Aristanet

Please correct if I’m wrong, my understanding is that only IS250 comes with a manual transmission. Neither IS350 nor IS-F comes with a manual? Do you know if they going to make those available in the upcoming year (2009) models?

My lease on a 335 is up pretty soon and I had the pleasure of driving a IS-F but if I cant get that with a manual I would have to pass

passnu2

iTrader: (33)

you are correct and I dont see Lexus offering a manual in either of these cars. I dont think they see the demand. I agree with you and miss driving a manual. Those "paddle" shifters are just not the same.

that new M3 is pretty hot

RI-Lex

iTrader: (4)

IMO the IS-F should have been offered in a manual

Kurtz

iTrader: (1)

You'll notice that the manual IS250 gets the worst mileage of any of the models, with no better performance.

Modern automatics have come a long way, and the clutch pedal is really a relic anymore. Even many "performance" brands are going to SMGs or other manu-matic solutions that don't use 1950s era clutch pedals. Expect this trend to continue and increase.

Aristanet

- too bad, i really liked the car.

M3 is nice but i think for the same $$$ i would rather take 550i.

Thanks for the info guys.

Aristanet

No Auto transmission will ever be able to replace the feel of manual stick, i dont care what the reviews say. I can only imagine how much fun IS-F or even IS350 be with a stick shift

nabbun

think about it globally and not just the USDM. I think like 90% of porshes bought in germany come with auto. europeans are all over the auto's and that's part of the reason why companies are shifting to automatics and less manuals. only in the US is it still 90% want manual in a sports car over auto.

It's all about catering to the masses and generating sales. If only 15% of the market wants sports cars with manual transmission and less sound deadening, why would a car manufacturer for the general public (the masses) want to spend extra money to develop that just for them?

Even BMW chose to make the M5 in manual just for the US market.

Now, if we were talking about companies who catered to a certain market like porsche and ferrari, then i'd expect different things from them.

TinCan

I have a friend in the toyota marketing....something like 3-9% of the market want a stick in the IS350. As for the F I don't see why not. I would want AWD and a stick with the 350, guess I fit in the 3-9 lol

passnu2

iTrader: (33)

I couldnt agree more with you

DrGP

Info posted on this forum and originally told to me by my sales rep in May, indicates that the IS250 is no longer available in a MT or without AWD. If you had one on order it will be filled. As I understand it, Lexus is buiding only IS250 AWDs and IS350 with automatic transmissions. BTW, I wouldn't want a car for my daily driver tha was not a MT. I also drive a 335i.

Kurtz

iTrader: (1)

Eh, I've driven plenty of manuals. I find them annoying, not fun.

In traffic they're a pain in the ***. On an open road you'll be in top gear before long so no benefit there.

Driving down a mountain or in really bad weather is the only time I ever found them useful, and never fun. And for those odd cases the manually selecting a lower gear ability that modern autos offer isn't a bad alternative.

I'd rather focus on driving the car than driving AND shifting it...the computer can do the shifting a lot faster and more efficiently than any human can.

Mostly in the US it's a throwback to the 50s and 60s when manuals offered significantly better performance AND better mileage as a bonus... so it became ingrained that 'real" sports cars have sticks.

But it's not the 50s and 60s anymore. At a recent lap trial in germany the stick was -slower- than the manumatic Porsche.

Still, it remains a residual thought in the backs of peoples heads as a historic artifact that sticks are better when they simply aren't anymore.

You'll still see full manuals stick around for a while, especially in cheaper smaller cars where it's not economical to put in an advanced auto/manumatic transmission... but even then the dual-clutch systems and other more advanced no-3rd-pedal systems will continue to get cheaper and better, so even there the days are numbered.

Kurtz

iTrader: (1)

Yes, but as you've been told several times, your dealer lied to you.

The 250 is like 80% of IS sales. The AWD version is almost non-existant among sales outside the northeast/midwest type states. It's be insane to drop the RWD 250.

Dropping the manual, that's a tiny % of sales, nobody'd really notice that... but dropping the RWD 250? no way, no how.

ffpowerLN

iTrader: (1)

Your sales rep is one of those who didn't do their homeworks...

If Lexus decides to drop the RWD IS250 the whole California (Lexus' biggest market in US) and Southeast (Lexus' second biggest market in US) will go loco. Do you honestly think Lexus will let that happen?

Aristanet

Last thing I wanted to do was to make another stick vs. auto thread – god knows there are plenty of those on these boards

In my opinion, no matter how good the automatic transmission is, these cars should have a manual transmission available in them. I mean com’on, you stick an 8 cylinder 5.0 engine in a IS-250 and you telling me these cars are not supposed to be fun to drive? If I wanted something boring, I would go back to LS430 and be done with it.

I do agree that today’s auto transmissions are far more superior then what was on the market 5-10 years ago. Point in case, I drove a loaner 335 with Auto and I was amazed on how responsive and quick that box was but still nothing will replace my 3rd pedal

Granted if I had to commute everyday in NY traffic I would have never switch from boring auto LS430 to a manual 335, but until that changes I intend to enjoy the s***t out of it.

I wish IS-F was available in manual as well, after test driving one it’s like a breath of fresh air after a bimmer 

Kurtz

iTrader: (1)

Thing is, from my understanding of the IS-F transmission, it has a full-manual mode, it just doesn't require using an antique clutch pedal.

And it shifts in 1/10th of 1 second, way way faster than a traditional manual ever could.


So other than saving your left foot some exercise, what exactly would make a manual more fun than the IS-F auto switched to sport shifting mode?

You should have the same control of exactly what gear you're in at all times, and that control will be exercisable considerably faster than with a clutch pedal.