Johnhav430

Sorry to hear about the troubles...I'm very unfamiliar with autos...I mean when I was in college, Aamco did a good business....isn't most of that gone, where people are driving autos for the life of the vehicle without rebuilds?

perhaps OT: in general, what's Lexus' policy with loaners? With BMW, it's like candy, and if they call late, I often ask can I keep it another day, always no problem.....just curious (and my BMW is an '07 out of warranty)

tallcaguy

LOR just drained some fluid. I'm kind at a loss to see how that would cause problems (unless they somehow managed to drain too much out). Of course it started right after they worked on the car. I'd go back to your indie and ask what fluid they used. My indie charged 85 and it was done in less than an hour. LOR charged 225 and it took several hours. They explained exactly what they did and why. The "car crash downshift" sounds terrible. If you want to meet sometime, you're welcome to drive my car for comparison. PM me

tallcaguy

Checked with my indie about the drain/fill (85). Used Toyota World Standard. They made sure car was level. Drained 2.5 quarts ("based on experience") and replaced the same amount. Said they could have used "Check Trans Fluid" which is probably temperature measurement. Doesn't sound like they did. Did the trans reflash (105). Car shifted better.

LOR (local Lex dealer) did it right. Drained the overfill and did a D/F based on temperature. It took more time and more money (225) The 6 speed shifts very smoothly.

FatherTo1

Thanks for the offer to meet up and compare transmissions, tallcaguy. I had the TB/WP/sparkplugs done today and had my indie mechanic take a look at the tranny too. He uses the temperature method and decided to drain it again (he didn't charge me any labor, just $13 or so for the WS fluid). So he was only able to drain out 1 quart, whereas when he did a drain and fill for me six months ago he was able to take out 1.8 quarts. Lexus of Roseville claimed to drain out 1 quart a month ago and that seems to be the case since my mechanic was only left with about 1 quart today. I really wonder how the dealership determined it was overfilled by 1 quart because it appears they may have taken out too much. After my mechanic refilled the tranny back to normal, the hard shifts disappeared.

My mechanic was able to reproduce the slam shifts twice before he drained the tranny. After he refilled the tranny I was unable to reproduce the hard shifting despite trying to do so for 5 minutes on a quiet section of road. Have only driven 15 miles today and the tranny is shifting gently and smoothly but not completely invisible. Going to drive it a week or so to see if the smoothness disappears because in the past the tranny would relearn old habits and the shifts would eventually become more noticeable -- not rough, but just more obvious every time a shift is performed. My mechanic consulted with another mechanic friend of his that worked on an LS with similar behavior as mine and a tranny replacement did not fix the issue. Rather it needed a new ECU. Hoping I won't have to go that route in pursuit of seamless shifts because the bill would be about $1,300.

For now, I'm happy that my indie mechanic was able to undo what Lexus of Roseville did. I should have just left it alone and never have taken the car into Lexus of Roseville. As the old adage goes, "if it ain't broke...". I kept pursuing smoother shifts but got the opposite instead. It is odd that after each tranny service, whether a drain/refill or just drain, the shifts would be seamless for a few weeks but then gradually become more noticeable. Shouldn't the computer learn my driving habits and maintain smooth shifts rather than go back to old shifting habits? Perhaps this really does point towards an ECU issue or motherboard going bad.

lsdude

FatherTo1, have you tried driving in Power mode? I have similar symptoms as you (not perfect shifting in lower gears) and driving in Power mode is tolerable. Someone quoted in another thread that it may be another sensor issue rather than the transmission. Replacing the MAF helped a little but not completely.

FatherTo1

Hi lsdude. I'll try PWR mode today. I usually reserve that for passing. When we first got the LS I did prefer the shifting of PWR mode on the open road but it wasn't that smooth in around town and stop-n-go traffic. I got tired of toggling PWR mode and have kept things in the normal ECT position. I will keep in on PWR for a few days and see how it is now. Thanks for the suggestion.

FatherTo1

So I went out for a morning drive and kept it in PWR mode. During four loops around the neighborhood (total of 36 miles) I do prefer to keep it in PWR mode for now. In PWR mode, I can't feel the shift into 5th and 6th gears but do notice it in regular ECT mode. Shifting in the lower four gears is about the same, other than PWR mode allowing to hold each gear a little longer.

tallcaguy

Sorry to hear LOR did such a poor job. That's kind of surprising but glad to hear that your indie solved the slam shift problems. I don't know if it's relevant to the whole "computer learns a driving style" but I do everything from relaxed freeway cruise to fairly high rev manual shifts. In the 500 miles since the 2nd (LOR) drain/fill, the trans (in auto mode) has been "Lexus smooth". No changes. I haven't driven another 04-06 yet but plan to so I can compare. Hopefully it doesn't lead the purchase of a 2nd LS

FatherTo1

I was quite surprised that LOR thought the proper course of action was to drain out 1 qt. LOR service manager and staff were extremely cordial and the whole visit was pleasant (minus the slam shifts afterwards). They didn't even charge me for the tranny diagnosis and service that day and still let me take a brand new '16 RX loaner out for 6 hours. The customer service there is exemplary but the diagnosis was poor that day it seems. When I immediately drove back 5 minutes later to report the slam shifts they scratched their heads and didn't know what could have went wrong and were convinced it couldn't have been due to a lack of tranny fluid. I felt terrible to even suggest it was the work they had just performed since they didn't charge me for anything. In the end, I really was low on fluid because LOR removed fluid when it wasn't necessary to do so. Still, despite the occasional slam shifts, I wonder why it actually shifted so smoothly for 300+ miles with low tranny fluid.

tallcaguy, what city are you in to compare shift quality between our cars, please? If I have time I will try to test drive a few more 06s but some many of the used LSes for sale are not exactly in the best condition to serve as comparison.

Johnhav430

I do find Lexus service to be exemplary, but what I would note that is different than BMW:

• lack the arrogance of BMW
• don't give out loaners like candy (BMW you could be getting your oil changed for $80 and keep the loaner 3 days)
• might lack the technical expertise that BMW has

Let's face it most service advisors are pretty non-technical though they throw big words around....at BMW, you can always drive with a foreman, who can get very technical. I would think this is an option at Lexus? Also, it's pretty documented that with argument, BMW always does the right thing. Even covering things out of warranty.

One example is the Takata airbag thing. I was given a 2016 328i for almost 4 mos., and my car is a 2007 long out of warranty.....(I heard Honda did this too [though they had deaths], and Toyota was 50/50)

Since Lexus is so polite, I would not be afraid to just say hey I don't know that you got this right, can I talk to a foreman and take a ride?

tallcaguy

The 2 Lexus Service Advisors that I've worked with either knew exactly what I was talking about or were willing to check w/ a mechanic and get back to me. One owns an LS430 and loves the car. I did work 1x w/ a SA (in another dealership) whose only interest was selling me ridiculously expensive service.