Gojirra99

Mel Gibson's image has turned highly negative in recent years, and he is known to have owned(owning) multiple Lexus, they even reported he is in a Lexus when he was drunk and making those rants.
I guess next time Mel Gibson enters a Lexus dealership looking for a new Lexus, Lexus Corp should have already sent a memo in advance to all Lexus dealerships, telling their salesmen to say,"Sorry sir, no more Lexus for you ", then show him the door

TRDFantasy

Most people here on CL *do* understand the LFA and the value aspect of it. For the past year, a lot of repeated and redundant discussion was initiated by you questioning the marketing strategy of the LFA, questioning the buyer process Lexus had, questioning whether Lexus would sell all LFAs, and questioning the value of the LFA, among other things. You keep bringing up these same questions and arguments continually in different LFA threads without any real proof.

You have yet to show any direct proof of exactly what the Lexus marketing strategy is for the LFA, and proof that you know exactly how the LFA buyer selection process works.

If you do not have direct proof or direct knowledge, why assume? Why create arguments and discussions based on assumptions and heresay? More specifically, why criticize and question Lexus and the LFA without concrete information?

Before you respond, understand that the onus is on YOU to back up your arguments and criticisms with direct evidence and proof.

... This is something that some of us on CL have been saying for quite a long time now, and something that you have consistently and repeatedly questioned.

You have repeatedly boasted about how many exotic owners you know, and that it would be extremely unlikely for Lexus to be able to sell LFAs outside of the "exotic circle" of people you are familiar with and affiliated with.

Tell me, do you know EVERY single exotic owner in the US? Do you know EVERY SINGLE person in the US that has the funds to buy an exotic or two, but has previously never done so for whatever reasons?

Your constant rehashing of the same arguments with no proof, your continual boasting of the exotic owners that you know, your continued criticism of aspects of the LFA and Lexus certainly makes it seem as if you have something personal against the LFA, and you seem to be taking it very personally that Lexus seemingly has been able to sell LFAs in the US outside of your "exotic circle" of people.

With regards to LFA branding, others have already mentioned that you are singling out the LFA, yet not mentioning how many exotics like Ferraris or Lambos have been sold to celebrities with a "negative" image. So why then single out Hilton and the LFA?

rominl

iTrader: (4)

not particularly defending tommy, but one thing i can tell you is, when lfa was first offered, all the claims about all lfa sold and tommy was one of the first few to doubt and argue that. want to look back and see how many people flamed on him? well, fast forward to now, do we still need more proof about how lfa isn't sold out still?

i am just looking at things and not anyone in particular. it's basically speculations from both sides. it's not like you or anyone else have proofs or one way or another either. solid proofs would be official statements from lexus in the end, but then again 90% of the discussions here can go away? a lot of times discussions are about predictions too

TRDFantasy

Well specifically referring to myself, I have tried not to make concrete conclusions or assumptions on the LFA and the whole process, despite admittedly making a few assumptions here and there.

For the past few months, I have tried to stop making any assumptions. Now I simply support Lexus with the belief they know what they are doing. Since we have very little facts, I feel the best way is just to let things pass and see how everything ends up.

Specifically regarding LFAs being sold outside the current existing exotic market, we have 07grIS350 who is a first-time exotic buyer. We also had information of LFA buyers in other markets who were first-time exotic buyers. This is not conclusive, but certainly a bit of proof that LFAs are being bought by people new to exotics.

rominl

iTrader: (4)

i understand and i totally respect that. the lfa is definitely different and we definitely see lexus pulling in some new exotic owners. that's pretty nontraditional. i think to me that's what makes it interesting, especially how lexus is doing a lot of things differently.

but i think it's still ok for people to make assumptions or predictions, as long as they try to be constructive as well. whether they are right or wrong that's another story

CDNROCKIES

No disrespect intended, but why in the world would you assume that Lexus "knows what they are doing" with their very first entry into a segment that they've never been in and is extremely limited in sales and focus???

If anything it would be more realistic that they would be prone to some learning and growing pains but that seems to be lost in any LFA discussion.

TommyJames

A few things. First, when I made my first posts about the LFA way back when, I pointed out that there was no discussion in the usual places. I concluded one of two things. Either the car hadn't sold as well as they claimed, or that there was a whole new set of buyers outside of existing circles who were interested in the car. It's looking more and more like the latter is the case. This is a good thing as long as that market continues to thrive. This is why I think it's important for Lexus to not abandon the category. Right now the LFA is getting lots of press because of the strength of Toyota in media circles. Often with cars, when it's out of sight, it's out of mind and the car begins to lose brand value in a particular segment. If Lexus comes out with a follow-on, they can leverage what they learned and will have a foundation from which to move customers.

Second, Lexus has made numerous marketing missteps that even they admit in the AutoWeek article. All of these manufacturers tend to promote people from within and often they come with ZERO exotic marketing experience and lots and lots of stereotypical views about buyers. Lamborghini made the same mistake, so did Audi and so did Mercedes and when they applied their normal marketing routine it didn't work. Lexus isn't unique in that area.

As for Paris who the heck knows what that's really all about. Others have brought up individuals who bought other brands and how it doesn't impact those brands. That's true because they are already mature brands. The LFA is still defining itself within its customer base. If the car is seen with too many old guys driving it, it will be typed one way, Asians another, and so on. It's what people do- they stereotype buyers of every brand of car. Image is extremely important in automotive marketing. I once had a SC430 and that car was typed as a chick's car. Guys would ask me if I had my wife's car that day. Who knows how that happened, but that stuff matters which is why auto manufacturers work so hard to shape their brand image. As I said before, toss her in any other Lexus and she can't hurt the brand. Toss her in a guy's toy in this early stage of branding infancy and I think it's a negative.

TF109B

They give the car to buyers they want. That's knowing what they're doing. Who gives a damn if Paris has the car anyway? She isn't a teenager anymore. The crashes and stuff happened a long time ago. She looks like she might be pregnant. If that's the case there's no drinking and driving. The thing is she didn't even buy the thing, her boyfriend did. So who's to say Lexus was wrong? Not like they are going to mind. The free publicity is welcome, no matter what people think of Paris Hilton. I'm sure it's not going to 'ruin their image'. Not like she's parading around in it with a drink in her hand. It made a cameo appearance on a show she's doing. What's the big fuss?

rominl

iTrader: (4)

since you had to post this twice, i will tell you this. lexus knew the car is for paris, even though her bf got the car. and if you hear what some of the people invited to the lfa private event had to say about lexus selling a lfa to paris... let's just say i laughed inside of me. yeah, those are people lexus selected to be prospective buyers, ones that lexus attempts to sell the car to. so who's to say lexus was right? in case you want to question me, no, i didn't say one word

TF109B

Do you really care if Paris Hilton has an LFA? I don't. Good for her, she's got the money, and fame, so what? Mercedes didn't mind her having an SLR. She's bought into a MOTO GP team, seems to me it's not so bad. I think some people here are getting bent out of shape over it for no reason. I'm sure her B/F got the car because of his ties to her, more so than his other vehicles, but so what? I don't mind it, I think it's good for her and Lexus will get their name out there with her 'fans' with it, if she shows off with it.

rominl

iTrader: (4)

lol so now suddenly it goes to whether i care or not? personally i can care less what she does with her money or what she does at all, i am surprised if you have even the slightest idea about that coz' i never said so. i care about the kind of impact this might have on lexus brand and/or the car. nothing more nothing less.

in some way, i think it's more about if you don't care, then this thread shouldn't be of your concern at all, no? i can't (and i don't think anyone can) say the real impact, but i can only say so far i have heard far more negative comments about this from people around me. and i never really planned to reply until i saw you posting up your arguments twice and thought i would correct you

TF109B

Im not trying to be rude, in any way, but I'm allowed to view any thread I want, right? So what does it matter what thread I'm in or what I'm doing in it? Like this Paris Hilton thread. I come to every LFA thread, just to see what's being talked about. I want to see her LFA, and hope that each day a new post is up that I get to see it. Whether it's white or brown, I still want to see what it looks like. I have no problem with her owning an LFA, some people do. I asked you because it seemed like you were on the ropes about it. You mentioned how other people feel, who cares what others feel about it. You own a Lexus, my Uncle owns a Lexus, Paris Hilton owns a Lexus. Doesn't mean jack to me. She's just another person, maybe she's famous and is a little ditzy and isn't the best image for a brand, but is Lexus having her star in their commercials? Is she their new spokeswoman? I get it, people are a little peeved that she gets an LFA and someone like a real enthusiast with the money doesn't. But isn't there still 25 left?

I don't get the knocking of her in this thread though. I asked your opinion, you went off and said things about how people felt. I don't follow a crowd, and I assume you don't either. You said you don't care, well I feel the same way. So how is my question to you needed to be corrected? That's all I said. A question to YOU. I don't feel it's such a bad thing. Obviously others do. I think I've noticed that, from more than just this thread. But I'm not on about it. Seeing her with an LFA isn't going to determine whether or not I buy one of their cars. If Lexus feels it'll help, cool. If it doesn't, oh well. So tell me, how can a question and an opinion be 'corrected'?

TommyJames

Wow, guys arguing about Paris Hilton, amazing. I don't think people are upset that she's getting an LFA. The question is if it impacts the brand and if it's positive or negative. I don't think anyone here is otherwise upset that she has one. I think in the early stage of creating LFA-specific brand strength she doesn't help. She's never ever had a positive impact on guy stuff. She's had a huge influence on girl stuff. She's a marketing machine and anything she touches related to women sells. Everything she does, right down to who she dates is about branding and marketing and if she kept everything she "owned," "bought," or was "given" she'd have a bigger garage than Jay Leno. She makes her money by what she puts on, takes off, gets in, climbs on, and walks out of and she's effective or companies would be chasing her. One personal appearance at your restaurant can have a huge impact on your business. All that aside, seeing her with an LFA chickifies the car. That's the point.

TommyJames

Again I keep saying this over and over we're talking about EARLY brand image, not ESTABLISHED brand image. EARLY brand images are fragile because there are fewer brand reference points sets in consumer minds. ESTABLISHED brand images are not, but that too can be a problem when someone like Lexus wants to be seen more as a performance brand. The LFA is an EARLY brand the 360 is an ESTABLISHED brand.

Carl's Jr is a guy's brand? Really? We don't have them up here.

TommyJames

I too had an SC430 and I didn't let it bother me but when I tell others I had one, they often roll their eyes. I still didn't care, but some do. People are going to type anything you drive. It's not so much the point when those who don't care about such things, but there are many buyers who do. In Seattle the SC430s are mostly driven by women. It was a popular car among with the female managers at Microsoft. Still, I had fun with mine.