Help me decide (IS350 vs. S3)
02-11-15, 08:56 AM
#31
Anyway, I think anyone cross shopping should drive both, and try to spend a day or two with both if the dealer allows it. This will help them to make a good decision.
02-11-15, 11:34 AM
#32
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What exactly is biased about what I said? I outright said your experience is gonna depend on different factors. I've owned a Dodge, an Audi, this Lexus, a Mazda, and two Hondas (I still have one Honda and the Mazda in fact!). I don't think I have that much motivation to be biased. There are good and bad things about the dealers for all of them. And as I stated, my experience with the Audi dealer in my area was more like your claimed Lexus dealer experience, however I also stated I haven't had any real problems to take to my Lexus dealer so I can't speak to that for them. Only that the experience I have had with them thus far was fine. Point being, it is all anecdotal. Since we're pointing fingers, are you a biased Audi guy from an Audi forum? Your accusation kind of reads like it 
Maybe you have me confused with someone else in this thread you argued with. 
My experience with Audi dealer service, corporate care, and product reliability was just within the past year and like I said I wasn't impressed. Everyone is going to have a different experience though. Some folks never have problems, and some are unlucky. However, it's kind of hard to ignore the long term surveys some other folks have pointed out here.
Maybe you have me confused with someone else in this thread you argued with. My experience with Audi dealer service, corporate care, and product reliability was just within the past year and like I said I wasn't impressed. Everyone is going to have a different experience though. Some folks never have problems, and some are unlucky. However, it's kind of hard to ignore the long term surveys some other folks have pointed out here.
02-11-15, 11:37 AM
#33
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I love the car, and I also love the 3IS. I do really enjoy that the 3IS aftermarket is so big it allows me to have fun messing with and customizing the car in a way that the audi does not. I don't want to void the warranty so i will not tune for now, and wheels and stuff for the audi are priced ludicrously, so i can't justify 10K for wheel set when with 10K i can make the lexus so mine. lol.
Anyway, I think anyone cross shopping should drive both, and try to spend a day or two with both if the dealer allows it. This will help them to make a good decision.
Anyway, I think anyone cross shopping should drive both, and try to spend a day or two with both if the dealer allows it. This will help them to make a good decision.
Do you really think people buying RS7 will cross shop it with 3IS 350?
02-11-15, 11:56 AM
#34
no no, when i said cross shop i meant cross shop the 3is with the s3/s4 if they are interested in an audi.
02-11-15, 12:12 PM
#35
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Thanks for all the reply's. I don't see myself doing much in the way of mods on either car...maybe tint, wheels, and exhaust (on the IS as it's quiet). I already have a 1995 Porsche 911 C4 (993 model) as my fun car. I want to keep it simple as my current DD is a Tacoma, and I went crazy modding it, and now that I'm 37 I don't really feel the urge to do so. I want a car that pretty much from the factory will be almost perfect without too much fuss and money. My heart says to get the S3 because it's much more thrilling to drive, but I'm just so used to Japanese vehicle reliability. I have a few friends in my Porsche circle with Audi's (RS4, S4, A4's) and they have all had really good luck with theirs, other than the RS4 having to have carbon build up removed at 80,000 kms. The Lexus dealership we bought my Wife's NX from has been really great, and have offered me around $4500 off the IS, and the Audi dealer has lowered the price $1000 on the S3, as well as will throw in 4 years of free services. Accounting this, the Audi is still a bit cheaper. Either way both cars are going to have to be ordered in, and will arrive some time in early June, but I have to have my order in by months end to get them by that date. Decisions, decisions.
02-11-15, 12:21 PM
#36
Thanks for all the reply's. I don't see myself doing much in the way of mods on either car...maybe tint, wheels, and exhaust (on the IS as it's quiet). I already have a 1995 Porsche 911 C4 (993 model) as my fun car. I want to keep it simple as my current DD is a Tacoma, and I went crazy modding it, and now that I'm 37 I don't really feel the urge to do so. I want a car that pretty much from the factory will be almost perfect without too much fuss and money. My heart says to get the S3 because it's much more thrilling to drive, but I'm just so used to Japanese vehicle reliability. I have a few friends in my Porsche circle with Audi's (RS4, S4, A4's) and they have all had really good luck with theirs, other than the RS4 having to have carbon build up removed at 80,000 kms. The Lexus dealership we bought my Wife's NX from has been really great, and have offered me around $4500 off the IS, and the Audi dealer has lowered the price $1000 on the S3, as well as will throw in 4 years of free services. Accounting this, the Audi is still a bit cheaper. Either way both cars are going to have to be ordered in, and will arrive some time in early June, but I have to have my order in by months end to get them by that date. Decisions, decisions.
02-11-15, 03:28 PM
#37
I agree they are both great cars.
Just to add to this and make the decision even harder, lol, is that you may want to consider the S4 as it leases out at the same price as the S3 and there have been alot less problems with the 3.0T engine.
Keep in mind the S4 is built on an audi exclusive platform and uses the far superior TorSen center differential that is actually a bit RWD biased. It's a really nice setup.
The S3 actually shares the Volkswagen Golf platform. It is FWD biased and uses the haldex awd that is 100% FWD biased until it detects slippage. You could actually consider saving some coin if you are not into name plates and go with the Golf R which uses the exact same chassis, the same engine, the same transmission. Its just a cosmetic difference.
Just something to consider.
Also I would consider not modifying the exhaust on the S3. The other poster who stated that Audi will TD1 (void) the warranty based on visual inspections was not posting "biased opinions" lol he was trying to help you out Audi has a real live genuine TSB (not a biased opinion) saying exactly that. They will TD1 flag warranties on cars that are tuned but also on cars that do not pass a visual inspection of aftermarket parts. Here is the letter....
http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...=1#post7371880
They are quite serious about the modders lol.
And again, I love audi. To me I say screw the warranty and pay to play because they are great cars to make go fast. You just need to have the money as a just in case. I have been a product tester for APR products, i'm the first person to upgrade the internals on B8 A4 TFSI engine, and have at least 4 Audi tshirts in my drawers, lol, and have an audi mechanics smock. I also am a member of the NA Quattro Club, am one of the first 4000 member of audizine since 2004 and I have attended the 12 hours of Lemans Race as a guest of the audi corral every year since 2005. If anything I am one of the most biased people in favor of Audi lol.
Here was my S4
Mike
Just to add to this and make the decision even harder, lol, is that you may want to consider the S4 as it leases out at the same price as the S3 and there have been alot less problems with the 3.0T engine.
Keep in mind the S4 is built on an audi exclusive platform and uses the far superior TorSen center differential that is actually a bit RWD biased. It's a really nice setup.
The S3 actually shares the Volkswagen Golf platform. It is FWD biased and uses the haldex awd that is 100% FWD biased until it detects slippage. You could actually consider saving some coin if you are not into name plates and go with the Golf R which uses the exact same chassis, the same engine, the same transmission. Its just a cosmetic difference.
Just something to consider.
Also I would consider not modifying the exhaust on the S3. The other poster who stated that Audi will TD1 (void) the warranty based on visual inspections was not posting "biased opinions" lol he was trying to help you out Audi has a real live genuine TSB (not a biased opinion) saying exactly that. They will TD1 flag warranties on cars that are tuned but also on cars that do not pass a visual inspection of aftermarket parts. Here is the letter....
http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...=1#post7371880
They are quite serious about the modders lol.
And again, I love audi. To me I say screw the warranty and pay to play because they are great cars to make go fast. You just need to have the money as a just in case. I have been a product tester for APR products, i'm the first person to upgrade the internals on B8 A4 TFSI engine, and have at least 4 Audi tshirts in my drawers, lol, and have an audi mechanics smock. I also am a member of the NA Quattro Club, am one of the first 4000 member of audizine since 2004 and I have attended the 12 hours of Lemans Race as a guest of the audi corral every year since 2005. If anything I am one of the most biased people in favor of Audi lol.
Here was my S4
Mike
Last edited by bhvrdr; 02-11-15 at 03:47 PM.
02-11-15, 05:14 PM
#38
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I considered the S4, as it comes with a manual transmission which I prefer. Problem is used ones in my area are still the same price as a new S3, and it's the last year of the design, while the IS and S3 are new designs. I wouldn't **** to lease a car, as I buy them and keep them 6-8 years, so I have to make the right decision. I looked into the Golf R, but it isn't even for order here yet, and dealer said it'll start at $44,000k with only DSG and no sun roof for at least 6 months. Also, don't think I'm a hatchback type of guy... Sedan only.
02-11-15, 05:47 PM
#39
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Something to keep in mind, TD1 does not necessarily mean Audi voids warranty. It is just a flag due to modification on Audi factory specs. In reality it is not that strict as members above suggest. It all depends on an Audi dealer and the relationship the customer has developed with that dealer. Even if an Audi vehicle has a flashed ECU system and other hardware modifications, Audi dealers won't automatically flag the car with TD1. It is only when an owner has a specific problem with powertrain, say engine, then the dealer connects the computer (because they are required to do so) and only then is TD1 likely to be issued on that vehicle. Again, there are tons of ways how to avoid this problem. You can always reflash it back to stock ECU before you visit the dealer and everything should be ok. Some dealers develop good relationship with customers and they willingly can close their eyes on those mods and run the warranties without any issues.
Last but not least, even if the car has been flagged with TD1 remember the burden of proof is on manufacturer to proof that the modification was the exact cause of failure of a certain part of the car. In other words if something is wrong with suspension and the car had ECU flashed, the manufacturer does not have the right to deny warranty. So in practice Audi won't even find out about the modded ECU because the dealer will not connect the car to the computer just because of the suspension failure. So you get my point here. The bottom line, Audis very commonly modified and many dealers are aware of this despite that most, I repeat most, Audi owners get away with it quite easily. I am talking from my own experience, gentlemen.
Last but not least, even if the car has been flagged with TD1 remember the burden of proof is on manufacturer to proof that the modification was the exact cause of failure of a certain part of the car. In other words if something is wrong with suspension and the car had ECU flashed, the manufacturer does not have the right to deny warranty. So in practice Audi won't even find out about the modded ECU because the dealer will not connect the car to the computer just because of the suspension failure. So you get my point here. The bottom line, Audis very commonly modified and many dealers are aware of this despite that most, I repeat most, Audi owners get away with it quite easily. I am talking from my own experience, gentlemen.
Last edited by salvadorik; 02-11-15 at 07:16 PM.
02-11-15, 06:01 PM
#40
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I don't intend on doing tunes on either car. I want the cars to perform well stock. Might get different wheels, tint windows, and possibly put a louder exhaust on the IS as I find it too quiet stock. The S3 sounds perfect stock to me, and is fast enough for me no doubt. If only the Is had say 50-70 more HP I would just buy it, as I like the look inside and outside, and the warranty is better. Just don't want to buy something and get bored with it because it doesn't have enough go.
02-11-15, 06:08 PM
#41
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I don't intend on doing tunes on either car. I want the cars to perform well stock. Might get different wheels, tint windows, and possibly put a louder exhaust on the IS as I find it too quiet stock. The S3 sounds perfect stock to me, and is fast enough for me no doubt. If only the Is had say 50-70 more HP I would just buy it, as I like the look inside and outside, and the warranty is better. Just don't want to buy something and get bored with it because it doesn't have enough go.
02-11-15, 06:17 PM
#42
You started your first sentence by criticizing Audi and/or service provided by Audi. "I know folks who have gotten manually flagged upon physical inspection even after being flashed back by the shop, so YMMV." And then you went on using the same path i.e. criticizing Audi. Then you quoted me and replied to me explaining that you had bad experience with Audi and CR survey is irrelevant for long term use reliability indication as others said because of the 12month survey being too short. From your first sentence I immediately saw where you were going with your post cause from the beginning till the very end it had a consistent anti Audi content. This is why I called you biased. Perhaps I was wrong saying reason why you were biased, for which I apologize. But now it seems pretty obvious is because of your personal bad experience that you had with you A4. That is understandable.
Just for example, your complaint of my first sentence. The sentence is based in fact. Some people do get burned by the TD1 flag. Not everybody does, but some do. I didn't see anyone going around calling you "biased" just because you think Lexus dealer service is subpar. Some Lexus dealers likely do have subpar service. Chill out a bit.
02-11-15, 06:19 PM
#43
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The problem you have here is that you're acting like you need to be Audi's defense force. Whether or not someone has a particular opinion on Audi is irrelevant if they're stating facts and factual experiences rather than just subjective opinions. If you cannot speak to the content of a post, then just don't reply to it. Attacking other people's character isn't really necessary.
Just for example, your complaint of my first sentence. The sentence is based in fact. Some people do get burned by the TD1 flag. Not everybody does, but some do. I didn't see anyone going around calling you "biased" just because you think Lexus dealer service is subpar. Some Lexus dealers likely do have subpar service. Chill out a bit.
Just for example, your complaint of my first sentence. The sentence is based in fact. Some people do get burned by the TD1 flag. Not everybody does, but some do. I didn't see anyone going around calling you "biased" just because you think Lexus dealer service is subpar. Some Lexus dealers likely do have subpar service. Chill out a bit.
02-11-15, 06:21 PM
#44
02-11-15, 06:27 PM
#45
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I don't think it is a "problem" if I don't side with Lexus even on Lexus forum. I don't think it is a "problem" if I advocate Audi. OP asked the legitimate question as what people recommend, even though OP acknowledged the possibility of the answers to be Lexus biased because it is posted on Lexus forum. I believe it is totally fine and acceptable to advocate one make over the other provided the valid reasons are given. In my opinion I truly believe that S3 is superior vehicle than 3IS 350. And in general Audi is superior than Lexus. This is my opinion and you are welcome to disagree. But I don't think it is a "problem" to have that opinion, now is it?