To those waiting for a Tune
10-22-14, 12:21 PM
#61
Driver School Candidate
Wow that's expensive. Most tuning solutions for boosted cars, which are arguably more difficult to tune, run around $500. A custom dyno tune for an Evo is $400-600, Charger SRT8's can get a Diablo tuner with OTS tunes for $389.
I guess that's the price you pay for a vehicle that costs $60-65k new.
I guess that's the price you pay for a vehicle that costs $60-65k new.
10-22-14, 01:10 PM
#63
Lexus Test Driver
yea i cant recall how much i spent on my custom Ecutek tune with dyno runs but it was under $1000 for the GTR. Plus when doing a tune on a FI car it really helps.
Must be a lot easier to mess with the software. I wonder why lexus made it so difficult.
Must be a lot easier to mess with the software. I wonder why lexus made it so difficult.
10-22-14, 07:30 PM
#68
Tech Info Resource
iTrader: (2)
Very strict compliance with Federal law. The Federal law covering this states the engine calibration must be inalterable by end users. Toyota takes this more seriously than any other manufacturer. It also means they have fewer engines blowing up under warranty than their competitors. I am always amazed at how many people think just because they bought a car, the factory should sponsor their abuse/racing program with a warranty when they are clearly doing all kinds of things they should not be doing if they expect the manufacturer to accept liability.
10-23-14, 09:06 AM
#70
Driver School Candidate
Very strict compliance with Federal law. The Federal law covering this states the engine calibration must be inalterable by end users. Toyota takes this more seriously than any other manufacturer. It also means they have fewer engines blowing up under warranty than their competitors. I am always amazed at how many people think just because they bought a car, the factory should sponsor their abuse/racing program with a warranty when they are clearly doing all kinds of things they should not be doing if they expect the manufacturer to accept liability.
Toyota didn't lock up the FR-S/GT86 quite as tight as the IS apparently, but I also think a lot has to do with the size of the available market (number of vehicles on the road). The tuning companies have to do the cracking of the encryption, and they won't likely spend a ton of time/money on a car that's not going to see them selling a ton of their tunes. IS-F is a pretty rare vehicle, and the owners are much less likely to mod than say Porsche or Nissan GT-R owners, so they probably don't see much upside in spending tons of engineering dollars cracking the code.
10-23-14, 09:48 AM
#71
So unlike Mitsubishi. All you need is a cable and a laptop and download OpenECU and you're good to go.
Toyota didn't lock up the FR-S/GT86 quite as tight as the IS apparently, but I also think a lot has to do with the size of the available market (number of vehicles on the road). The tuning companies have to do the cracking of the encryption, and they won't likely spend a ton of time/money on a car that's not going to see them selling a ton of their tunes. IS-F is a pretty rare vehicle, and the owners are much less likely to mod than say Porsche or Nissan GT-R owners, so they probably don't see much upside in spending tons of engineering dollars cracking the code.
Toyota didn't lock up the FR-S/GT86 quite as tight as the IS apparently, but I also think a lot has to do with the size of the available market (number of vehicles on the road). The tuning companies have to do the cracking of the encryption, and they won't likely spend a ton of time/money on a car that's not going to see them selling a ton of their tunes. IS-F is a pretty rare vehicle, and the owners are much less likely to mod than say Porsche or Nissan GT-R owners, so they probably don't see much upside in spending tons of engineering dollars cracking the code.
10-23-14, 02:39 PM
#72
so far the only "hacking/cracking" done to a Toyota ECU has been inputting false signals into the info stream at key points/times to make the car react differently.
Last edited by Gymkata; 10-23-14 at 02:45 PM.
10-23-14, 03:04 PM
#73
It's been over two years since I've left and they're all still at it. Seeing you guys saying you will pay these absurd (2-3k) amounts, for a tune just seems irresponsible.
Sounds like its burned chip like the old days. That right there would be unfortunate for guys with F/I aspirations.
I see this as a casual mod for the casual bolt on owner and for that reason, it shouldn't cost more than $1,500. I'm still feeling ripped off in my mind.
If your reading this and saying, "..but that's all we have, I have to do it." No you don't, you can move on to a different car. The ISF will always be there to come back to, if they ever do figure it out. I still have an ISF, when the cost of a tune comes down under $800, i'll consider it. Until then, they can keep their over priced old school chip burner.
~Dv8
Sounds like its burned chip like the old days. That right there would be unfortunate for guys with F/I aspirations.
I see this as a casual mod for the casual bolt on owner and for that reason, it shouldn't cost more than $1,500. I'm still feeling ripped off in my mind.
If your reading this and saying, "..but that's all we have, I have to do it." No you don't, you can move on to a different car. The ISF will always be there to come back to, if they ever do figure it out. I still have an ISF, when the cost of a tune comes down under $800, i'll consider it. Until then, they can keep their over priced old school chip burner.
~Dv8
10-23-14, 07:14 PM
#74
Tech Info Resource
iTrader: (2)
So unlike Mitsubishi. All you need is a cable and a laptop and download OpenECU and you're good to go.
Toyota didn't lock up the FR-S/GT86 quite as tight as the IS apparently, but I also think a lot has to do with the size of the available market (number of vehicles on the road). The tuning companies have to do the cracking of the encryption, and they won't likely spend a ton of time/money on a car that's not going to see them selling a ton of their tunes. IS-F is a pretty rare vehicle, and the owners are much less likely to mod than say Porsche or Nissan GT-R owners, so they probably don't see much upside in spending tons of engineering dollars cracking the code.
Toyota didn't lock up the FR-S/GT86 quite as tight as the IS apparently, but I also think a lot has to do with the size of the available market (number of vehicles on the road). The tuning companies have to do the cracking of the encryption, and they won't likely spend a ton of time/money on a car that's not going to see them selling a ton of their tunes. IS-F is a pretty rare vehicle, and the owners are much less likely to mod than say Porsche or Nissan GT-R owners, so they probably don't see much upside in spending tons of engineering dollars cracking the code.
Bingo. Not running Toyota chips or code.
I'm not sure how many times I need to say this, but the CPU in a Toyota ECM is custom all the way down to the microcode ROM, so not even the instruction set the machine uses is standard. It's not as simple as cracking the encryption which has proved challenging enough. Once you crack it, you still need their development kit to talk to the thing. Standard tools are just gibberish to a Toyota ECM.
Starting with a Toyota platform is a bad idea if you want flexibility or reconfigurability. The only way it works is with full aftermarket engine management, and then you still have to reverse engineer all the other stuff so your aftermarket ECM understands what the other 14 computers in the car need from it. And that's why the SARD/Novel/iCode tunes are the only hope. It's also why they are not cheap. No one else has what they offer for Toyota, and no one else has the technology to compete. So they set their price and either you want to pay it or you don't.