Oil Leaks: Is the Dealer Screwing Me?
03-25-12, 03:31 PM
#1
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Oil Leaks: Is the Dealer Screwing Me?
I have an 98 LS400 and I just had a major service done to the vehicle that replaced timing belt, water pump, valve gaskets, cam gaskets and etc.... back in June. I told the dealer to inspect the car and then they gave me a laundry list and I said fix it. Needless to say, I spent thousands on the service.
A few weeks ago I noticed a puddle of oil under the car after sitting for a while. I took my car to get an oil change and to inspect the oil leak (Friday)
Yesterday (Satrurday)the service manager called and said it was 2 seals that are leaking and it was related to my service back in June so under warranty it would be covered.
Today (Sunday) I get a call from the service rep saying a different tech looked and is now saying it's the CAM actuator and this is almost $3k to repair.
I told the rep, yesterday it was diagnosed to be a particular set of parts covered under warranty and now today its somethign else attached with a hefty bill to repair, it sounds fishy to me. I told them well I can't fix it, and he says well he will notify the service manager because the car is unfortunately now torn down. I never authorized then to tear anything down to begin with.
Is there a mechanic here that knows his $h*@ that can help me dissect this sitiuation?
Oil seems to be leaking on the front passenger side in small puddles.
A few weeks ago I noticed a puddle of oil under the car after sitting for a while. I took my car to get an oil change and to inspect the oil leak (Friday)
Yesterday (Satrurday)the service manager called and said it was 2 seals that are leaking and it was related to my service back in June so under warranty it would be covered.
Today (Sunday) I get a call from the service rep saying a different tech looked and is now saying it's the CAM actuator and this is almost $3k to repair.
I told the rep, yesterday it was diagnosed to be a particular set of parts covered under warranty and now today its somethign else attached with a hefty bill to repair, it sounds fishy to me. I told them well I can't fix it, and he says well he will notify the service manager because the car is unfortunately now torn down. I never authorized then to tear anything down to begin with.
Is there a mechanic here that knows his $h*@ that can help me dissect this sitiuation?
Oil seems to be leaking on the front passenger side in small puddles.
03-25-12, 05:16 PM
#2
it's possible that it's the cam actuator but it is a pretty rare problem. I would pull it up with the service manager that you definitely arent happy wth how they tore the car down, and that while you're willing to pay for parts you arent going to be liable for the labor since it was their mistake. and demand to see the damaged parts in your hands before accepting their explanations.
03-25-12, 08:49 PM
#3
My experience is the customer facing service advisors at most dealers aren't worth two cents, so don't put too much stock in what the Sunday guy said. Get back in touch with the Service Manager on Monday, and have him get to the bottom of it. I imagine they tore the car down to get to the two cam seals that were thought to be leaking, so that may not have been done with ill intentions.
03-25-12, 11:46 PM
#5
it's possible that it's the cam actuator but it is a pretty rare problem. I would pull it up with the service manager that you definitely arent happy wth how they tore the car down, and that while you're willing to pay for parts you arent going to be liable for the labor since it was their mistake. And demand to see the damaged parts in your hands before accepting their explanations.
03-26-12, 03:23 AM
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Is it possible that the actuator leak could be caused by the cam seals leaking oil on it or oil leaking from elsewhere on it?
Is there something that a foul mechanic can do to intentionally damage the actuator to make it leak just to make $$$
Perhaps a old one is lying around and they have replaced mine with that one? Are they interchangeable with other model lexus' or pretty specific to my 98 model? Which since it is pretty old it could be unlikely that they'd have a bad one just around?
I'm leaving nothing to be unlikely here because I feel pretty sour
I am certainly no mechanic so excuse my ignorance.
Is there something that a foul mechanic can do to intentionally damage the actuator to make it leak just to make $$$
Perhaps a old one is lying around and they have replaced mine with that one? Are they interchangeable with other model lexus' or pretty specific to my 98 model? Which since it is pretty old it could be unlikely that they'd have a bad one just around?
I'm leaving nothing to be unlikely here because I feel pretty sour
I am certainly no mechanic so excuse my ignorance.
03-26-12, 04:37 AM
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FYI - I just contacted a different lexus dealer parts department and they parts guy told me there is no such part in their system called a cam/camshaft actuator. He said there may be different terminology being used but typically its the VVTi that has seals on both sides of the block that can leak oil.
I have had VVT seals replaced last year if that is the case. I have also had cam seals done last year also. I think I have had just about every d*@m part that can leak oil on the outisde of the block replaced geez.
Description of work done 4/21/11:
"Replaced oil pressure control valve" - assuming this is what is called OCV
In June last year I had the Cam and Crank seals replaced as they were leaking.
The service manager doesnt come in until 3pm today so I guess I'll have to patiently wait for his arrival so he can get to the bottom of this, its just nerve racking you know!
I have had VVT seals replaced last year if that is the case. I have also had cam seals done last year also. I think I have had just about every d*@m part that can leak oil on the outisde of the block replaced geez.
Description of work done 4/21/11:
"Replaced oil pressure control valve" - assuming this is what is called OCV
In June last year I had the Cam and Crank seals replaced as they were leaking.
The service manager doesnt come in until 3pm today so I guess I'll have to patiently wait for his arrival so he can get to the bottom of this, its just nerve racking you know!
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03-26-12, 05:01 AM
#8
the OCV and what i believe the service writer is talking about are very different things. the vvti actuator he's referring to is actually a helical gear that is hydraulically driven by engine oil, and is inside the timing gear of each intake camshaft. rarely the unit itself will start to leak. very rarely.
03-27-12, 12:32 AM
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Finally spoke to the Supervisor and he stated that actual part is the Camshaft tube assy (Part # 13050-50010-a0).
He said the part should have been recommended for replacement when they did my cam seal job last year so they aren't going to charge me any labor, just pay for the part. They recommended I do both sides because the other one is seeping a little so its on its way to going bad.
He said I can come in and look at it so he can show me the findings.
The part cost was around $480 each. I found the part on oem lexus parts online for $292. I told the Supervisor and he said he spoke to parts and they were willing to get as close as $320.
I plan on going there to see the problem in person and then make a decision to pay for the parts while I am there.
Thoughts?
He said the part should have been recommended for replacement when they did my cam seal job last year so they aren't going to charge me any labor, just pay for the part. They recommended I do both sides because the other one is seeping a little so its on its way to going bad.
He said I can come in and look at it so he can show me the findings.
The part cost was around $480 each. I found the part on oem lexus parts online for $292. I told the Supervisor and he said he spoke to parts and they were willing to get as close as $320.
I plan on going there to see the problem in person and then make a decision to pay for the parts while I am there.
Thoughts?
... darn cars! darn Toyotas!
03-27-12, 01:13 AM
#11
the "camshaft tube" is pretty much exactly the part I mentioned in my last post, it contains the gear i mentioned and is sold as a single unit. them leaking significant amounts of oil is pretty rare, almost to the point that I want to say something was damaged when they did the cam seals... it is by no means a common failure point.
it's 13050a on this diagram.
carson sells them for $288/each so 320 w/tax and not having to deal with shipping isn't a horrible deal. that being said, it's pretty sketch that they didnt warn you about this when they did the cam seals....
it's 13050a on this diagram.
carson sells them for $288/each so 320 w/tax and not having to deal with shipping isn't a horrible deal. that being said, it's pretty sketch that they didnt warn you about this when they did the cam seals....
03-27-12, 05:06 AM
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Yes the Supervisor said that they should have told me to replace them last year when they did the job so they will eat the cost now for labor given I buy the part.
The car has a lot if miles 226k approximately. Supervisor says these things happen with old cars eventually, which makes it hard for a non mechanic to contest lacking any real historical knowledge.
It may have been damaged when they did the job, I have had that happen with old car repairs (hoses and other parts basically failing after you start disassembling to replace parts. Since its metal and not brittle rubber like a hose or seal or some gasket it seems odd. Then again why is it listed as a part to sell if it's not known to replace or fail.
Well Inhave my hands tied so like you said I think it's best to just get it local to avoid the shipping and to also have parts warranty locally on case there is an issues within the next 12 months.
The car has a lot if miles 226k approximately. Supervisor says these things happen with old cars eventually, which makes it hard for a non mechanic to contest lacking any real historical knowledge.
It may have been damaged when they did the job, I have had that happen with old car repairs (hoses and other parts basically failing after you start disassembling to replace parts. Since its metal and not brittle rubber like a hose or seal or some gasket it seems odd. Then again why is it listed as a part to sell if it's not known to replace or fail.
Well Inhave my hands tied so like you said I think it's best to just get it local to avoid the shipping and to also have parts warranty locally on case there is an issues within the next 12 months.
03-27-12, 08:10 PM
#15
I'd take that deal for $320 a side and get the car the heck out of that dealer's shop. Then I'd work on finding a good independent mechanic, a chore in itself. If you are in MD, you could try Pat Goss's shop in Seabrook; mostly positive reviews.