, it does look like the suspension can be adjusted. I swear I'm not making this up... There is also a step after toe-in involving manual adjustment of the object recognition camera and the headlight which probably haven't been done either. As I was getting to my car after they took my car in to install the missing seatbelt I could hear the regular tech said that the master tech did my car on overtime before leaving... I'm suppose to get my car back today for the replaced link kit and suspension adjustment. And this dealer is actually the best I've dealt with so far because the service rep actually listened and agreed to take my car back to check the suspension. That goes to show how far headquarter lost control over the situation over there. I can only imagine the number of old folks without car knowledge letting the dealer get away with this kind of things.

As for the ls being a cheaper version of the s-class, this would only be true if the s-class was better in every way, which is not. First one being reliability, the most ommited car characteristic in passionate car review. If the ls stop being reliable then there is not much left in my opinion to choose it over the s-class. Toyota makes reliable car, that's been their buisness case for ages. Maybe the new generation will get moved by the new emotionally charged Lexus commercial, but I think the 2007-1012 generation of buyer were mostly pragmatic and choose the ls over it's competitor for it's Toyota DNA, which imply quality and reliability. That may shift if the new generation feel artsy in the new lineup and connect with the current marketing, as Lexus might be able to get away in a decline of the quality of their car if people are buying them more with their hearth like bmw. The suspension are a weak point on the current ls car, but when I look at the girlfriend brand new ml63 amg dashboard lighting like a Christmas tree after a carwash I go back hugging the ls. The s-class look like a damn good car, but the LS is more inline with certain peoples criteria. LS don't have Mercedes heritage, but clever people know heritage don't make a better car, at least on a mechanical point of view. To each on his own, I for one know how to differentiate the marketing from the product. I don't feel like I need to prove anything or educate Mercedes fanboy, I also like discretion. If all they appear as the ignorant ones for belittle a brand backed up by the most successful car company in the world. I think the we'll see more of this generation of fanboys even at Lexus being emotionally swallowed by those new Lexus "cool and hip" commercials. Those peoples feed the ongoing video game consoles war and repeat for cars. And marketing take advantage of this phenomena where people get emotionally attached to a brand. There is nothing cool being a by-product of the marketing machina, peoples look more clever when they actually know what they are talking about.

SW17LS

You guys are taking what I said too literally. It was more a jab at the guy who called all of us cheap.

CRowe14

I understand your statement completely!
Hey, call me cheap or whatever fits...
Even if I had the money to blow, I honestly still couldn't justify spending so much for repairs simply to drive a MB.
Without a question though: Beautiful cars!