gatorcb

Seems like a no brainer...do I take some scratches, wind noise, etc. or a cadillac that has much a greater risk of mechanical failure and a resale value that is pitiful. Cheaper solution is to have a good lexus dealership fix the issues

garyr

I would do the Caddy.....it's just as fast if not faster and the stereo is as good if not better. I'll tell you what, it's defiantly quieter......and a whole lot less.

My wind noise is only 70% better and still louder than any other car I've owned. You couple in all the lock out features and it's getting me to look as well. I never thought Lexus would make such a bad flagship with basic problems they should never have. I'm on my second "B" pillar and that one is now trashed and I can hear noises out side the car like the window is open.

The best solution Lex can come up with is give me 3 free oil changes, like I really give a heck. Just fix the windnoise............

None of the auto makers can maintain the best car rating forever. Lex is on the down slide. Making more cars than they can quality control, thats not uncommon at all in the auto business.

Nospinzone

I think its just the luck of the draw that a few people get a poorly manufactured car, aka a lemon. The best thing you can do is bail on it and hope the next one is better.

When the Jag S-Type came out my wife was absolutely in love with it and had to have it. I hated to buy it because owners were having all kinds of problems. I bought a new 2001 and it was flawless. To this day I've had only one repair (the coolant reservoir cracked and had to be replaced, $100 that's it).

Like my Dad used to say, just hope you don't buy a car that was built on a Monday!

vraa

iTrader: (2)

It was great reading your posts and I'm glad that you're getting rid of your car. I don't think I could ever deal with a horrible dealer!

Have you written a letter to Lexus USA / Lexus Japan? They would be very upset to hear this kind of crap being dumped on you from a dealer. It's against what the intention of Lexus is and their claims in "The Lexus Story"

Mallory H.

I think the DTS has a little more engine noise but the wind noise that you can get with the least amount of wind with the LS460 I could not detect with the DTS. The bose surround sound system is not bad and I could hear a better balance front and rear. The DTS does not have the pick up that the LS460 has but it can get the job done.I would loose the push button start,rear view camera,brake hold,auto level lights,light cleaner and 8
speed transmission but would gain no wind noise,ON Star,heated washer fluid,remote start,power massaging seats,mirrors w/turn signal and laminated glass all windows and of course I will be getting back money. I would be using the things that I would be gaining more than I use the features that I would be loosing. Thank you for your imput as I have been following all of your post. Best regards and Good Luck to you. You are so right you can not
stay on the top if you make all the wrong moves and I think the LS460 is going to be the fall of Lexus if they do not make some quick moves.
I am still in the decision making process until tomorrow. I can also buy the DTS at emlpoyee discount.

Helmar

Amen to that. My '03 LS430 was as terrific and trouble free as my '99 LS400. The BMW I traded it in for was in the shop 4 times the first year.

After 2 weeks, my LS600hL exhibits no wind noise, rattles, or poorly painted parts. Everything's as perfect as my previous 2 LS's.

I haven't seen any issues about the LS600hL mentioned here yet.

I guess that the Lexus reputation doesn't GUARANTEE a trouble free car, it just substantially increases your chances of one.

HBH

Big Jimm

As we all know, no car is perfect. I agree with some of the posts and some I don’t. I had an 01 and 06 DTS. No problem with either. Very quiet.

I had been thinking about Lexus ever since the 460’s came out. And was within a
hair of buying one. But, at 10,000 less, I decided to buy an ‘08 MB E-350 Sport.
Test driving both, I decided that I liked the “snappy” way the MB handled. (I still
have a C6 so I lean toward that “type” of handling.)

BUT ... I really DID like the Lexus. And, I DO trade cars OFTEN. I plan to keep the E-350 for 2 years. Then, it’s a whole new ball game all over again. I am definitely not married to ANY make!

I LOVE the Lexus electronics and interiors. I HATE the old fashion MB electronics!
Especially the Nav which is about 12 years behind EVERYBODY! It IS very quiet,
however. No wind noise.

I believe it’s normal that often we let ONE aggravation grow and grow and grow.
I’ve done this to my own detriment. In the MB forums, a high percentage of the
die-hard MB addicts insist that we should forget about how far behind MB is on
ALL its electronics (plus other things) and just keep saying to ourselves that
“nothing handles like a Benz.” Well, they do handle good. But, I believe that
today MANY cars “handle good.”

For ME, the newest hi-tech stuff is of extreme importance! And, will be a BIG
factor in my next purchase. (No more OLD Navs that just take you to the
“general area.”)

By the way, I’ve had a few problems with the E-350 since I got it in June: Came
with the steering way out of alignment and last week the EPS went out. Part has
been ordered.

Last thing: As most Lexus people (I’m sure) love to mention, MB has had a little
“reliability problem.” It seems that one way MB is attempting to “move up” from
this problem, is to discontinue some of the options that came with the previous
models. (Like turn-down mirror in reverse, etc.) If it’s not there, it can’t cause
a problem.

Overall the E-350 is a good car. But, maybe in 2 years I’ll like the Lexus better.
The DTS is a good car. But, in practical terms, you might be better off to keep
the 460 and lick the problem(s). Frustrating choice.

Big Jimm

Mallory H.

I'll check back with you in 2 months. Most LS460 owners did not hear the wind noise unti 2 or 3 weeks after ownership and some later than that and than the reports of rattles and ill fitting glove boxes begain to surface.
If you have no problems than I am glad for you but put yourself in the posisition of those of us who do and the few and the numbers are growing of those who have already bailed out. What really got my goat was the attitude of the Lexus Rep I talked to at the dealership. I do not need Lexus and I owe Lexus nothing and I am quite sure Lexus feels the same about me but all it takes is the loss of a few customers and the Lexus name will not be worth
the paper it is written on. This post just pushed me one step closer to bailing out.

Big Jimm

Well, I have to admit that Mallory’s post is probably close to exactly how I
would feel if it were me. I am NOT patient and have LITTLE sympathy for
endless problems and excuses.

Above, I was very candid with my MB negative assesment. BUT, I can’t
help but remember that with all 3 of the Lexus dealers I visited, when I
told them I was thinking about a MB, they quickly showed me a BIG CHART
on their wall comparing “Lexus Reliability” to MB’s horrible reliability tests!
Thereafter, “Lexus Reliability” dominated 80% of the conversation.

So, maybe (just a little) the chickens have come home to roost.

Big Jimm

carfanmd

Before jumping into a Caddy I would work with Lexus to resolve your problems. Let's say your car is not satisfactory to you, tell them and I believe they will fix it. Arbitration or not they put customers first and will probably find something in their line that makes you happy. Maybe a GX, new LX or another LS. I am not happy with mine right now either but I would never leave Lexus for another brand. Every time I do I realize how Lexus is the top of customer service and care. That is my opinion. While problems are frustrating in any car at least Lexus is taking it seriously. I have had other brands (I won't name names) but the cars were in the shop week after week. Worse still is the mfg did not care and it took weeks to get a service appointment. With Lexus you call and you're in and that is that. Let's keep this all in perspective. My only point is you think the grass is greener but it is not. What we have here is a car that is working out its kinks and I'd let Lexus help you resolve the problem before you make a decision to go elsewhere. My belief is if you work with them they will work with you. In all my Lexus years (going back to the start) I have had only 2 cars with issues and they were all noise related as opposed to mechanical. My wind noise is fixed but I don't know yet about the rattles. I will let you know soon as they just finished a major rework. If I'm not happy I will deal with CA and either they replace the care or we move to another model. Nothing more or less. Good luck and tell us what happens.

Mallory H.

My car is my fact and if I purchased a Lexus I can afford to buy anything out there I want. I have bent over backwards to give my dealership and Lexus ample time to repair my car. You have no idea what you are talking about have you even seen the number of these cars that are being traded in. The only thing going on is Lexus not living up to its standards of old. Engineers put it on paper but it takes a craftsman to bring it into reality.

Gojirra99

Lets not argue too much about this, even with similar issues, every individual do not have the same experience, some have better dealers that have done a better job & handle the situation better.
Mallory already acknowleged most of the wind noise issues are fixed, but he has the bad luck in having other issues like the damaged interior trims during the fix & the repeated mistakes on his glove box etc., that may sour his whole experience much more than others. I know there are others that are completely satisfied with the fix, that's good for them. So let's just let each individual handle the situation the way that they think is best for them.
Even at the factory, even with the best quality control in the world, not every car they manufacture will be exactly as well built as the other, there will always be some that are more imperfect than others.

Maurice

Well, here is another IMO that agrees with Mallory.
I have owned several trouble free Lexus cars dating back to an 92 LS400.
My LS460 is the first LS that is not trouble free - it has been back to the dealer a few times. The wind noise is a big problem, and IMO is a design problem. The fix mitigates but does not resolve the problem. IMO I feel Lexus is trying to spin control the issue by lowering expectations. The response from Lexus in my case has been disappointing.

I also noticed, IMO, that the craftsmanship of my '07 LS is not as good as the one in my '04 LS430.

I think the LS460 is a marvel in many ways. But had I been fully aware on the wind noise problem, I would have not purchased it. This was not apparent when I test drove the car and I just blindly and mistakenly went by my past 15 year experience as a Lexus owner.

dfiorito

Just wanted to put my 2 cents in.

I love the car and the wind noise is minamal at most. I usually listen to music, or my wife. They are both loud and usually block out the noise.

IMO most of what Mallory is mad about is the screw up of the dealer's work. If Mallory is not willing to go to corporate Lexus, or travel 45 to 110 miles to fix what his dealer broke, then Mallory needs to go to Cadillac or whoever else he THINKS will give him a better car.

IMO

GS3Tek

iTrader: (8)

How were you treated by the dealership with your previous cadillac?
Are you thinking of going back to that same dealer?

If you think you'll be happy with a different car and the dealer is willing is work with you and provide good service, why not?