I8ABMR

I wonder if there will be rattles with these aftermarket set ups. I am surprised at how the designers have created a set up for the ML system to where you can go insanely loud with no rattles or vibration of the interior . Amazing.

Silver460

Hey guys. New on the forum here. Thanks for all the infos and inspiration. I'm also looking to do mine very shortly here. I'd like to get an answer for the above question as well.

Cmasten and Kattawar, do you experience any rattling with your setup?

Marky2mark, how much more punch would you say your new system has compared to the stock system?

It's been quite a while since I had a custom aftermarket system. In my teenage years I had 2 12" L7s with Kappa components in my Integra and LOVED every minute of it. I spent 2 days Dynamating every single inch that I could to keep the rattle down... but those L7's were brutal! Now I'm approaching 30 and L7's are definitely not something I'm looking for. I just want a clean solid punch to accurately image the intended sound that is all.

I've had ML in a lauch edition IS350 and did not think too much of it. After the IS I went German for a few years, all the cars had premium audio so I never had to tinker with them. Now, going back to Lexus, i jumped on a great deal and forgot about the system... big mistake! It is just sad to have to sit in traffic with the noise coming out of these cones... I'm no audiophile, and I'm also far from a sound expert, but the stock "premium" system is worst than what some econobox come standard with. I bought the LS for daily driving but ended up still driving the German b/c of the system (albeit not that great) and for the usable nav/iPod interface.

So I went to an audio shop in Irvine based on a few recommendations here on CL and also on Yelp. I'm not sure what the forum policy regarding this so I'll just withheld the biz name until asked. The gentleman there seemed very upfront and knowledgeable without sounding too "sale-sy" (if that's even a word). I'd like to get you guys' feedback on the the below if possible. My goal is clear sound quality with just enough punch to satisfy my inner child and a clean iPod integration.

I went in there asking for the Focal Access components and were recommended the Polyglass components. He said the Access are great, but there's still room for improvements and if I get the Polyglass, I won't be disappointed. I was quoted $800 for these... I've seen them on the auction site for $650 shipped, but I hate bargaining and I know these guys need to make money or they may not do a good job... so i'm debating if I should haggle them on it or not...

I was advised to leave the center channel and rear speakers stock running off the stock amp. He stated they are only use for fillers and I really don't need to upgrade them. I'm not a fan of mixing speakers (or mixing anything) so I was thinking of swapping them out for a set of Access coaxials or even the Polyglass coaxials. The Access set is only $150 but if getting it wouldn't make that much of a difference then I would rather just spend that $150 for something else. But if I get the Access set, I might as well spend a few more dollars on the Polyglass set... oh it never ends...

Something new that I learned when talking about amps with the guy is that Class D amps aren't "as good" as your normal class A/B amp as far as sound quality. I'm not sure the accuracy of this, and he explained it to me but it just all went over my head. I asked for the JL 700w class D 5ch amp and was recommended getting Arc KS125.2 ($189) for the sub and KS125.4 ($299) for the components. I was not sure if he recommended these due to a larger profit margin over the JL unit or if he really made the correct recommendation.

One more thing about the amp and not mixing things. Do you think I should get Focal amps for the Focal components or will the Arc amps do fine if not better? I think the Focal amps are just a bit more expensive but I really don't mind it.

Signals - I originally had the LC8i in mind but he recommended the new LCQ that is coming out that's basically the same thing with an EQ. It's twice as expensive as the LC8i at $300.

On to the sub. I really want to keep this as stock looking as possible (you never know when you will need trunk space) so I originally wanted to just replace the stock 8" with the JL W1 unit. He stated "yeah, the JL 8" free air is good, and it's what we use to replace blown stock units for BMWs and Mercedes, but just don't expect to be amazed. You need an enclosure for sub, otherwise they won't sound good." This guy sure knows how to sell without really selling. So now I'm torn between getting a box with a 10" or just sticking with the 8" in the factory location. I think I'm going to go with the 8" for now and if it's still terrible then I'll just go with the box afterwards since the JL 8" sub is only $89. I can go with a simple hatch box for $75 in the far end of the trunk, or a custom fiberglass box on the left corner of the trunk for $350... your thoughts? Should I do it once & do it right? Does anyone know when 4080 will come out with an enclosure for the LS460?

With regards to iPod integration. I am still in debate on which unit to get... The SL2iC sounds the most appealing at the moment with the updated GUI and motion override, but it doesn't have streaming bluetooth, while the Dice unit has streaming bluetooth but I don't see too many people using it and no motion override. I plan to do the speed sensor/parking brake switch if I go this route. Thoughts?

Thanks for viewing guys and I look forward to your feedback. Below is the laundry list just to recap:

Focal 165VR3 - $800
KS125.2 - $189
KS125.4 - $299
LCQ-1 - $299
JL 8W1V2 - $89

Still unsure:
Dice MediaBridge - $275 or Vaistech SL2iC - $369
Custom fiberflass enclosure with JL 10W1V2 - $350 + $100
Focal 100CA1 - $165 or Focal 100CVX $210

Thanks in advance guys.

cmasten

I can chip at some of this, it may take a few responses to cover it all.

No rattling in mine at all, they installed it as solid as factory, in some cases, like the front mid-bass even more solid as they had to built out an enclosure for the front doors. The Sub in the trunk is in its own fiberglass enclosure, you can see those on this thread, I went with the JL10W1V2 and you will not be disappointed, just make sure they remove the factory sub. You will also want to put in enough power for this sub, I would not go less than 500 watts, with plenty of headroom, I went Focal amps all around, bi-amped in the front and dedicated mono for the Sub. The kid in you will come back out when you hear nickelback or Within Temptation at a modest volume... you will realize just how sound proof this vehicle really is, Dynamat isnt necessary if they use the factory areas.

I replaced the factory coax in the back with the Focal100CA1, I would not go beyond that, as they dont take much power to drive so the factory amp does just fine for mid fill and some very crisp highs. I would also just drop the center mid, its worthless, and will just muddy up the Focal mids imaging in the front, the two in the corners are just fine, if they set the cross overs correctly. With high end drivers, processors, and amps, less really is more.. you will appreciate them more if they are solo.

Polyglass is the way to go if you can step up the price. I paid 650 at Al and Eds for my 3 ways up front, they were able to modify the existing mounts to fit in the Focals nicely.

For Processing.. where it all starts and needs to stay in sync, I went with the RockFord, but there are plenty of good processors out there, just make sure that you get the best you can afford, as the electronics in this vehicle are tricky and they are constantly updating, the Rockford does a really nice job of staying in sync with the output from the headunit and being able to adjust the sub and tweeking all of the crossover points and cut offs etc is nice to be able to do from a laptop. I dont do it often now, but used it a lot when I first got the car back to dial it in to my tastes.

For IPod control I really like my VaisTech SL21up, but everything from VaisTech works well.

Good luck with it, its an adventure, just make sure they include enough money on the install to run 4ga or better to the back, its not inexpensive cabling, but its a long run to the back and also labor intensive to get the back seats out. They will want to put it all in the trunk, the guys at Al and Eds spent two days doing my fiberglass enclosures to hide and mount it all so it looks factory.

https://www.me.com/gallery/#100244

The installer and manager I used are now at a shop in Riverside, off the 15 if your interested, they know this vehicle well.

marky2mark

There is no comparison between the new system and the stock system. I went with the Focal Access in the front, list price at Al & Eds is 449, they gave them to me for 400. They really sound fantastic.....everyone who rides in my car is amazed at the sound. I can't even imagine how good the polyglass sound. The "premium" stock speakers were paper, I couldn't believe that Lexus would put something that cheap in their flagship sedan.

I wanted to keep everything looking stock so I went with the JL 8" sub where the old one was. There is a dial to adjust the sub that they mounted inside the center console. To be honest, the problem I find with the sub is that the bass level varies so much from artist to artist, and sometimes from song to song, that I usually keep it at a pretty low level so as not to be blasted by bass when the song changes. That being said, it still sounds really good. I'm sure you would get much more bass with a 10 or 12" mounted in the trunk but the 8" is plenty for me.

As far as rattles, when they first installed I was getting a rattle from the left (drivers side) rear speaker, it almost sounded like it might be blown, so I took it back and they replaced both rear speakers with new ones. Also it turned out that speaker wasn't mounted properly in the door. Now the rattle is completely gone.

The other thing I would say is that the tuning of the system is almost as important as the components you get, maybe more so. I had to take the car back 3 or 4 times before they finally got the amp/lc8i/crossovers tuned properly. When I first got the car back the sound was WAY too bright, then I took it back, they adjusted it and then it was still too bright and there was a hum coming from the subwoofer, finally I went back and there was a different guy there who basically started from scratch and re-tuned everything and it was perfect to where with the bass, mid and treble right in the middle it sounded perfect, and no hums or hisses. You really need to get someone who knows what they are doing to tune the thing or it will sound like ***** even with the best components. I'm sure others on the board like Cmasten can speak more intelligently about the tuning.

So it took a little persistence, but once the system was tuned properly it sounds fantastic and I couldn't be happier. The aux input from my phone sounds great, even FM radio and XM sound great, CD's sound incredible.

Silver460

Thank you guys for the responses. Just stop by there to shoot the **** with them today. In the middle of the conversation one of the installer mentioned they were going to mount the amp upside down on the deck. If I remember correctly this was a bad thing because of heat soak isn't it?

Cmasten, How do you have your speakers wired to the amp? being that it's 3 pieces for the front and 1 piece to the rear...? TIA!

Tri

cmasten

mounting the amp to the rear deck is not a great idea, its heavy and the deck was not meant to support that as it bounces up and down, I had my bolted to a fabricated section they made in the trunk and then mounted with hard rubber grommets. With that said, they could do this with smaller amps or if they were able to use better hardware than just sheet metal screws.

My area was back in the corner right above the stock amp. They did mount the processor on the rear deck and the Cross overs in the kick panels. They took the interior completely apart... seats, door panels etc, so they were able to run all new wiring from the rear amps out to the cross overs and then up and into the drivers. The rear doors used the existing wiring, I actually replaced those after the fact. They are fed off of the stock amp for just rear mids and highs, keeping it all Focal ensures that your wont get any cross bleeding or strange harmonics from different types of drivers. The rear brackets can be modified to fit the Focal 100ca units, but you have to take your time and dremmel very carefully. It can be a perfect fit if done properly.

They tried to use existing raceways and cable channels to run all of the cabling so that nothing was pinched and could be easily traced if there was an issue. I didnt catch where you were located but if your in So Cal and want to hear how it came out I would be happy demo it for you. You could spend about a grand less and get an excellent system. I have an audio engineering background and unfortunately have an ear that can hear the subtleties... it makes for an expensive hobby, but not necessary if your just want a great sounding system in your LS. This is the best car I have put a sound system in because there is so much dynamic range to work with , the noise floor in this car is very low and its quietness allows you a lot of flexibility

Silver460

Thank you for the offer! As a matter of fact if I'd love to have a chance at it if it's not too much trouble. I'm a Realtor so I am in different parts of Socal on different days. I can come to you. Tomorrow I'll be in Glendale, Pasadena, and Thousand Oaks. My office is in Irvine. I occassionally run to the inlands, not too often.

I think I'm going to go with the Focal 100CAI for the rear as well. Was running new wires to the front speakers a necessity? I don't think I'll ever run enough power for it to pose a problem... or will I...?

Thanks for the advice on the rear brackets... I'll be sure to let the installer know.

If you were to spend a grand less what would you have done differently? I am thinking about saving some money by holding out on the Polyglass components and going for the Access line since I probably won't be able to hear the difference. Clear sound is clear sound to me... and from what Marky2mark described - they sound plenty great.

I'm more or less trying to get something similar if not a bit better than the Harman Kardon Logic7 in the CL and S classes... I'm not looking to shake the neighborhood... just nice clean and clear sounds with enough punch to be taken seriously.

cmasten

for new amps you will want to have them run new cabling. The mid bass in the front doors will benefit the most, but all three drivers will appreciate it, the cabling in the LS was only intended to run the simple, weak and low impedance speakers from Panasonic that came with it stock. The sub will have to have new cabling , but that is all in the trunk which is easier.

Marky2mark spent about a grand less and achieved what he was after, you may not notice a difference between the Focal drivers or amps and the cost difference is significant. This was a portion of the cost the rest was in the fabrication which I had done for the amps and sub. If you go with a single multi channel amp and have them mount an 8" woofer in the rear deck you can shave off a grand and still get excellent sound.

I am in Claremont, so we will have to work something out so you can hear what it sounds like, it may help, although your final product will sound different if your using different components.

Silver460

Just checked with the installer. He stated that the labor quoted includes running new speaker wires! Kudos to them.

I made a big mistake today. I sat in a 745 with the Focal Polyglass component setup with a 10" IDQv3 sub driven off a 300w rms amp. The rest was history. There's no way I will go down the 8" freeair path after listening to that. Sound was very clear... a bit on the bright side but still clear, with very accurate and natural bass from the IDQ sub, no rattles, just goooood music. Loved it.

Looks like I'm going to have to sacrifice a little trunk space. =D

marky2mark

Hehe....once you hear it you can't go back.... :-)

I guarantee you the brightness is not the speakers, it is the tuning of the frequencies on the amp/crossovers etc. When I went to Al & Ed's the sales kid had the Focal Acess in his Jeep Cherokee and he took me out to listen to them...they were so bright it almost made my ears bleed. To him it sounded great. Tuning it to your ear makes all the difference.

Silver460

Mark - I totally agree. As a matter of fact, after listening to both the Polyglass and the Access line for an extended period of time, I think I might be considering other speakers. They sound terrific, I'm just looking for a warmer tone... Perhaps the Hertz MLK or Morel Elates... Not too sure

So I'm back with another question: How is sound delay handled with our head unit? I see in the DSP setting there are 4 settings plus an "all" setting which through my search here on CL would turn the DSP off. My question is... is there still a delay to the rear channels in the "all" setting to simulate a larger listening environment?

First I was going to go for just the LC6 to sum the signals. I am now thinking about going for the JBL MS-8 for the time alignment and the Logic7... Thoughts?

cmasten

The new Rockford is going to be the bomb, I have the 3sixty.2 and the .3 looks really nice http://www.rockfordfosgate.com/produ...n_US&p_status= , although its a ways out. The .2 is around now

You dont delay low frequency. You will want to time adjust your channels/drivers so you get your imaging right. If your going for time delay to make it sound bigger etc, then your going to gain effects and sacrifice quality.

I would suggest that you get the sound nice and tight and then add in the delays etc if you like, to get just the sound your looking for. I am not a fan of effects in a mobile environment, but we each have our own preference

Silver460

Once again, thanks for the valuable input cmasten! I'm going to have to think this through carefully... too many things to consider at the moment. From speaker selections, to amp, to processors... All this from just wanting a little more oomph in the car... Funnn....

Silver460

I'm back with a little update. The car went under the knife the other day. I went with 2 8" subs with a 250w RMS amp. We initially went with a sealed enclosure. with the gains 3/4 way up, I could feel that bass was an improvement over stock, however it wasn't amazing. Then the minute I hit the trunk switch to examine the problem, as the trunk opened, the bass came surging on LOUD!!! It was solid and sweet, just the way the track was intended. So with a sealed box, bass was OK with the trunk closed, and AMAZING with the trunk opened. This led us to think that we need either a ported or 4th order band pass box for optimum bass.

The 2 8's shook the trunk and rattled a few things a bit in a sealed box. We tested a vented box with a single 10" and it didn't shake the trunk at all. It produced very solid and clean clean bass with no rattles. I wish we had a vented box for 2 8's but we didn't. At any rate, the shop will be building a new vented box tuned to about 32 hz and we'll see how that goes.

I'm still amazed at how solid the LS trunk is. You need a ported box to for your subs to shine without shaking the whole trunk.

Shibumi1

try having them remove the oem sub & vent the bass directly into the passenger compartment.. a sealed box should perform excellent.. without sounding boomy or 1 note-ish