Slash300zx

Yeah I really hope to see some much better numbers. Most of the passes I've seen and read about are mostly stock cars and regular conditions. I just can't see 66 lbs slowing the 1/4 so much, specially with the 8 spd transmission which should improve it anyways.... plus, this is regular people driving, they have professional drivers who should "technically" drive better than the everyday Joe. Now this is making me think it's a conspiracy and these 1/4 mile numbers are fabricated so it doesn't embarrass the BMW so much

Ramon

More ratios doesn't always mean better acceleration from a stand still, it can even be counter productive depending on several factors. It does however mean less chance of being in a "bad" gear from a roll.

Hoovey689

iTrader: (16)

I don't know about fabrication, but certainly all automakers underrate times and hp to protect themselves from lawsuits. That said I don't think a publication would fabricate numbers unless of course they were paid too...

ydooby

The comparo is now online, with fairly typical feedbacks from the Internet visitors.
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...omparison-test

peteharvey

Interesting to note how the BM six is smoother than Lexus' 3.5 V6.
Normally, the Lexus V6 just about matches the BM in-line six for smoothness, or is even smoother, for the same engine capacity.
However in this test, the Lexus V6 is handicapped by its bigger 3.5L capacity, whereas the BMW in-line six is only 3.0L because it is turbocharged.
Normally, the larger the capacity of the engine, the greater the reciprocating mass, hence less smoothness.
Eg the original 2006 3GS300 with the 3.0 V6 is noticeably smoother than the 3.5L V6's used today, especially towards the top of the rev range.
Maybe Lexus must move to small capacity turbos afterall, but hopefully they replace those future AR 2.0L 4 cylinder turbos with a 2.0 V6 turbo one day.
Smaller capacity engine means less weight on the nose, resulting in better handling too.

Also interesting is how the lightest Cadillac has the most lateral acceleration, followed by the heavier 335i, with the 3IS350 the heaviest vehicle and the lowest lateral acceleration of the three.
However, the 3IS has the quickest turn-in, and is quickest through the slalom.
Often, that's thanks to firmer suspension which keeps the car flat to reduce weight transfer to the outside wheels, but here, the 3IS350 may not be using firmer springs, because the 3IS has by far the best ride.
Chassis engineering is quite complex, so it's not easy to draw generalizations without actually test driving the car yourself.

Also interesting is how the BM and Lex wheelbases are essentially the same, yet the BM has a more spacious rear, with a few more cubic feet of rear passenger space.
Maybe the IS has a more curvaceously styled rear compartment, and often the Lex air conditioned seats have very thick back rests.
It will be interesting to see how much rear foot room the 3IS provides, because often Lexus provides poor rear foot room compared to the Germans.

Overall, I suspect this 3IS will succeed where last year's 4GS didn't sell too well.
This new 3IS with: an 8 speed auto, a 100 mm longer wheelbase, fold down rear seats, and a sexy reverse trapezoidal rear light evolution of the 4GS, and a dashboard that is also an improved evolution of the 4GS dash - the new 3IS should sell as well, if not even better than the old 2IS, especially in the North American-like markets where petrol is relatively cheap.
For example, where many thought the 4GS tail was somewhat bland, this new 3IS [which is just an evolution of last years 4GS tail], is actually very stylish, and possibly the best angle of the 3IS.
After the badge, the new 3IS's styling and space should really sell...

Ramon

3IS dash being improved over the 4GS is most certainly a matter of opinion. I think the 4GS dash blows it away.

peteharvey

Normally, the center consoles are raked and angled towards the driver's eyes.
The 4GS as the odd man out, is probably the only vehicle in the Lexus range presently where the center console is raked and angled downwards to the driver's abdomen!
With the new 3IS, Lexus has gone back to conventionally angling the center console back to the driver's eyes again.

However, the quality of plastics, woodgrain, leather, metal, materials, and build quality etc, is intentionally much better in the GS.
The 3IS dash is intentionally plasticky and cheaper than the GS, but I think the 3IS is fine amongst its compact sized peers...

unc879wins

That BMW 300 lbs of torque must be the full second difference to 60mph and two full seconds difference to 100mph and four seconds difference to 130mph.

Not sure how much of it is the 100 lbs of less curb weight on the BMW.

mrraider

It should read Habemus papam.

Someone at car and drivel needs to review their declensions

mrraider

Look at the tires. The 350 uses touring all seasons tires, while the other two use high performance summer tires. The Lexus gets a better ride because of the more sophisticated Double wishbone suspension, and because the other two use run flats.

tankton

It depends on the engine family. For example, Honda, only has one V6 engine block, starting with the 3.0. The 3.5 was a bored out and stroked 3.0, as a result, it's lighter than the 3.0, since it uses the same block, with less metal (this isn't conjecture, it is lighter). Same with the 3.7L, it's lighter than the 3.5 since it's a bored and stroked version of the 3.5.

Lexus, the 2.5 is a different engine block altogether (vs the 3.5), though the reason I bring that up is the engine has been EOL'd, and making a 2.0L version of it won't necessary be lighter than the 2.5 already is.

Ramon

Acceleration difference is staggering. My guess in addition to being slightly lighter and having more torque, the 335 also has a flatter power band helping it maintain close to peak power through a wider RPM band than the IS.

peteharvey

Thanks guys.
The bit about the summer vs all season tires, and the run flats is quite amazing.
Sounds like the IS has a killer chassis in this comparison if it ran on summer tires.

So too the bit about the engine families and their effects on engine weight.
Sounds like the ideal engine for a future IS might perhaps be an all new 2.0 V6 turbo based on an all new block designed to be 1.5 to 2.0L maximum in capacity - that'll ensure that there is less weight on the nose.
Initially I just wanted more bottom end punch [torque] from Lexus 2.5 and 3.5 V6, but now it looks like they'll have to actually use small capacity turbos like BM.
BM has a big head start with a range of 4 cylinder, in-line 6 cylinder, and V8 turbos...

spwolf

1.5-2.0 V6 where?

Nobody is making small capacity V6's, it is thing of past... BMW is moving towards 3cly turbo's for their future engines.

peteharvey

BM was famous for using the 2.0L in-line six, and that engine only fell out of favor as the 3 and 5 Series got bigger and bigger, requiring larger capacity atmospheric engines.
The turbos and small capacity turbos went out of favor in the 2nd half of the eighties, replaced by multi-valve engines.
Now, the turbo is finding its way back.
Thus, I suspect the small capacity V6 turbos will find their way back too.
The 1.5L V6 turbo has already found its way back to F1 racing.
I suspect the 3 cylinder turbos will be more for the sub-compact sized cars like the VW Polo, and then into the Golf etc.
Let's see what happens...