Driving in M manual mode
07-14-09, 02:39 PM
#16
I love driving the F in paddle mode
There is one thing driving the Ferrari's F1 style transmission, I don't know about the brand new ones, but the older ones you had to let up on upshift, downshifts were rough and upshifts were only perfect at WOT
Then there is the Mercedes style buttons / paddles. At least in the 5 speed, you might as well just let it stay in auto it was so useless and laggy.
The BMW 6 speed auto was a piece of crap too, but that's why they made SMG though right
I haven't really pushed the M5's SMG, but in P400 or P500 mode it was pretty lurchy, maybe it needed to warm up
So that brings me to the IS-F
It's the best of all worlds, the only thing you can really truly ask for is more performance, but then you are really asking for two things
1) More performance
2) Less real world usability
Honestly the IS-F IMO is a perfect compromise and really shows that the guys were making a car that would go fast prettttty easily
You can upshift nicely at WOT, y ou don't have to let up the throttle, downshifts either blip, or smoothly go down at their own -- except from 2nd to 1st for obvious reasons
I also second the complaint that in auto mode it takes too long to go down
What other nuances have you guys figured out
I don't like the idea of changing from auto to manual mode during movement, from what I understand the torque convertor is getting locked up in M mode, so couldn't that cause dmg if you don't switch while stopped?
There is one thing driving the Ferrari's F1 style transmission, I don't know about the brand new ones, but the older ones you had to let up on upshift, downshifts were rough and upshifts were only perfect at WOT
Then there is the Mercedes style buttons / paddles. At least in the 5 speed, you might as well just let it stay in auto it was so useless and laggy.
The BMW 6 speed auto was a piece of crap too, but that's why they made SMG though right
I haven't really pushed the M5's SMG, but in P400 or P500 mode it was pretty lurchy, maybe it needed to warm up
So that brings me to the IS-F
It's the best of all worlds, the only thing you can really truly ask for is more performance, but then you are really asking for two things
1) More performance
2) Less real world usability
Honestly the IS-F IMO is a perfect compromise and really shows that the guys were making a car that would go fast prettttty easily
You can upshift nicely at WOT, y ou don't have to let up the throttle, downshifts either blip, or smoothly go down at their own -- except from 2nd to 1st for obvious reasons
I also second the complaint that in auto mode it takes too long to go down
What other nuances have you guys figured out
I don't like the idea of changing from auto to manual mode during movement, from what I understand the torque convertor is getting locked up in M mode, so couldn't that cause dmg if you don't switch while stopped?
07-14-09, 05:19 PM
#17
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The downside is, to my knowledge, no way to rapidly select a lower gear for things like passing. If I'm cruising at 45 and want to drop from 8 to 2 or 3, it takes about 5-7 seconds for step down. Whereas in automatic, stomping on it puts it pass mode and it finds 2 or 3 immediately.
Agreed except the 5 second part. I actually just had a Infiniti G37 rental for 2 weeks and was surprisingly impressed with the transmission logic. It's a 7AT. It has two (well, three really) modes: D, S, and M
D = Drive
S = Sport
M = "manual"
In drive..well, it just does its job.
If you flip it into sport (you just pull the shifter to the left, but do NOT shift +/-) it goes into a MUCH more aggressive shifting program. You nudge the gas and it drops a gear or three. It also has some pretty interesting sensors that I do not believe the -F has. Eg, if you go into a corner/turn on the gas in sport (NOT manual) mode in the G37, it will do its best to hold the gear the whole time.
Also, when you are in regular D mode and cruising along - if you swap over to sport mode it drops 2-3 gears (not sure how many because it doesnt have the same gear position indicator we have).
It would be smart of lexus to have done something similar with the -F, eg, when you go into -F mode it drops down a gear or two if in >=6th gear.
Apparently the CTS-V automatic has a similar (even better), very cleverly programmed transmission.
At the end of the day, the -F's transmission still trumps the G in shift times/accuracy, but that's expected.
07-14-09, 05:25 PM
#18
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So I tried it this morning - I see your point. It does wait to shift, even with my foot off the accelerator. I didn't notice this on the track, but I never downshifted four gears at at time either. At ~80 mph, a downshift from 8th to 4th took 3 seconds total, so I get what you're saying if you want to go from cruise to power quickly. It does shift much more quickly in D.
07-14-09, 09:18 PM
#19
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I tried different ways to downshift fastest.
downshifting in M mode is just way too slow.. so what i do with stock is-f is place it sport mode in drive and punch the gas all the way down then switch it to manual mode after it goes into the right gear... downshift in sportmode is slightly faster then normal mode..
mayb everyone knows about this by now :P
downshifting in M mode is just way too slow.. so what i do with stock is-f is place it sport mode in drive and punch the gas all the way down then switch it to manual mode after it goes into the right gear... downshift in sportmode is slightly faster then normal mode..
mayb everyone knows about this by now :P
When you punch it in drive then switch it to F mode after it goes into the right gear, one thing more needs to be done and that's a quick upshift because you're already near the rev limiter. In the time it takes to move your hand from the stick to the paddle, you may already have hit the rev limiter, but since your hand was already on the stick, why not follow the move from auto to F mode with a quick upshift right from the stick that your hand is already holding onto?
Another speed tip for manual driving has to do with the apex of the corner. In a manual transmission, you select the gear before entering the turn or reaching the apex. But on the IS-F, because of the lag time and no manual clutch control, shifting into gear for maximum corner drive before reaching the apex can upset the balance because you don't know exactly when it's going to downshift, or it may even slow you down if you are trailing throttle because of compression braking that kicks in. The solution is to set up for the corner in a taller gear that allows you to keep the throttle pinned, and downshift for the maximum drive after passing the apex when the car is straightening itself up.
07-15-09, 08:16 AM
#21
I tried this tip this morning, and it worked! Downshifting is FAST when not on the throttle! 
I've think I found the solution to the "slow-er" shifting people are talking about. I think it has something to do with the throttle being used as well. For some reason, if I try to downshift while at a moderately open throttle, it has to think for a little longer than usual. If you try to downshift with very minimal throttle or no throttle, the upshifts are pretty lightning quick.
Next time you guys drive, try this out. It has worked great for me, seriously. Just anticipate, release throttle to almost all the way off the gas, or all the way. Quickly tap downshift, 3-4 gears, and boom it will go very quickly.
If you are stomping the gas during this, it takes longer to go through each gear.
Next time you guys drive, try this out. It has worked great for me, seriously. Just anticipate, release throttle to almost all the way off the gas, or all the way. Quickly tap downshift, 3-4 gears, and boom it will go very quickly.
If you are stomping the gas during this, it takes longer to go through each gear.
07-15-09, 10:24 AM
#22
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I dont feel like going out to manually test this, but if you are in D mode and hit the paddle shifter to down-shift, I believe it drops down a few gears rather than just 1 gear(?) but I could be wrong. Assuming i'm not wrong - you could downshift with the paddle, and then throw it into -F mode...
Good Luck
07-15-09, 02:18 PM
#23
That makes perfect sense. I will try this afternoon.
Not sure how well that would work on the track. There's a lot of hard-wiring in our brains to undo with this marriage of technologies.
Not sure how well that would work on the track. There's a lot of hard-wiring in our brains to undo with this marriage of technologies.
07-15-09, 08:55 PM
#27
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I use this method as well. The tip I would offer is to avoid excessive reliance on the paddles, which can be hard to get your hands on in a tight corner. Still in F mode, but use the stick instead because you can always get to it, it's always in the same place because it isn't going in circles with your steering wheel like the paddles do.
When you punch it in drive then switch it to F mode after it goes into the right gear, one thing more needs to be done and that's a quick upshift because you're already near the rev limiter. In the time it takes to move your hand from the stick to the paddle, you may already have hit the rev limiter, but since your hand was already on the stick, why not follow the move from auto to F mode with a quick upshift right from the stick that your hand is already holding onto?
Another speed tip for manual driving has to do with the apex of the corner. In a manual transmission, you select the gear before entering the turn or reaching the apex. But on the IS-F, because of the lag time and no manual clutch control, shifting into gear for maximum corner drive before reaching the apex can upset the balance because you don't know exactly when it's going to downshift, or it may even slow you down if you are trailing throttle because of compression braking that kicks in. The solution is to set up for the corner in a taller gear that allows you to keep the throttle pinned, and downshift for the maximum drive after passing the apex when the car is straightening itself up.
When you punch it in drive then switch it to F mode after it goes into the right gear, one thing more needs to be done and that's a quick upshift because you're already near the rev limiter. In the time it takes to move your hand from the stick to the paddle, you may already have hit the rev limiter, but since your hand was already on the stick, why not follow the move from auto to F mode with a quick upshift right from the stick that your hand is already holding onto?
Another speed tip for manual driving has to do with the apex of the corner. In a manual transmission, you select the gear before entering the turn or reaching the apex. But on the IS-F, because of the lag time and no manual clutch control, shifting into gear for maximum corner drive before reaching the apex can upset the balance because you don't know exactly when it's going to downshift, or it may even slow you down if you are trailing throttle because of compression braking that kicks in. The solution is to set up for the corner in a taller gear that allows you to keep the throttle pinned, and downshift for the maximum drive after passing the apex when the car is straightening itself up.
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