Wadeisabea

Hi, I've been looking to buy a new(used) car for a few months now and I decided on a Lexus. My budget is $4-7,000 and I like both the ES and LS models(90's of course). I have test driven a 97 ES300 and liked it, but have not had a chance to look at an LS yet. How do the two cars compare? I know the LS is RWD and has a bigger engine.

I've found a nice looking 1994 LS400 for $5700, black with black leather in excellent shape and only 120k miles. This is a pretty good deal right? And I believe I've read that it is a non-interference engine aswell, so I don't have to worry about replacing the timing belt right away.

One more thing, what kind of gas mileage can I expect with an LS? I drive about 50/50 HWY/city. I get around 20mpg in my accord right now.

Thanks

http://s244.photobucket.com/albums/g...Lexus%20LS400/ - There is the LS

PureDrifter

iTrader: (10)

it does have an interference engine.

in 95 Lexus changed the whole chassis/motor/trans on the LS. the engine's heads were changed out for more compression, making it an interference engine.

Wadeisabea

??? The car is a 94, and if they changed to an interference engine in 95 that would make a 94 a non-interference right?

Neofate

iTrader: (1)

LS is the luxury side.. Luxury = power, comfort, convenience, and imo looks compared to the ES.

The ES is a lower line model than the LS, relatively.

I would definitely say go for the LS.

That price is good for the mileage, and apparent condition. How does it run? How does the engine sound? Any leaks?

Service history ?

It is probably a pretty safe bet, and at $5700 120k on a black/black LS400 is worth it to me. Alot will probably say its high. I disagree for the car.. but what alot of people get for them, it probably is a 'touch'.. But I think its a steal.

The leather looks a little worn, but it does have 120k, I have 230k, and my leather is in better shape, but doesn't say anything .. as mine was garage kept its entire life.

Drive the LS,.. I think that will make up your mind.

Yes, it is a non-interface engine (the ls) -- so no your timing belt won't damage the engine, but at 120k it is still time to get it done. Its 30k past due.

Gas mileage, on a 94,.. expect about like your accord. Avg of 20mpg isn't unreasonable.. I get 23mpg on avg in my 94.. Some get 18-19, but most avg 20'ish. I've gotten 25+ on mine out of a hwy trip, and others have hit 25-30 -- So all in all the V8 is very efficient. It is all relative to how heavy your foot is.

Oh, and there is a list of things that are commonly wrong/bad with the LS (as with any car) -- One of which is apparent on that car. The climate control LCD has Blacked out. This is a $200 fix (sending it to someone like Jim walker, or ordering the LCD and soldering it yourself,.. either way same cost) -- You could talk the dealer down on the LCD. At least to 5500.. If not claiming Dealership costs on the fix of 500-750+..

If you could get this under 5grand you would be stealing it. (If mechanically sound)

Good luck,

Wadeisabea

Thanks for all of the information, I couldn't ask for much more than that. I haven't had a chance to look at it because it is 50 miles away. I am going to get a carfax on it as soon as I get the VIN from the seller. The timing belt may have been replaced earllier, the seller didn't say when I asked along with a few other questions. He said the only thing that will need to be done soon is the shocks.

Wadeisabea

Also, would the insurance be higher on this compared to an ES?

And are the Pinstripes on the side removeable? That is the only thing I don't like about the car.

PureDrifter

iTrader: (10)

ahh, i misread it as 94 ES and 97 LS

sonyman

Why don't you call your insurance company and find out?

And yes, they are.

DarthLexus

all i have to say is that the Lexus Ls400 will last you probably forever without any sort of bs problems like a mercedez or bmw might give you. LEXUS FOR THE WIN

Wadeisabea

I'm not asking for a quote. I'm asking if one model will be more expensive than another(because of the size of the engine). I've noticed many people on this forum have multiple lexuses, and I would like to know from their experiences whether or not the LS is more expensive than the ES to insure.

I've asked my dad to call the insurance agent which might take a couple of days.

Neofate

iTrader: (1)

Carfax is a good idea. The less you get from it, the better -- It will most likely come back with no problems.

Lets see..

I was going to mention that pin strip .. heh, but then again didn't want to make an opinionated comment in case you liked it. Nonetheless.. your question has been answered.. Yes it can be removed.. it has been done many times by many people on this forum.

Go take a look at it when you can.

Test drive it,.. alone.

Give them your keys,.. your wife, whatever

Couple things to test for.

First drive it around at low speeds, like in a neighborhood at 10mph and slower.

Take some sharp corners at low speeds.. listen for clunks/and other suspension noises.

At low speeds listen for a 'putt putt putt' sound that seems to be coming from under the drivers seat, or just in front of your steering wheel (by the engine firewall). (If you hear this, your EGR pipe is cracked -- No biggie, and you can drive forever and a day with this problem.. I do. But good to know).

This is a dead giveaway that you need new motor mounts, and probably a tranny mount. The sound that is.

More on that later.

The suspension has some miles on it, moreso the car has age on it. Mine needs new suspension parts, but even so -- It drives great , and no one notices it needs new suspension components but me, because I know.. to others its a smooth, lexus ride. So don't worry about that part,.. you can do them in time, say struts first, then when you get extra money shocks/springs and so forth.

Now take the car out to the highway.

Get it up to speed,.. accelerate, get on it hard. Go about 70-80 on the highway,.. drive at least 55-70 for 10 minutes. Listen. Listen and feel the shifting, listen/feel for the balance of wheels/tire condition and alignment. (Not a big deal on balance and such.. but still good to know).

Main purpose of this highway run is to get the car nice and warmed up, not just a cold start. Now bring it back to a neighborhood. Run it around 30mph stop and go. (can do that before entering of course).

Stop the car completely.

Wait about a minute for the engine heat to build from idle.

Turn the steering wheel from lock to lock with the brake on at dead stop.

Listen for any noises, and toughness in the feel. (If nothing great) -- (If something, it isn't a deal breaker, PS problems are common with the LS, and can help you get a price reduction potentially).

Put it in park.

Pop the hood.

Look at engine,.. It should be perfectly still (while running).

Now reach over by the throttle body and move the accelerator bracket (rev it up by hand) -- It can be hard to see, but that is the vicinity.. (or have your friend rev it). What you are looking for is movement in the engine.

A slight movement due to the rev is ok.. but any major movement that would , say, knock over a plastic cup sitting on top of the center piece in engine, isn't proper.

This again points simply to motor mounts. If its still.. great.

While doing this, listen.

This engine is notorious for injector tick. No big deal,.. if you hear anything other than the injector click take note of it. These engines are quiet aside from the injector tick especially on higher mileage . The tick should be a constant sound, not alternating in rythem. A tick, not a ping or knock.

If you hear no injector tick, and nothing else.. even better.

Look at the usuals, belts, pulleys (check for abnormal rotation, wobbling and such),.. hoses, leaks, condition. Take off oil cap look under neath cap -- check for burnt oil patterns. Look at fluids, (Tranny, Power steering, coolant, oil) -- They should all be in good shape. Given the varying colors I'll let you decide what isn't.

I say this because a car that is well maintained will show visually, and alot of people selling cars, will bother to change some fluids (ie: Oil) -- but not all. So you can usually spot something by checking them all.

Push down on the corners of the car. Watch the suspension. Watch for over bounce and listen for noises. Again no big deal, its suspension parts. Alot of bounce is going to indicate worn shocks,.. noises can be bushings/struts and so on.

Turn on the AC, listen to engine, check compressor.

Close the hood, look at temperature gauge, it should not read over half (should really be a notch under half, but half is ok).

note the gauges,.. make sure they aren't sticking, dimming out in sections, or slow to respond. (LS is notorious for gauge glitches.. which can be fixed cheaply.. no worries -- the worst of them is sticking needles followed by dimmed SECTIONS of needles.)

Of course do the rest,.. move all power seats,.. all directions. Roll down and up all windows from all switches. Use power locks, test radio, cd player, speakers (use balance/fade) -- check lights.. open trunk, check for spare, condition of such -- Check side pockets in trunk .. see if OEM tools are there, and towel. See if medical kit is on the rights. (Just shows you how mint it might be -- mine had not been touched in those compartments whatsoever).

If you want to get even more ****. pop off the center caps,.. make sure your lugs are all on -- (IE: no stud/pin broken off behind the rotor).

Of course visually inspect the leather, carpet (pick up floor mats).. check in hard to reach/unseen sections.

Visually inspect paint,.. feel of it,.. make sure it is correctible (ie: has good clearcoat still on it, and so forth) -- Its an old car, the paint isn't going to be absolutely perfect,.. expect some nicks and maybe a small ding or two.. but nothing major).

Look at headlights/foglights (all lights on the cars exterior) Check for cracks and holes) -- Easily given away by a collection of moisture in the lense. (Again not a deal breaker, just something to look for).

If it makes you feel more comfortable, take it to Lexus, and get it pre-certified. 80$ or so, but worth every penny if you are going to buy it. Let them know your intentions of course.. and they usually do a pretty good job of 'trying' to find something wrong. Which is what you want in this case.

This is fairly long because this is what I would have wanted to know before getting my LS 400 , 94,.. -- I am still happy with my purchase, but after having one you get more familiar with some things.

The list could go on for miles.. but I will stop here heh. -- There are also well written guides found on the web , and here I believe.. dealing with purchasing a used Lexus. I just forget the link.

Take care,

Wadeisabea

Thanks a lot for that information, will try to check everything you say. I'm not very experienced when it comes to going under the hood, but my dad does most of my families mechanical work and he knows what to look for. I'll have him take a look at it before I buy anything.

The seller already told me it will need new shocks soon, so hopefully he'll knock a couple hundred off for that. And he's been trying to sell it for almost 2 months now at that price, is that a bad thing? I saw an ad on craigslist about at the beginning of february, and nothing since and I don't know if he has put up any other ads or anything.

Wow, I just checked ebay and $300 for shocks? Is that about right? Again, when it comes to fixing things I am not very knowledgeable.

Neofate

iTrader: (1)

Great, good to have a mechanic in the family

The seller doesn't sound like he really knows what is what on the car. I wouldn't trust that it has to have shocks now. That just doesn't seem right for the mileage. Could 'use' shocks, benefit from them, but not need them absolute. There is a difference. It should still drive great,.. if it doesn't that would be odd.

300 for two shocks, yes, that is right. You can get aftermarket shocks (which you might be looking at, probably are due to price) -- for cheaper, for sure. Many members can vouche for certain brands, and you can buy what fits your budget. ( I am going to get some eventually, next year or so, its just not high priority because it drives fine with the 'worn' 230,000 mile shocks ).

As for the seller listing so long --

It can be bad or good.

Like you say, it might not have much exposure, and thus not many hits/bites/interested parties.

He might have alot of tire kickers.

Also these cars with higher mileage and age for over 5 grand aren't that easy to sell to the general public. They don't realize the reliability they have. They don't realize an LS 400 with 1xx,xxx miles is NOT like a 1995 Ford Mustang with 150k on it. Oranges and Apples. To someone who knows, they can get it.

Your worry is that others have come and seen it, found something wrong, and there is something terribly wrong with it that people aren't buying it because of.

Not likely,.. it goes in your favour because you can talk the price down. Look up the KBB (Kelly Blue Book) on the car. It runs right at the 6k mark, higher than that retail, and even in 'fair' condition it still runs above 6k on private party, (I even put in 124,000) miles to be fair.

Not sure if he is pricing based on that, but it is close.

Nonetheless I think you can get this thing closer to 5k, maybe even 4900. If it runs good, the current price is acceptable. If you get it closer to 4900-5000 it would be an excellent deal, imo.

Wadeisabea

thanks again for the reply. I asked him in the first email if anything will need to be replaced in the next year or so, and he said the tires are good and the brakes are at half a pad. He said the shocks "might" need to replaced, so its not like they need to be changed now. He hasn't owned it for very long and doesn't know much about the previous owner, he got it from his father who owns a small car dealership.

If everything checks out alright, what would be a good first offer? $5,000?

Also, I read about the seafoam in another thread. Would that be a good thing to do if I do purchase it?

Neofate

iTrader: (1)

I'd go something like $4750,,.. Others can chime in here with their opinions. At 5 grand you have one of two reactions. Heck no, but I'll do 5600$. Then you have to move up from there.

On the $4750 you can have other reactions.. To the extreme are you kidding? I want serious offers -- To, thats a bit low, how about 5400. Then you go hrmm.. lets compromise.. 4900.. He might come back with 5100.. but ultimately its a decent reduction.

Up to you.

Now, for the seafoam, that is safe to do on a brand new car much less an older one. It would be an ideal thing to do , yes. No harm in it, and potential for some good.

Just don't expect chemical miracles