A small review of the IS300h.
09-08-13, 12:00 AM
#62
Lead Lap
Thread Starter
I ended up purchasing another IS250 a while ago.
I did test the IS300h on business in the UK, but it is a case of horses for courses.
If you are into fuel economy, and fold down rear seats, then buy the IS300h.
If you want silky smooth power delivery, and a truly smooth ride with no bump thump from the run flat tires, then buy the 250.
The hybrid idles like a six, and drives around town like a six, perhaps better bottom end torque too.
However, once the gas pedal is floored, the four cylinder engine rears its head, with less instant response, less power, and coarse revs.
Also, because the hybrid has the battery placed in the spare tire compartment, in place of a spare tire, the hybrid must use run flats - which have a knobby ride.
In its current 2.5L 4 cylinder hybrid form overseas, I would NOT recommend Lexus waste their time importing the IS300h to the USA.
IMO, this four pot hybrid won't sell in the US.
I would recommend that 4 cylinder hybrids be prohibited from the IS range, and that it was replace by either a 2.5L V6 hybrid, or even Lexus 3.0L V6 hybrid, with the battery placed in the same location as the GS450h, and the use of a full size spare tire, and conventional non-run flat tires for a superior ride.
Only then could the hybid, or hypothetical IS350h, or hypothetical IS400h be imported to the US.
Americans like a slick engine and a plush ride; or maybe they don't necessarily like, but I do.
I personally chose the 250 over the 350, because the 250 is adequate around town, and spins smoothly and quietly.
I found that the 350 was mainly top end torque; normally a 3.5 is much gruntier down low, and the 350 was noticeably coarser and louder to rev, so I personally gave the 350 a miss.
The 3.5 seems to be much quicker and quieter in the 4GS.
Horses for courses really.
Just depends what is most important to the buyer.
They are all good models, but in different ways...
I did test the IS300h on business in the UK, but it is a case of horses for courses.
If you are into fuel economy, and fold down rear seats, then buy the IS300h.
If you want silky smooth power delivery, and a truly smooth ride with no bump thump from the run flat tires, then buy the 250.
The hybrid idles like a six, and drives around town like a six, perhaps better bottom end torque too.
However, once the gas pedal is floored, the four cylinder engine rears its head, with less instant response, less power, and coarse revs.
Also, because the hybrid has the battery placed in the spare tire compartment, in place of a spare tire, the hybrid must use run flats - which have a knobby ride.
In its current 2.5L 4 cylinder hybrid form overseas, I would NOT recommend Lexus waste their time importing the IS300h to the USA.
IMO, this four pot hybrid won't sell in the US.
I would recommend that 4 cylinder hybrids be prohibited from the IS range, and that it was replace by either a 2.5L V6 hybrid, or even Lexus 3.0L V6 hybrid, with the battery placed in the same location as the GS450h, and the use of a full size spare tire, and conventional non-run flat tires for a superior ride.
Only then could the hybid, or hypothetical IS350h, or hypothetical IS400h be imported to the US.
Americans like a slick engine and a plush ride; or maybe they don't necessarily like, but I do.
I personally chose the 250 over the 350, because the 250 is adequate around town, and spins smoothly and quietly.
I found that the 350 was mainly top end torque; normally a 3.5 is much gruntier down low, and the 350 was noticeably coarser and louder to rev, so I personally gave the 350 a miss.
The 3.5 seems to be much quicker and quieter in the 4GS.
Horses for courses really.
Just depends what is most important to the buyer.
They are all good models, but in different ways...
JHS82 and peteharvey.
This also depends a bit on where you live.
I'm very glad they have placed a 4 sylinder engine in the 300h.
This actually makes the car affordable here in norway. The last IS model did start at almost 70000£ where as the new starts at 40000£. Becuase of the hybrid solution and the smaller engine.
The GS 450h starts at 85000£ here. The new GS 300h will start at 55000£. So there is a reason for all this hybrid stuff.
The IS250 is not even sold in norway due to high emissons and very hig taxes.
Also, the is300h does not run on runflat tires. It has standard bridgestone turanza tires, and a tire repare kit in the back. No harsher ride than in the IS250.
Why on earth should the 4 sylinder be prohibited? It is a good ride, and when it comes to sales in the US. They buy a ton of priuses over there. If any cars lacks power it is the prius. The IS 300h is a preformance car if you compare them.
Jhs82.
Put the car in sport+ mode. Then it will never run on just the electrical enigne.
Turning of the EV mode in the screen just turns of the light, not the mode
09-08-13, 12:11 AM
#63
09-08-13, 11:53 AM
#64
Lead Lap
Thread Starter
Tried to put it in sport mode then?
The manual states that the enigne power is always avalible in sport mode, and if you throw the shifter in S and downshift with the paddles. Then you'll also have a boost of power avalible.
I haven't explored this to much, as I try to drive the car more normally and keep the fuel consumption low.
I think the car inspires to drive comfortable, not aggresive.
The manual states that the enigne power is always avalible in sport mode, and if you throw the shifter in S and downshift with the paddles. Then you'll also have a boost of power avalible.
I haven't explored this to much, as I try to drive the car more normally and keep the fuel consumption low.
I think the car inspires to drive comfortable, not aggresive.
09-08-13, 12:00 PM
#65
I agree fully.
09-14-13, 02:29 PM
#66
Rookie
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Northern Ireland
Posts: 77
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I've had my 300h for 1500 miles now.
If it is underpowered, those other cars must be monsters!
Actually I don't find it underpowered at all; I think it's more than the response is so quiet and efficient that you don't notice the power.
The truth is I still can't wait to get in the car every time I drive it. To deliver such a stunning car at over 50mpg (real world) is a stunning achievement.
If it is underpowered, those other cars must be monsters!
Actually I don't find it underpowered at all; I think it's more than the response is so quiet and efficient that you don't notice the power.
The truth is I still can't wait to get in the car every time I drive it. To deliver such a stunning car at over 50mpg (real world) is a stunning achievement.
09-14-13, 06:23 PM
#67
I've had my 300h for 1500 miles now.
If it is underpowered, those other cars must be monsters!
Actually I don't find it underpowered at all; I think it's more than the response is so quiet and efficient that you don't notice the power.
The truth is I still can't wait to get in the car every time I drive it. To deliver such a stunning car at over 50mpg (real world) is a stunning achievement.
If it is underpowered, those other cars must be monsters!
Actually I don't find it underpowered at all; I think it's more than the response is so quiet and efficient that you don't notice the power.
The truth is I still can't wait to get in the car every time I drive it. To deliver such a stunning car at over 50mpg (real world) is a stunning achievement.
Both the GS450h's performance, and driveline vibration and refinement leave the IS300h 2.5L 4 pot behind for dead!
The IS300h 2.5L 4 pot hybrid is good, but compared to the GS450h, the IS hybrid could have been even better with a 2.5L V6 hybrid combo.
Of course it's horses for courses; there are advantages and disadvantages to each design.
In an ideal world, both hybrid options in 2.5L V6 hybrid and 2.5L 4 cylinder hybrid would be available.
The 2.5L 4 cylinder hybrid would excel in lower purchase, and lower running costs through superior fuel economy, while the 2.5L V6 hybrid would excel in superior performance, power delivery and refinement.
The other advantage of Lexus using a 2.5L V6 hybrid, is that it helps to distinguish Lexus from the Toyota Camry 2.5L 4 pot hybrid!
Because gasoline is considerably more expensive in Europe, perhaps the IS300h in 2.5L 4 cylinder is a superior choice in Europe.
That's probably why there is no IS300h here in the US.
If they did bring an IS hybrid into the States, it would probably have to be an IS450h 3.5L V6 hybrid, or even an IS350h with a 3.0L V6 hybrid, but that would force Lexus to engineer a 3.0 V6, which they have had in the past, and I'm sure they can do.
It would be nice to see Lexus with more engine choices...
09-15-13, 02:36 AM
#68
Have you ever driven the GS450h?
Both the GS450h's performance, and driveline vibration and refinement leave the IS300h 2.5L 4 pot behind for dead!
The IS300h 2.5L 4 pot hybrid is good, but compared to the GS450h, the IS hybrid could have been even better with a 2.5L V6 hybrid combo.
Of course it's horses for courses; there are advantages and disadvantages to each design.
In an ideal world, both hybrid options in 2.5L V6 hybrid and 2.5L 4 cylinder hybrid would be available.
The 2.5L 4 cylinder hybrid would excel in lower purchase, and lower running costs through superior fuel economy, while the 2.5L V6 hybrid would excel in superior performance, power delivery and refinement.
The other advantage of Lexus using a 2.5L V6 hybrid, is that it helps to distinguish Lexus from the Toyota Camry 2.5L 4 pot hybrid!
Because gasoline is considerably more expensive in Europe, perhaps the IS300h in 2.5L 4 cylinder is a superior choice in Europe.
That's probably why there is no IS300h here in the US.
If they did bring an IS hybrid into the States, it would probably have to be an IS450h 3.5L V6 hybrid, or even an IS350h with a 3.0L V6 hybrid, but that would force Lexus to engineer a 3.0 V6, which they have had in the past, and I'm sure they can do.
It would be nice to see Lexus with more engine choices...
Both the GS450h's performance, and driveline vibration and refinement leave the IS300h 2.5L 4 pot behind for dead!
The IS300h 2.5L 4 pot hybrid is good, but compared to the GS450h, the IS hybrid could have been even better with a 2.5L V6 hybrid combo.
Of course it's horses for courses; there are advantages and disadvantages to each design.
In an ideal world, both hybrid options in 2.5L V6 hybrid and 2.5L 4 cylinder hybrid would be available.
The 2.5L 4 cylinder hybrid would excel in lower purchase, and lower running costs through superior fuel economy, while the 2.5L V6 hybrid would excel in superior performance, power delivery and refinement.
The other advantage of Lexus using a 2.5L V6 hybrid, is that it helps to distinguish Lexus from the Toyota Camry 2.5L 4 pot hybrid!
Because gasoline is considerably more expensive in Europe, perhaps the IS300h in 2.5L 4 cylinder is a superior choice in Europe.
That's probably why there is no IS300h here in the US.
If they did bring an IS hybrid into the States, it would probably have to be an IS450h 3.5L V6 hybrid, or even an IS350h with a 3.0L V6 hybrid, but that would force Lexus to engineer a 3.0 V6, which they have had in the past, and I'm sure they can do.
It would be nice to see Lexus with more engine choices...
According to me the problem isn't the 4 cyl petrol engine. It's the electric motor. I would like the 200hp electric motor and higher voltage that the GS have. that would be enough to make it a "IS350h".
Also, since it's a CVT, the electric motor should be engaged more easily in higher speeds than 50km/h too (I've gotten it to run on electric only up to 70km/h in very light down hill).
09-15-13, 04:28 AM
#69
Lead Lap
Thread Starter
As long as you can let go of the trottle in slight down hill, the car only runs on electric power. It actualy coasts, and the equipment runs on the electric power.
If you need power ower 70km/h the car will turn on the engine.
However, if you put the car in eco mode, the car will more use the electric enigne alone more often than in normal mode.
The car could always have been made better. But if you compare the price to what you get in countries where the car taxes are high, the hybrid makes sence.
And you also get the benefit of low fuel consumption from the drive train. About 5l\100km in average.
If the car would have had a bigger enigne like the gs450h, the platform would have to be desgined completly different, to fit the bigger electric engine, the bigger battery pack and the bigger v6 petrol enigne.
The battery pack are placed in the spare wheel well today, so it can fit in the standard IS chassie.
It would be more expensive if you would have to re design the whole car to fit the hybrid version.
A small price comparison from where I live.
The IS300h starts at 40000£.
The GS450h starts at about 85000£.
The new GS300h will start at about 55000£
Also, the new Gs300h is said to have a fuel conspumtion at about 5l\100km.
The current Gs450h is to have a fuel consumption at about 7l\100km. (real life numbers)
But yes, it would be nice to see the lexus with more enignes, especially in EU where we don't get the 350.
However, if the price gets higher due to the cost of development, I do not think it is worth it.
If the price stays the same, it would be nice to see an F version like the new yaris R concept, that uses more elctric engines to get a lot of power combined with a turbo charged petrol enigne.
Also a plug in version would be interesting. Something that could run about 50-80 km on pure electric power. And that you can charge form a socket.
For longer trips you would use the enigne like the normal hybrid. Like the chevrolet Volt and the prius plug in.
Maybe even an electric version similar to the tesla model S.
If you need power ower 70km/h the car will turn on the engine.
However, if you put the car in eco mode, the car will more use the electric enigne alone more often than in normal mode.
The car could always have been made better. But if you compare the price to what you get in countries where the car taxes are high, the hybrid makes sence.
And you also get the benefit of low fuel consumption from the drive train. About 5l\100km in average.
If the car would have had a bigger enigne like the gs450h, the platform would have to be desgined completly different, to fit the bigger electric engine, the bigger battery pack and the bigger v6 petrol enigne.
The battery pack are placed in the spare wheel well today, so it can fit in the standard IS chassie.
It would be more expensive if you would have to re design the whole car to fit the hybrid version.
A small price comparison from where I live.
The IS300h starts at 40000£.
The GS450h starts at about 85000£.
The new GS300h will start at about 55000£
Also, the new Gs300h is said to have a fuel conspumtion at about 5l\100km.
The current Gs450h is to have a fuel consumption at about 7l\100km. (real life numbers)
But yes, it would be nice to see the lexus with more enignes, especially in EU where we don't get the 350.
However, if the price gets higher due to the cost of development, I do not think it is worth it.
If the price stays the same, it would be nice to see an F version like the new yaris R concept, that uses more elctric engines to get a lot of power combined with a turbo charged petrol enigne.
Also a plug in version would be interesting. Something that could run about 50-80 km on pure electric power. And that you can charge form a socket.
For longer trips you would use the enigne like the normal hybrid. Like the chevrolet Volt and the prius plug in.
Maybe even an electric version similar to the tesla model S.
09-15-13, 05:54 AM
#70
As long as you can let go of the trottle in slight down hill, the car only runs on electric power. It actualy coasts, and the equipment runs on the electric power.
If you need power ower 70km/h the car will turn on the engine.
However, if you put the car in eco mode, the car will more use the electric enigne alone more often than in normal mode.
If you need power ower 70km/h the car will turn on the engine.
However, if you put the car in eco mode, the car will more use the electric enigne alone more often than in normal mode.
Eco mode is unavailable at speeds over 45 km/h.
If the car would have had a bigger enigne like the gs450h, the platform would have to be desgined completly different, to fit the bigger electric engine, the bigger battery pack and the bigger v6 petrol enigne.
The battery pack are placed in the spare wheel well today, so it can fit in the standard IS chassie.
It would be more expensive if you would have to re design the whole car to fit the hybrid version.
The battery pack are placed in the spare wheel well today, so it can fit in the standard IS chassie.
It would be more expensive if you would have to re design the whole car to fit the hybrid version.
A small price comparison from where I live.
The IS300h starts at 40000£.
The GS450h starts at about 85000£.
The new GS300h will start at about 55000£
Also, the new Gs300h is said to have a fuel conspumtion at about 5l\100km.
The current Gs450h is to have a fuel consumption at about 7l\100km. (real life numbers)
But yes, it would be nice to see the lexus with more enignes, especially in EU where we don't get the 350.
However, if the price gets higher due to the cost of development, I do not think it is worth it.
If the price stays the same, it would be nice to see an F version like the new yaris R concept, that uses more elctric engines to get a lot of power combined with a turbo charged petrol enigne.
Also a plug in version would be interesting. Something that could run about 50-80 km on pure electric power. And that you can charge form a socket.
For longer trips you would use the enigne like the normal hybrid. Like the chevrolet Volt and the prius plug in.
Maybe even an electric version similar to the tesla model S.
The IS300h starts at 40000£.
The GS450h starts at about 85000£.
The new GS300h will start at about 55000£
Also, the new Gs300h is said to have a fuel conspumtion at about 5l\100km.
The current Gs450h is to have a fuel consumption at about 7l\100km. (real life numbers)
But yes, it would be nice to see the lexus with more enignes, especially in EU where we don't get the 350.
However, if the price gets higher due to the cost of development, I do not think it is worth it.
If the price stays the same, it would be nice to see an F version like the new yaris R concept, that uses more elctric engines to get a lot of power combined with a turbo charged petrol enigne.
Also a plug in version would be interesting. Something that could run about 50-80 km on pure electric power. And that you can charge form a socket.
For longer trips you would use the enigne like the normal hybrid. Like the chevrolet Volt and the prius plug in.
Maybe even an electric version similar to the tesla model S.
Plug in version would be great. A full battery every morning would improve my consumtion a lot.
Tesla Model S P85 is one of the best cars you can get today. If i had the possibilities to charge my car over night, and the money, i might got a Tesla S instead of the Lexus. However, the Tesla has not yet been available for purchase in Sweden. And the price tag might be quite steep.
09-15-13, 07:42 AM
#71
Lead Lap
Thread Starter
I was able to apply some power at 70 km/h and still only run on electric power. But the balance is really tight.
Eco mode is unavailable at speeds over 45 km/h.
Turbo is the wrong way to go since the engine turns on and off a lot while driving.
Plug in version would be great. A full battery every morning would improve my consumtion a lot.
Tesla Model S P85 is one of the best cars you can get today. If i had the possibilities to charge my car over night, and the money, i might got a Tesla S instead of the Lexus. However, the Tesla has not yet been available for purchase in Sweden. And the price tag might be quite steep.
Eco mode is unavailable at speeds over 45 km/h.
Turbo is the wrong way to go since the engine turns on and off a lot while driving.
Plug in version would be great. A full battery every morning would improve my consumtion a lot.
Tesla Model S P85 is one of the best cars you can get today. If i had the possibilities to charge my car over night, and the money, i might got a Tesla S instead of the Lexus. However, the Tesla has not yet been available for purchase in Sweden. And the price tag might be quite steep.
Eco mode is unavailable at speeds over 45 km/h.
However, as I stated in my previous post.
If you put the car in eco mode, it will run more often in just electric mode. Also over 70 km\h.
But it feels slow and unresponsive.
I can partially agree with you that turbo has a disadvantage because the enigne stops all the time. But most modern diesel engines are also turbo equipped, and almost all of them has a start\stop function for city driving.
The price tag is very different on the different cars and different coutries. In norway electric cars is cheap, as they have no taxes.
The tesla S starts at about 550.000kr while the lexus GS450h starts at 850.000kr.
The lexus IS 300h starts at 400.000kr.
A fully laoded F-sport GS is about 1.000.000kr. A fully loaded tesla S is about 700.000kr.
A fully loaded IS 300h f-sport is about 550.000kr
It makes the tesla a very good alternative to other premium cars in norway. We also get the quick chargers spread across the country, so the car can be charged 80% in 30 minutes.
Actually the Tesla S was norways most selling car in august and september.
I believe the next step for lexus would be a plug in version on most their hybrid series.
Most trips made by avarge people are under 80 km long, and my driving pattern is pretty avarge.
If they made a plug in version with 80 km range, I could probably go 4-6 months without filling up the gas tank
09-15-13, 12:25 PM
#72
No. eco mode is avalible all the time. The EV mode is what you are refering to, and that is not avalible over 45-50 km\h.
However, as I stated in my previous post.
If you put the car in eco mode, it will run more often in just electric mode. Also over 70 km\h.
But it feels slow and unresponsive.
I can partially agree with you that turbo has a disadvantage because the enigne stops all the time. But most modern diesel engines are also turbo equipped, and almost all of them has a start\stop function for city driving.
The price tag is very different on the different cars and different coutries. In norway electric cars is cheap, as they have no taxes.
The tesla S starts at about 550.000kr while the lexus GS450h starts at 850.000kr.
The lexus IS 300h starts at 400.000kr.
A fully laoded F-sport GS is about 1.000.000kr. A fully loaded tesla S is about 700.000kr.
A fully loaded IS 300h f-sport is about 550.000kr
It makes the tesla a very good alternative to other premium cars in norway. We also get the quick chargers spread across the country, so the car can be charged 80% in 30 minutes.
Actually the Tesla S was norways most selling car in august and september.
I believe the next step for lexus would be a plug in version on most their hybrid series.
Most trips made by avarge people are under 80 km long, and my driving pattern is pretty avarge.
If they made a plug in version with 80 km range, I could probably go 4-6 months without filling up the gas tank
However, as I stated in my previous post.
If you put the car in eco mode, it will run more often in just electric mode. Also over 70 km\h.
But it feels slow and unresponsive.
I can partially agree with you that turbo has a disadvantage because the enigne stops all the time. But most modern diesel engines are also turbo equipped, and almost all of them has a start\stop function for city driving.
The price tag is very different on the different cars and different coutries. In norway electric cars is cheap, as they have no taxes.
The tesla S starts at about 550.000kr while the lexus GS450h starts at 850.000kr.
The lexus IS 300h starts at 400.000kr.
A fully laoded F-sport GS is about 1.000.000kr. A fully loaded tesla S is about 700.000kr.
A fully loaded IS 300h f-sport is about 550.000kr
It makes the tesla a very good alternative to other premium cars in norway. We also get the quick chargers spread across the country, so the car can be charged 80% in 30 minutes.
Actually the Tesla S was norways most selling car in august and september.
I believe the next step for lexus would be a plug in version on most their hybrid series.
Most trips made by avarge people are under 80 km long, and my driving pattern is pretty avarge.
If they made a plug in version with 80 km range, I could probably go 4-6 months without filling up the gas tank
A diesel with start - stop still doesn't turn on and off as often as if it would be a hybrid.
I know Norway has big differences in prices depending on engine. Your taxes have a big effect on the final price tag. Sweden has more even pricing. I belive the Model S will compare to a GS540h at about 760'000SKR fully equiped.
09-15-13, 03:44 PM
#73
Lead Lap
Thread Starter
Yes, my bad. Was thinking of the EV-mode. I use Eco mode a lot in urban driving.
A diesel with start - stop still doesn't turn on and off as often as if it would be a hybrid.
I know Norway has big differences in prices depending on engine. Your taxes have a big effect on the final price tag. Sweden has more even pricing. I belive the Model S will compare to a GS540h at about 760'000SKR fully equiped.
A diesel with start - stop still doesn't turn on and off as often as if it would be a hybrid.
I know Norway has big differences in prices depending on engine. Your taxes have a big effect on the final price tag. Sweden has more even pricing. I belive the Model S will compare to a GS540h at about 760'000SKR fully equiped.
However they may have altered the technologi to suit it to a turbo enigne.
I can't imagine that fuel consumption is the primary objective for that car, and therefor the enigne might run all the time.
The idea of a bigger electric engine and maybe a bigger battery pack in the IS is apealing, but I suspect that the whole car would have to be rebuilt to make it fit..
09-15-13, 04:22 PM
#74
Don't know how the Yaris Hybrid R works, but from the specs I've read it has a 1,6 turbo engine, but is still a hybrid.
However they may have altered the technologi to suit it to a turbo enigne.
I can't imagine that fuel consumption is the primary objective for that car, and therefor the enigne might run all the time.
The idea of a bigger electric engine and maybe a bigger battery pack in the IS is apealing, but I suspect that the whole car would have to be rebuilt to make it fit..
However they may have altered the technologi to suit it to a turbo enigne.
I can't imagine that fuel consumption is the primary objective for that car, and therefor the enigne might run all the time.
The idea of a bigger electric engine and maybe a bigger battery pack in the IS is apealing, but I suspect that the whole car would have to be rebuilt to make it fit..
1.6 Turbo is race engine having nothing to do at all with their road engines.
IS300h has large electric motors already... problem is that you cant recover much more hp to store enough juice in the batteries for powering them. So it would have to be plugin but nobody but Norway buys plugins :-). In US, they have to discount them severely just to move any units.
Some people over at the Prius forums got Prius PHEV at $1k premium to normal Prius, thats huge discount.
09-16-13, 01:52 AM
#75
it is show car, probably barely works.
1.6 Turbo is race engine having nothing to do at all with their road engines.
IS300h has large electric motors already... problem is that you cant recover much more hp to store enough juice in the batteries for powering them. So it would have to be plugin but nobody but Norway buys plugins :-). In US, they have to discount them severely just to move any units.
Some people over at the Prius forums got Prius PHEV at $1k premium to normal Prius, thats huge discount.
1.6 Turbo is race engine having nothing to do at all with their road engines.
IS300h has large electric motors already... problem is that you cant recover much more hp to store enough juice in the batteries for powering them. So it would have to be plugin but nobody but Norway buys plugins :-). In US, they have to discount them severely just to move any units.
Some people over at the Prius forums got Prius PHEV at $1k premium to normal Prius, thats huge discount.
The GS450h has a 200hp (147kW) electric motor, but slightly less torque compared to the 300h.
To recover power is not a problem.