ISFC6

Hello to all. I just made it back home safely. I wanted to profoundly thank JOEZ, Tommy at Music Box is an awesome and compassionate person, and so was the Lexus Master Tech as well.

Yes, everything was inspected, regarding the installation.

1) There were no issues with the JOEZ Pipe, no crushing of the plastic or leaks were noticed, and the MAF was clean as a baby's but, due to the low mileage on the car, and also due to the fact that the Tom's filter is dry, so there would be no issues with oil in the MAF.

2) No leaks were noted in the exhaust, Joe did find that the wires were a little wound up (but not tightly), but his opinon and the Lexus Tech's was that should not cause any misreadings, as the wires still had slack, and were still loose, but Joe straightened them out as a precaution.

3) Tom's filter was also removed in favor of the OEM

4) Last, but not least, the ECU was reset.

The Lexus tech did scan the car, prior to those adjustments, and it did show a difference in voltage, but still within Lexus specs, that could justify a rich condition. He did compare the readings to Joe's car, and his had less of a variance, even with the Tom's filter. But, after the air filter was swapped, slight adjustments to the O2 sensors were made, and ECU reset, the readings were almost identical to Joe's car, so all other potential issues with the air fuel ratio sensors were eliminated at this point, especially because the baseline runs were so good, and did not show a rich condition, and only after the the modifications were installed did an overly rich condition show up. The Lexus Tech looked over my dyno readings and AFR. I will redyno the car, and keep my fingers crossed, and will post the results as soon as available. Joe remains optimistic, I am realist, and the Lexus tech was perssimistic, as he thought that none of the changes would make a difference in the dyno readings I sure hope that Joe is correct on this one, but we will only know when I redyno the car. Wish me luck

There was another ISF there as well, all stock, expect for the JOEZ intake. We were going to obtain the readings from that car as well, but the owner had to leave.

weaponX

I may not be following the little nuances here, but bottom line --- if you have this exhaust and intake combo installed, is it highly advisable that you remove the Tom's filter and install the OEM one (at this stage)?!

ISFC6

You are correct, you have not read all of the posts. The OEM filter was reinstalled, but the Tom's filter did not appear to be the issue, as JoeZ has one as well, and his car is well within specs after the handheld read the data.

carlosg

Any Up-dates?

Joe Z

iTrader: (10)

Yes... He redyno'd this week and is still in the same ball park of 352-354 Rwhp ..

So we are making plans to either redyno his IS-F with stock exhaust & stock intake to recheck his base numbers, since his numbers are now 8 weeks old..

or

I will dyno my IS-F (with exhaust & intake only) to verify if his numbers match mine.
Also, we will dyno a 3rd bone stock IS-F to see what we are all getting on this very same dyno.. on the very same day..

So we are still in Trouble shooting mode..

I having a strong gut feeling a recheck of his base numbers might put him in the 333 rwhp range..
Just dynoed my bone stock 09 ISF with only 2,400 miles...


Anybody know of a Bone Stock IS-F in the Fresno Area???

Regards,

Joe Z

carlosg

I don't think is possible for the ecu to compensate with the exhaust, since this mod wont affect the MAS. what type of gas was he using?

Joe Z

iTrader: (10)

Right....

We only have 91 Octane here in SoCal... he uses Chevron...

Joe Z

ISFC6

Carlos, I redynoed again this Wednesday, basically the same numbers as it put down stock. I am using 91(best you can get in California) octane gas, and all dyno sessions were using 91 octane from different gas stations and from different areas, so we can narrow down that it was not bad gas. We also elminated the possibility that the 02 sensor wiring has anything to do with it not showing any power gains, and the Tom's filter had nothing to do with it either, since this third dyno session was with the stock OEM filter. I have spoken to the dyno shop owner (operator), and there is really no way to alter the numbers on this dyno. It is a dyno jet SAE 5 correction. All runs were performed identical to one another, everything remaining the same. The car was first dynoed stock on 09/11, the mods were installed on 09/15. As instructed, I drove the car for a few weeks to log a couple of hundred miles for the ECU to relearn and for the long term fuel trims and such to stabalize (due to the intake pipe and air filter, as instructed in the JOEZ intake instructions). I redynoed the car on 10/22, and the numbers were no better than stock. Upon speaking with Joe, I took a trip to Southern California (10/30) for Joe to look things over and to make a few adjustments to what he believed would solve the issue with no power gain. I logged another 350 miles or so on my way back, and redynoed the car again this past Wednesday, 11/03, and the numbers were still not better than stock, so we are still at square one.

Joe Z

iTrader: (10)

^^ But much closer to finding the answer, since we're pretty much running out of solutions...

Joe Z

ISFC6

Hi Joe, I will wait for your PM, as to how you, Clark (VIP), and PTS want to proceed from this point forward. Thanks.

Joe Z

iTrader: (10)

We will need to complete the last phase of the trouble shooting as discussed.

VIP is not in the picture at this point..

Thanks
Joe Z

ISFC6

Sure, and as we discussed, you are more than welcome to put my car to stock, dyno it again, install the mods, and redyno it again to verify and see if the same results will be duplicated. This would be the most accurate way, as each ISF is going to dyno differently from one another, stock to stock, or modded to modded. These are just normal variances from car to car. For example, I have seen Corvettes dynos from the same location compared when stock and equally modded, but you will still see varations from car to car of around 20 - 30 RWHP SAE. The gains from stock to modifed is what really matters and have to be substantiated in every single car, especially when all runs are compared to in the same dyno machine and location. In short, each car may dyno differently when stock, but should gain consistently the same amount of HP/TQ as expected with any given modification, or combination thereof. As an example, Phil (MPG) dynoed around 333 RHP SAE, but Jerome (Time Toy), dyoned around 348 RWHP SAE, both located in California AND using 91 octane gas, while both cars were completely stock. We can still dyno other ISF's, but will still have to experiment with my car as discussed. It is the opinion of the dyno owner and operator that there could not have been a "fluke" in the dyno during my three separate visits, and a total of 10 runs, as he uses it frequently to tune and dyno cars. The calibration, correction factor, and machine have remained the same.

ming15237

iTrader: (3)

I have to say ISFC6 the level of customer service JOEZ is demonstrating here is UNHEARD OF in the automotive aftermarket! His continued commitment to finding an issue with your vehicle should be commended across the board. As a ASE Master tech myself I will say with a high degree of certainty that you problem lies with the vehicle and NOT with the installed parts. I have seen similar problems arise when people have used spray silicon in the engine compartment, and to install stiff air intake boots, another area of concern is often the threads on the o2 sensors, many times people will apply silicon to the threads in an effort to ease installation only to contaminate the o2 sensors. Returning the vehicle back to stock and re dynoing the vehicle IMHO is probably the most simple method to determine gains. That is if the vehicles other readings are WELL within spec, and NOT on the fringe of tripping a CEL. JOEZ if there is any assistance I can be of with data or the like please feel free to PM me. My F is bone stock except for your intake,and I do have TechStream scanned at our shop which I can give you data from my vehicle on.

carlosg

Did you do a dyno run with the stock intake tube and filter? did you check your spark plugs, what was you mileage on the car?

carlosg

There is one observation when you are driving on the street above 5800 rpms or at any normal driving speed the amount of air and velocity of such will lean the car therefore producing more hp. this effect will never be duplicated on a normal dyno because the air produced by some high speed fan will never be the same as driving for example at 65 or 80 mph.