Put back the OEM mufflers and now car handles/runs better? WTFBBQ
09-24-13, 02:27 PM
#1
Pit Crew
Thread Starter
Put back the OEM mufflers and now car handles/runs better? WTFBBQ
I have a 1998 LS400. I recently took the car to my local muffler shop to have all 3 resonators and 2 mufflers deleted and replaced with pipes in their respective sections. I drove the car around for a week, it was loud and there was highway drone. Sounded like a muscle car and I enjoyed the attention and puzzled looks (the car growled furiously at WOT) from people when mashing the gas.
Fast forward to today, I went back to the shop to have them put back on the 2 rear mufflers. (the highway drone just got to be to much to handle and I missed the quiet ride) Decided to keep the 3 resonators off. Well upon a start up, the car is a hair louder than stock...pretty much barely noticeable.
Now initial driving impressions are night and day. Basically the previous set up (all resonators and mufflers deleted) the car ran and felt a bit sluggish, throttle response felt sticky and I could have sworn my RPMs jumped and skipped.
The current set up as of today (3 resonators deleted, 2 mufflers remaining) feels great. Throttle response is quick and the car no longer has that sticky throttle feel...no trace of it. Low to midrange feels awesome.....the previous set up felt like the car lost a significant amount of torque. The car now feels silky smooth...previously it felt rough.
Lastly, my handling feels so much better. The car is all stock (suspension, wheels, tires) but previously the car felt heavier and just wasn't as agile and it really did feel like I was lumbering around in a boat on wheels. Its funny I mention I heavier because the previous set up had no mufflers. Now with the current set up the car feels more agile...seriously I can whip it around and considering its size and weight...its not doing to shabby. It feels like I have new bushings and just overall refreshed suspension.
I know this may sound nuts but what do you guys think? The smoothness I can understand and low to mid range improvement but the handling improved from the previous set up? WTFBBQ I must be losing it but I consider myself sensitive to even little improvements and I can feel this.
Fast forward to today, I went back to the shop to have them put back on the 2 rear mufflers. (the highway drone just got to be to much to handle and I missed the quiet ride) Decided to keep the 3 resonators off. Well upon a start up, the car is a hair louder than stock...pretty much barely noticeable.
Now initial driving impressions are night and day. Basically the previous set up (all resonators and mufflers deleted) the car ran and felt a bit sluggish, throttle response felt sticky and I could have sworn my RPMs jumped and skipped.
The current set up as of today (3 resonators deleted, 2 mufflers remaining) feels great. Throttle response is quick and the car no longer has that sticky throttle feel...no trace of it. Low to midrange feels awesome.....the previous set up felt like the car lost a significant amount of torque. The car now feels silky smooth...previously it felt rough.
Lastly, my handling feels so much better. The car is all stock (suspension, wheels, tires) but previously the car felt heavier and just wasn't as agile and it really did feel like I was lumbering around in a boat on wheels. Its funny I mention I heavier because the previous set up had no mufflers. Now with the current set up the car feels more agile...seriously I can whip it around and considering its size and weight...its not doing to shabby. It feels like I have new bushings and just overall refreshed suspension.
I know this may sound nuts but what do you guys think? The smoothness I can understand and low to mid range improvement but the handling improved from the previous set up? WTFBBQ I must be losing it but I consider myself sensitive to even little improvements and I can feel this.
09-24-13, 03:03 PM
#2
Lexus Champion
I have been preaching this for years, that when you try and "improve" the LS exhaust system by modifying it or deleting parts, you just lose performance, but people are hard-headed, and old ways of thinking die slowly! 
09-24-13, 03:34 PM
#3
what size piping did they use?
The reason yours was so bad was because you effectively straightpiped the exhaust. Rarely have I ever found that streetable.
A properly set up exhaust system will yield you power and increase (ever so slightly) fuel economy.
The reason yours was so bad was because you effectively straightpiped the exhaust. Rarely have I ever found that streetable.
A properly set up exhaust system will yield you power and increase (ever so slightly) fuel economy.
09-24-13, 03:43 PM
#4
Pole Position
I know this may sound nuts but what do you guys think? The smoothness I can understand and low to mid range improvement but the handling improved from the previous set up? WTFBBQ I must be losing it but I consider myself sensitive to even little improvements and I can feel this.
It's a placebo effect. 
09-24-13, 04:05 PM
#5
Lexus Champion
technical explanation - if you are going to use the stock ECU, you need to keep the stock back pressure, because this ECU has never been cracked, so there is no real way the modify the programming to account for the modified exhaust - keeping the stock back pressure pretty much necessitates keeping then entire exhaust fairly stock.
Last edited by LScowboyLS; 09-24-13 at 06:56 PM.
09-24-13, 05:24 PM
#6
Moderator
Things are not so simple as it used to be when engines were working just mechanically.
Trending Topics
These are Weber but Mikuni would be nicer. 
09-25-13, 04:49 PM
#10
Possible explanation for the handling performance increase:
You can hear yourself think better. You can also hear the tires on the pavement. This means that your brain can better analyze the sound waves produced by your tires.
This means that you will hear the tires make noise just when they are being pushed to the limit. So your brain says, "I don't hear any screeching noises, so this means I have traction and I can bury my foot deeper in the gas" Thus resulting in increased speed through turns.
When you had straight pipe all you could hear is raw V8 flooding your ears so you had no idea if the car had traction or not!
You can hear yourself think better. You can also hear the tires on the pavement. This means that your brain can better analyze the sound waves produced by your tires.
This means that you will hear the tires make noise just when they are being pushed to the limit. So your brain says, "I don't hear any screeching noises, so this means I have traction and I can bury my foot deeper in the gas" Thus resulting in increased speed through turns.
When you had straight pipe all you could hear is raw V8 flooding your ears so you had no idea if the car had traction or not!
09-26-13, 02:48 PM
#11
Pit Crew
Thread Starter
Possible explanation for the handling performance increase:
You can hear yourself think better. You can also hear the tires on the pavement. This means that your brain can better analyze the sound waves produced by your tires.
This means that you will hear the tires make noise just when they are being pushed to the limit. So your brain says, "I don't hear any screeching noises, so this means I have traction and I can bury my foot deeper in the gas" Thus resulting in increased speed through turns.
When you had straight pipe all you could hear is raw V8 flooding your ears so you had no idea if the car had traction or not!
You can hear yourself think better. You can also hear the tires on the pavement. This means that your brain can better analyze the sound waves produced by your tires.
This means that you will hear the tires make noise just when they are being pushed to the limit. So your brain says, "I don't hear any screeching noises, so this means I have traction and I can bury my foot deeper in the gas" Thus resulting in increased speed through turns.
When you had straight pipe all you could hear is raw V8 flooding your ears so you had no idea if the car had traction or not!
09-26-13, 02:50 PM
#12
Pit Crew
Thread Starter
I dont think the LS400 needs to be super loud...a good magnaflow/flowmaster or other street exhaust should be enough to have audible rumble without being overbearing.
09-26-13, 04:44 PM
#13
i recently read a small article on the last month's Super Street magazine in which they break down very briefly the nature of exhaust gases, back pressure, and pressure gradients. the author, Aaron Bonk, even mentions Bernoulli's principle (college rushed back to me as i read) in fluid dynamics. it basically stated that you should be more concerned about pressure gradient than back pressure, and that a more efficient exhaust manifold (header) is where it counts more.
09-26-13, 07:59 PM
#14
Pit Crew
Thread Starter
i recently read a small article on the last month's Super Street magazine in which they break down very briefly the nature of exhaust gases, back pressure, and pressure gradients. the author, Aaron Bonk, even mentions Bernoulli's principle (college rushed back to me as i read) in fluid dynamics. it basically stated that you should be more concerned about pressure gradient than back pressure, and that a more efficient exhaust manifold (header) is where it counts more.
09-26-13, 10:43 PM
#15
technical explanation - if you are going to use the stock ECU, you need to keep the stock back pressure, because this ECU has never been cracked, so there is no real way the modify the programming to account for the modified exhaust - keeping the stock back pressure pretty much necessitates keeping then entire exhaust fairly stock.
