Glashub

2014 Results LUXURY CAR (over $50k) AJAC
http://www.ajac.ca/web/ccoty/2014/co...ry.asp?cat=169

Let me ask you this @dbs600 -- why do you think Lexus doesn't include a luxury package with the F-sport. What do you think their reasoning is? Why would a multi-billion dollar company pass up opportunity to sell cars like BMW and MB in your opinion?

dbs600

The vehicles listed in the link above are not all direct competitors with one another.

Otherwise, I answered your questions above at the end of my second to last post above.

Ramon

Not sure how credible that is considering "iPhone" isn't a brand

Ramon

They clearly don't have the confidence in their own brand to do what BMW does. Personally I'd rather have Lexus come out with a cheaper, higher volume vehicle than to build a lower quality IS with missing features.

SNiiP3R

iTrader: (3)

That list is all over the place. Those cars are not even in the same class. Who compares cars like that? If they compare luxury cars over $50,000, then where is BMW 5/7, Lexus GS / LS, MBenz S class ?

SNiiP3R

iTrader: (3)

You guys are missing the point here. What Lexus has accomplished in 20 something years, took others nearly 75. Lexus was the top selling luxury brand in the US for 11 years, until the earthquake shook Japan in 2010. You have to understand that Lexus has a different business model, so comparing them to BMW or MB is pointless.

eyeball

You're right. I remember in 1993-1994 everyone started oohing and ahhiing at all the Lexus cars that were available at that time. That's a meteoric rise

Ramon

Back then, they offered more for less compared to other premium brands and more for more compared to non-premium brands. Today, they are offering less for less when compared to the other premium brands and less for more when compared to non-premium brands.

eyeball

That's true, too! I couldn't believe I saw BSM on a Kia Sorrento's side mirror the other day!

SNiiP3R

iTrader: (3)

Maybe it depends on a model? But when I did the comparison between the GS and the 5 series, similarly equipped BMW always came out $10,000+ more than Lexus.

dbs600

How is comparing Lexus to Mercedes-Benz and BMW pointless? If so, who are they supposed to be compared with, only Infiniti and Acura? Are you saying the IS is not direct competition for the C-Class or 3 Series?

Variations in 'corporate business model' or product pricing does not mean their product lines are not direct competitors. Mercedes-Benz has traditionally carried a premium over similarly equipped BMW's. Are they not direct competitors?

The target market for the IS is the same as that for the C and 3, the GS as that for the E and 5, the LS as that for the S and 7 and so on.

CtSFox

In the same vein, a similarly equipped 3 series was about eight grand more than my IS350 F Sport

SNiiP3R

iTrader: (3)

All I said was that comparing their 'business models' is pointless. Unlike Lexus, Germans nowadays are making cars for every niche. If we go back 10 years, we had 3/5/6/7 series compared to 1/2/3/4/5/6/7 today. Not to mention all the SUVs out there. Lexus clearly has a different business model than its German rivals. Instead of expanding their lineup, Lexus is doing the opposite. Just look at the list of models that are gone from the lineup, SC / HS / IS-F / GS460.

McBrain

That is the list of the most soul-less cars available over $55K. Wait, the Datsun Q50 is $55K? Oh my. I guess I just have no taste. Seriously, that list is just ghastly.

dbs600

Oh, okay, sorry, I misunderstood and agree, completely! Aside from that, the 1 Series is now the 2 Series and the 3 Series Coupe is now the 4 Series, so w/r/t the line-up mentioned, nothing's changed, but you're right, Lexus has kept a focused line-up (Small, Medium and Large Sedans and Small, Medium and Large SUV's) and Mercedes-Benz and BMW are all over the place with the likes of the ugly GLK, X1 and now CLA. Otherwise, I see revival of the SC on the horizon, the HS was a blip (similar to the BMW ActiveE), the IS-F will surely be back and do you mean GS430? I don't see that as having gone away, as the GS is still around and the GS450h is its successor.

After years of stagnation, I see bright times ahead for Lexus; trapezoid grill started it all.