Wilson1046

I'm a rare poster and initially joined when I was doing homework before I bought. Forgive me if this is a bit winded I'm just trying to figure out what's next for my car.
This is my first Lexus and a big thanks to this forum and its members for all the information I obtained before I bought, I wound up purchasing my 2008 LS460 with 38K miles on it approximately 3 years ago. This car was rear ended when new, but repair work was solid, I knew going in I may have issues as a result regardless but negotiated the price appropriately.
I was a former owner of 2 Camry's a 1992 Camry Wagon and a 2006 Camry LE. I am a very big fan of Toyota from the reliability aspect. I have a few qualms about Toyota in certain areas, mostly design but I admire Toyota build quality.
With the LS I expected of course more maintenance and repair, more bells and whistles more to upkeep. I was fine with that aspect as I wasn't looking for a Camry I wanted the pampering of the flagship LS, and was willing to pay the premium for it.
I honestly wanted a 2006 LS 430 as I like the styling more but bordering on 10 years old at the time I thought better to get the next generation as it made leaps.
I love my car, and it has spoiled me in quite a few ways, standard road noise is a thing of the past, 380 hp/367lb torque was an absolute perfect tune for a car this heavy. The power to weight ratio on the car is almost perfect, from a safety aspect I always considered that a big point. You have to get out of an intersection in a hurry, you want to hit the throttle and go and this car gets it done. More than easy highway passing, great on ramp acceleration from a nice smooth powerband and for years one of my biggest mechanical gripes was Toyota didnt know how to make a good automatic, the 8-Speed transmission on this car is the only auto I have ever driven that I would truly prefer over a manual, it truly is an engineering work of art.
That being said I'm sad to say I'm disappointed in the build quality of the car to date on repairs and am starting to regret my purchase a bit. After 3 years I have put 35K on my car and it seems I've been hit by almost every "exception". Again more bells and whistles more repair, that I was prepared for, as well as maybe a few gremlins coming from the rear from a previous accident. What I didn't expect was multiple repairs on a 3 year old vehicle that were the result of poor design and quality control issues.
I live in South Florida, and suffered the melting dash problem along with melting door panels, glove compartment, pretty much every interior piece with the exception of seats and hard plastic. After 2 years JM Lexus finally replaced 80% under good will. But the dash piece around the gauge cluster and the center console between the seats was denied for whatever reason.
Water pump gave out at 40K, so that and radiator replacement.
Starter at 45K
I have yet to address the wind noise but it is there, I suspect the triangle trim on drivers side but now the passenger side is acting up so that's all I hear at highway speed now. When you go from living room quiet to whistling you cant help but notice.
I just did the brake actuator which is costly as hell and now I get phantom vibration and noise from the brake pedal even when at a dead stop waiting on a light. Tried searching forum but hard to find threads on after replacement (Under warranty still but, still more time wasted when I bring in next week)
Drivers side weather trim caught by power window, replaced at $300 ok no big deal.
Discs, pads and tires, at 20K intervals, heavy car and I drive I-95 daily so no problem comes with the territory.
I have an odd squeaking vibration from suspension and now I'm starting to worry about control arms and that fun cheap fix.
And the most recent, I'm getting howling wind and air noise while at highway speeds, the 3M tape is peeling off the inserts over the doors near the roof. Cheap fix but really?
I'm almost done with this car, and as titled I'm frustrated as hell. I saved for 2 years to buy this car outright and my next move is to add up the maintenance and repair bills. I'm positive I'm 7K-9K in.
I know the first few years of the LS460 were seen as a little problematic but it just keeps adding up on a list of things I would never expect from Toyota, never mind a near $70,000 flagship. And I'd love to hear from previous LS430 owners who went to the 460. I've read a few that were very happy but they seem a little dated.
Do I trade into a 2010-2012 model hoping the hiccups were ironed out? Is it too late to get a 2006 LS430 and not expect to repaint in a year or two? Do I dismiss Lexus at this point as a brand that went past it's peak with reliability? I know the BMW and Mercedes comparisons as far as reliability that WHY I bought my Lexus with confidence. I'm starting to have doubts though. Appreciate other owners opinions at this point because I'm fed up.

Thanks

Will

Wilson1046

I appreciate the response but I'm not looking at the facelift 2013, not a fan of the new styling

Wilson1046

Ill go further and say avoid the first two years of a "facelift" car, they have new problems that the previous didn't

Wilson1046

No disrespect, but you test drove a 430, said it was better than a 460 and then recommend talk to my dealer to trade in to a 2013+?
Ill admit Im drunk at 3am while typing this but, really?

texas008

all 8 control arms can be replaced using aftermarket parts and indy shop for ~ $1,100.
another big ticket item would be brake actuators.

ShaneAlan

FatherTo1

Will, I think mrkitty is alluding to the 2013-2017 LS 460 has fixed most of the issues that plagued 2007-2012 LS 460s. If reliability is paramount them I concur that you'll probably be happier in a 2004-2006 LS 430, and without having to pay more for a newer LS.

Keep in mind, I just found the source of a coolant leak in both our 2006 LS 430 and 2013 LS 460. That said, I have had less issues with the 430 (1 item) than 460 (coolant plus 3 small items). I still prefer the 2013 LS 460 over the 2006 430 though. Toyota/Lexus is still reliable but they don't build them like they used to anymore and I don't consider the brand as bulletproof as before.

The market has plenty of 2007-2008 for sale. I see this as an indication that owners of these years don't hold onto their LS like later years...possibly due to too many recurring issues?? Unfortunately, the I believe the melting dash and door panels can affect 2007-2012, that is why I'd agree with @mrkitty and go to either the 2004-2006 LS 430 or 2013+ LS 460. It does appear control arm issues were worked out on the mid-2010-2012 model years. Good luck to you and sorry you experienced so many issues unbefitting of Lexus' flagship.

JLAWS

I'd be curious to know what the service history was for the 1st owner. It may have been pretty reliable to them. I think people really need to ask themselves SHOULD they really be buying used luxury car with no warranty or a newer car with a warranty. My budget when I got my 2008 LS460 nearly 2 years ago was $18K. That budget would have gotten me a newer non luxury practical car/suv all day with a certified pre owned warranty. But I knew I would be miserable with it and went for the LS460 with 90K miles on it for $16K. I have a good sized 2 car garage and a collection of tools over the years to do my own repairs. I also have a connection with a few certified mechanics that can do the labor for me for a fraction of the cost of the dealer. I estimate that I have done about $3,000 in labor cost myself. Majority of the repairs were me just swapping out parts due to age and not due to failure. The mandatory fixes I did were, replacing the radiator ($180 part and fluids) , trunk lock motor (new $300), and 4 upper control arms ($170 parts) that showed stress cracks in bushings and Hid bulbs ($180 Phillips hid) belt tensioner, serpentine belt and pulley $100) I had a rear door that would not open. I was able to fix it by taking the door panel off and push down on the release lever to open the door, The latch needed to be cleaned an re lubricated. Imagine what the cost would have been if I got all of these done at the Lexus dealership!!

The one thing I fault Lexus for putting in the LS460 is the weak dash and door panel handles that can fail in hot climate states. I fortunately have Comfort plus package and have leather stitched handles which will not fail. 2013+ all have it now. My dash as not failed me yet. I put up a sunshade when park for long duration in the Summer months. I've always done this to every car I have owned. At least Lexus is willing to pay for most of the cost for most customers even after nearly 10 years out.

There was no guarantee that getting that LS430 wouldn't have given you the same level of problems. First off you'd have to budget for a $1200 to $1500 timing belt job every 100K miles or every 6 to 8 years. If that timing belt ever failed then you'd need a new engine. The door lock actuators are notorious for failing and cost hundreds to fix PER DOOR. The serpentine belts squeals like crazy on 2 LS460 I've owned. Door window seals squeaks. Mark Levinson amp & Subwoofer fails.

So far I have NO regrets with my LS460. Ownership experience has been great so far. If I was not mechanically inclined and could not do any work then it I may have had some regrets. Sorry that it is not working out for you. I would try to private sale it to get the maximum value if you no longer want to deal with any upcoming "issues"

SW17LS

Just to clarify...your vehicle is 10 years old, at no time during your ownership was it 3 years old. You owned it for 3 years, but somebody else owned it for 7, and in those 7 years it was only driven 5k miles per year, the rest of the time it sat in the S FL heat. Its not a new car, and even with low miles age comes into play here. Starter? Thats not an uncommon repair for a car, and is very common on all years of the LS, its an expensive job on the LS. Items like water pumps, trim materials, suspension bushings and such (your squeaking) all of these things are items that wear with time. As you said, you live in S Florida, one of the most time-unfriendly climates in the US when it comes to degradation of those sorts of items.

Brake actuator...well that's well documented, and it sounds like it may have been under warranty? Wind noise...well documented. Dash melting...well documented and Lexus covered 80% of it.

And on top of that...the car was hit from behind before you bought it.

I think you'd be hard pressed to find a 10 year old S Florida car that has sat more than its been driven in its life, and has been hit and repaired that would be better built and more reliable.

The repairs you've mentioned on a car as old as yours don't sound out of line to me...go to an LS430, a car thats even older? That makes zero sense. Nothing lasts forever.

Wilson1046

Thanks all for the feedback.
JLAWS, I checked the VIN before buying on Lexus site, regular dealership intervals after it was sold with a regular maintenance history, no red flags other than accident on lot. Starter replacement twice, 2 or 3 batteries, 2 recall issues, and complaints of the melting dash dates were consistent all the way up to trade in and me buying a year later. That being said you bring up an interesting point, I took a chance on a luxury vehicle without the option of a CPO or extended warranty option, won't make that mistake again, too much can go wrong. But honestly the L on the grill was enough for me, I know the rep for the previous LS models, and figured yep why not. I am a "shadetree mechanic" but unfortunately live in a condo, so not having a private garage seriously limits any ability at self repair other than basics that don't require jackstands.
SW17LS, gotta love the internet, but point taken, so forgive the typo. In context I thought I was a little more clear on where I was coming from, but mistakes happen.
To clarify, I know and understand that my vehicle is 10 years old, and did not mean to imply it was 3 years old, at 3am with a few scotches hey I goofed but, good call out. I understand the issues I am frustrated about are well documented, the point I was trying to make essentially was I expected more from this car then what I got. It could be bad luck, the initial accident, the climate, too high expectations, or maybe a declining build quality on the brand. Maybe all? Maybe none, but please don't assume I expected this car to be flawless and am simply griping at the cost of maintaining a luxury vehicle with an accident history. I don't consider this car to be even in the same class as any other, it far surpasses the so called competition from Germany in every aspect.
As I said I'm frustrated and wanted feedback and I got what I wanted to help make a decision for the future. Thanks again to those who replied

jrmckinley

I transitioned from a bullet proof 2004 LS430 to a 2010 LS460. I owned the 2004 for 8 years and drove it from 70k miles to 250k miles. Here are my thoughts.

• If you like the look of the 2004 to 2006 430 more than the 460, get the LS 430. At the end of the day, you want to like what you drive.
• I see you're in FL - plenty of LS's to choose from down here that have lived a pretty good life. Not sure where you are in FL, but the Lexus dealership (Wilde) in Sarasota gets some awesome cars from the Naples & Sarasota area and I'd recommend keeping an eye on their inventory.
• I'd avoid 2004 and would try to find a 2005 or ideally a 2006. The early 2004's had some transmission shifting issues that you can avoid by going later in the model year.
• I think to find a good 2005 or 2006 with somewhere around 100k miles (8k miles/year, so slightly less than the average person drives) you're probably going to spend somewhere in the range of $10k to $12k. While that seems a bit high for a 13 year old car, it's probably about $10k to $12k less than what you'd pay for a 2011 or 2012 (a 2012 is really what you want to avoid issues).
• You're going to give up some technology but there are things like streaming bluetooth that you can add easily for a few hundred dollars (I put streaming BT in my 2004).
• Just know you're getting an old car and some things are going to start failing eventually. I'd mentally set aside about $1k for some potential failures like window actuators, door lock actuators, etc. Both of those went bad on my 2004 (somewhere around the 200k mark).
• The 430 has a timing belt so that needs to be inspected and potentially changed every 90k miles. Doing that and the water pump is about a $1,200 repair. I'd try to find a 430 that documents this being done in the last 1-2 years.
• I would highly recommend a very intense pre-purchase inspection and see if you can find a car that doesn't need any type of control arm or bushing repair as you know that's going to be costly and those components just start wearing out with age.
• The engine on the 430 is tank-like in reliability and is a more quiet and refined engine than the 460.

In summary, if you like the 430 more than the 460, get it. I loved the 430 and really enjoyed racking up the miles in it. I chose to move to the 460 because I like the more modern styling and personally have no regrets, but there are certain things I still love and miss about that 430.

R Z

As an 08 owner who has had the car going on 5 years, I've not had the majority of your issues. My biggest gripe is the sticky interior and I have a cracked driver's armrest. Lexus refused to work with me in replacing the interior, although they accepted fault with the 2007's which makes no sense for the owner. Makes plenty of sense for Lexus: Dollars and cents.

Probably the big difference in the cars is mine stays garaged most of the time and it's not driven nearly as much as yours(had 51K or so when I got it, has 72K now). But when I'm out and about and the sun is shining, you can rest assured, the interior is sticky. That part sux for sure. But not a deal breaker. Not noticed an issue with anything else you mention. For me a transition into a 2013 - 2015 is real possibility. Could be sooner than later. Not sure at the present time, but if the right deal came a long, I'd consider it.

You've given two options. The 2006 LS430 or and 2011-2012. I had the 05 and while it was nice, I never loved it. It did absolutely nothing for me personally. My neighbor has a 2011. He loves it. Has had no issues at all. I've asked him about all the complaints and he told me no sticky dash and he just had control arms checked and they were fine. With all that said, this is your decision. So whether it be an 06 or a 12, choose what will fit your budget and make you happy. Best of luck.

SW17LS

Wilson1046

Man this is great definitely great info, thanks again guys

Wilson1046

Sw17 "We have people who come in here and expect that because “it’s a Lexus” they can buy one 10+ years old and never have any issues and that’s just not reality."
To clarify I'm writing about a car that I bought just shy of 7 years old not 10, and thought I made clear what the thread was about.
All good though, sometimes dicks have to be dicks, so keep on truckin'