Reconsidering the Factory Alignment
11-13-14, 07:53 PM
#226
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Does your car steer ever so slightly to the right of the road while driving say 50 MPH ?
11-14-14, 11:30 AM
#227
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11-18-14, 06:39 PM
#228
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My car feels even better now, I had my tech install the Figs LCA bushings & he realigned the car to match your Gran Turismo allignment specs. I plan to meet w a Lexus tech buddy of mine & he will finish off the car with the Techstream tomrw afternoon.
01-10-15, 07:39 PM
#230
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Feels just about right & my Lexus tech buddy met me outside of his dealership after hours just about with his fancy laptop looking computer to down load the streamtech. After driving it many weeks later it appears to still pull to the right a bit but nothing extreme. I need to get an oil change in the next 1k miles so I will have a tech monitor the tire wear by then.
06-26-15, 07:37 PM
#231
I am not sure if it is all in my head, but after adding 15mm spacers, switching to new Continental DW tires in 235/35 - 275/30 and getting an alignment to zero toe up front and .08 in the back, the car feels significantly less stable at highway speeds. Its as if it is harder to keep it straight on high speed runs.
Alignment shop is a reputable place that is very active in the road course scene. So I am confident they know what they are doing I have taken my other cars to them and the alignment specs sheet shows exactly what I asked for. So I am ruling out the alignment for now.
Can the spacers and/or tires cause such an uneasy feeling at speed? Car handles great on long sweepers and tight corners- it just seems less stable above 50-60mph. I am constantly making small steering adjustments (in both directions) to keep it straight. Almost seems worse under hard acceleration as if it is swaying..
I initially thought the tires need to be broken in - but its been a few hundred miles now.
Alignment shop is a reputable place that is very active in the road course scene. So I am confident they know what they are doing I have taken my other cars to them and the alignment specs sheet shows exactly what I asked for. So I am ruling out the alignment for now.
Can the spacers and/or tires cause such an uneasy feeling at speed? Car handles great on long sweepers and tight corners- it just seems less stable above 50-60mph. I am constantly making small steering adjustments (in both directions) to keep it straight. Almost seems worse under hard acceleration as if it is swaying..
I initially thought the tires need to be broken in - but its been a few hundred miles now.
06-26-15, 08:38 PM
#232
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I am not sure if it is all in my head, but after adding 15mm spacers, switching to new Continental DW tires in 235/35 - 275/30 and getting an alignment to zero toe up front and .08 in the back, the car feels significantly less stable at highway speeds. Its as if it is harder to keep it straight on high speed runs.
Alignment shop is a reputable place that is very active in the road course scene. So I am confident they know what they are doing I have taken my other cars to them and the alignment specs sheet shows exactly what I asked for. So I am ruling out the alignment for now.
Can the spacers and/or tires cause such an uneasy feeling at speed? Car handles great on long sweepers and tight corners- it just seems less stable above 50-60mph. I am constantly making small steering adjustments (in both directions) to keep it straight. Almost seems worse under hard acceleration as if it is swaying..
I initially thought the tires need to be broken in - but its been a few hundred miles now.
Alignment shop is a reputable place that is very active in the road course scene. So I am confident they know what they are doing I have taken my other cars to them and the alignment specs sheet shows exactly what I asked for. So I am ruling out the alignment for now.
Can the spacers and/or tires cause such an uneasy feeling at speed? Car handles great on long sweepers and tight corners- it just seems less stable above 50-60mph. I am constantly making small steering adjustments (in both directions) to keep it straight. Almost seems worse under hard acceleration as if it is swaying..
I initially thought the tires need to be broken in - but its been a few hundred miles now.
06-26-15, 09:52 PM
#233
I am not sure if it is all in my head, but after adding 15mm spacers, switching to new Continental DW tires in 235/35 - 275/30 and getting an alignment to zero toe up front and .08 in the back, the car feels significantly less stable at highway speeds. Its as if it is harder to keep it straight on high speed runs.
Alignment shop is a reputable place that is very active in the road course scene. So I am confident they know what they are doing I have taken my other cars to them and the alignment specs sheet shows exactly what I asked for. So I am ruling out the alignment for now.
Can the spacers and/or tires cause such an uneasy feeling at speed? Car handles great on long sweepers and tight corners- it just seems less stable above 50-60mph. I am constantly making small steering adjustments (in both directions) to keep it straight. Almost seems worse under hard acceleration as if it is swaying..
I initially thought the tires need to be broken in - but its been a few hundred miles now.
Alignment shop is a reputable place that is very active in the road course scene. So I am confident they know what they are doing I have taken my other cars to them and the alignment specs sheet shows exactly what I asked for. So I am ruling out the alignment for now.
Can the spacers and/or tires cause such an uneasy feeling at speed? Car handles great on long sweepers and tight corners- it just seems less stable above 50-60mph. I am constantly making small steering adjustments (in both directions) to keep it straight. Almost seems worse under hard acceleration as if it is swaying..
I initially thought the tires need to be broken in - but its been a few hundred miles now.
06-27-15, 06:18 PM
#234
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Adding 15mm spacers to the OEM wheels? You changed scrub radius pretty significantly. Spacers should only be used to correct offset, not to make a fashion statement if you want mechanical performance to be stable.
I run 255s in front now and have had zero issues, but I am using the 2012 wheels, so the offsets are correct for the suspension geometry. Running different diameter tires than stock can also impact scrub radius, so I chose tires very close to the OEM spec diameter.
Changing the geometry without fully understanding the change will result in potentially unstable conditions. The factory engineers spend a lot of time figuring out camber curves, roll centers, instant centers, roll couples, roll axis, and a whole host of other parameters affecting the feel of the car and always assume you won't change these things without a full understanding of what you are doing.
Fashionable offsets and "wheel gaps" will not result in good mechanical performance.
I run 255s in front now and have had zero issues, but I am using the 2012 wheels, so the offsets are correct for the suspension geometry. Running different diameter tires than stock can also impact scrub radius, so I chose tires very close to the OEM spec diameter.
Changing the geometry without fully understanding the change will result in potentially unstable conditions. The factory engineers spend a lot of time figuring out camber curves, roll centers, instant centers, roll couples, roll axis, and a whole host of other parameters affecting the feel of the car and always assume you won't change these things without a full understanding of what you are doing.
Fashionable offsets and "wheel gaps" will not result in good mechanical performance.
06-29-15, 03:05 PM
#235
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I am not sure if it is all in my head, but after adding 15mm spacers, switching to new Continental DW tires in 235/35 - 275/30 and getting an alignment to zero toe up front and .08 in the back, the car feels significantly less stable at highway speeds. Its as if it is harder to keep it straight on high speed runs.
Alignment shop is a reputable place that is very active in the road course scene. So I am confident they know what they are doing I have taken my other cars to them and the alignment specs sheet shows exactly what I asked for. So I am ruling out the alignment for now.
Can the spacers and/or tires cause such an uneasy feeling at speed? Car handles great on long sweepers and tight corners- it just seems less stable above 50-60mph. I am constantly making small steering adjustments (in both directions) to keep it straight. Almost seems worse under hard acceleration as if it is swaying..
I initially thought the tires need to be broken in - but its been a few hundred miles now.
Alignment shop is a reputable place that is very active in the road course scene. So I am confident they know what they are doing I have taken my other cars to them and the alignment specs sheet shows exactly what I asked for. So I am ruling out the alignment for now.
Can the spacers and/or tires cause such an uneasy feeling at speed? Car handles great on long sweepers and tight corners- it just seems less stable above 50-60mph. I am constantly making small steering adjustments (in both directions) to keep it straight. Almost seems worse under hard acceleration as if it is swaying..
I initially thought the tires need to be broken in - but its been a few hundred miles now.
06-29-15, 03:27 PM
#236
Thanks for this.
Other than the odd feeling at speed, I love the tires so far. They handle great and ride very well. A friend of mine drove the car and he did not feel the uneasiness I am noticing at speed.
I think the zero toe setting up front may be a contributing factor. I am going to get another alignment back to factory specs.
Other than the odd feeling at speed, I love the tires so far. They handle great and ride very well. A friend of mine drove the car and he did not feel the uneasiness I am noticing at speed.
I think the zero toe setting up front may be a contributing factor. I am going to get another alignment back to factory specs.
06-29-15, 09:04 PM
#237
Lexus Fanatic
Reconsidering the Factory Alignment
Lexus set the alignment for performance. People shouldn't expect the car to feel the same when you start messing with alignment specs . You guys are driving a performance car and trying to eek out more tire life by messing with something as critical as alignment . I mentioned the specs to my tech at my last service and he said it would be to the detriment of the handling feel . Members kind of dismissed the info when I brought it up last time but from the similar complaints from the members with and without the spacers is feeling the same thing it seems like it could the specs and not the spacers .
Lobux , all due respect , but you are always mentioning the virtues of factory design and how sensitive and linked it all is but yet you are tweaking something as critical as alignment , knowing that it effects turn in . I am surprised to see this based on your comments on many other topics . You haven't done a track day in a while so I would ask , would you run these specs for a track day ? Thanks
I have gone through 2 sets os tires in 16k miles . Lol I am amazed people are trying to get 25k out of a set of tires and complaining about wear
Lobux , all due respect , but you are always mentioning the virtues of factory design and how sensitive and linked it all is but yet you are tweaking something as critical as alignment , knowing that it effects turn in . I am surprised to see this based on your comments on many other topics . You haven't done a track day in a while so I would ask , would you run these specs for a track day ? Thanks
I have gone through 2 sets os tires in 16k miles . Lol I am amazed people are trying to get 25k out of a set of tires and complaining about wear
06-29-15, 10:35 PM
#238
Adding 15mm spacers to the OEM wheels? You changed scrub radius pretty significantly. Spacers should only be used to correct offset, not to make a fashion statement if you want mechanical performance to be stable.
I run 255s in front now and have had zero issues, but I am using the 2012 wheels, so the offsets are correct for the suspension geometry. Running different diameter tires than stock can also impact scrub radius, so I chose tires very close to the OEM spec diameter.
Changing the geometry without fully understanding the change will result in potentially unstable conditions. The factory engineers spend a lot of time figuring out camber curves, roll centers, instant centers, roll couples, roll axis, and a whole host of other parameters affecting the feel of the car and always assume you won't change these things without a full understanding of what you are doing.
Fashionable offsets and "wheel gaps" will not result in good mechanical performance.
I run 255s in front now and have had zero issues, but I am using the 2012 wheels, so the offsets are correct for the suspension geometry. Running different diameter tires than stock can also impact scrub radius, so I chose tires very close to the OEM spec diameter.
Changing the geometry without fully understanding the change will result in potentially unstable conditions. The factory engineers spend a lot of time figuring out camber curves, roll centers, instant centers, roll couples, roll axis, and a whole host of other parameters affecting the feel of the car and always assume you won't change these things without a full understanding of what you are doing.
Fashionable offsets and "wheel gaps" will not result in good mechanical performance.
06-30-15, 08:08 AM
#239
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Lexus set the alignment for performance. People shouldn't expect the car to feel the same when you start messing with alignment specs . You guys are driving a performance car and trying to eek out more tire life by messing with something as critical as alignment . I mentioned the specs to my tech at my last service and he said it would be to the detriment of the handling feel . Members kind of dismissed the info when I brought it up last time but from the similar complaints from the members with and without the spacers is feeling the same thing it seems like it could the specs and not the spacers .
Lobux , all due respect , but you are always mentioning the virtues of factory design and how sensitive and linked it all is but yet you are tweaking something as critical as alignment , knowing that it effects turn in . I am surprised to see this based on your comments on many other topics . You haven't done a track day in a while so I would ask , would you run these specs for a track day ? Thanks
I have gone through 2 sets os tires in 16k miles . Lol I am amazed people are trying to get 25k out of a set of tires and complaining about wear
Lobux , all due respect , but you are always mentioning the virtues of factory design and how sensitive and linked it all is but yet you are tweaking something as critical as alignment , knowing that it effects turn in . I am surprised to see this based on your comments on many other topics . You haven't done a track day in a while so I would ask , would you run these specs for a track day ? Thanks
I have gone through 2 sets os tires in 16k miles . Lol I am amazed people are trying to get 25k out of a set of tires and complaining about wear
06-30-15, 08:26 AM
#240
I have another alignment scheduled for Friday - i will report back.
I researched the tires and the spacers extensively before buying them. Recognizing the change of suspension geometry with spacers (which I hoped I would not notice unless I track the car), I did not stumble upon anyone with this specific issue before.
BTW, the issue is pretty subtle, but I noticed it right away. It may be my sensitivity to the "feel". I think another way to describe the sensation is as if I am getting hit by a strong crosswind at speed sometimes.
I researched the tires and the spacers extensively before buying them. Recognizing the change of suspension geometry with spacers (which I hoped I would not notice unless I track the car), I did not stumble upon anyone with this specific issue before.
BTW, the issue is pretty subtle, but I noticed it right away. It may be my sensitivity to the "feel". I think another way to describe the sensation is as if I am getting hit by a strong crosswind at speed sometimes.
Last edited by Vervish; 06-30-15 at 08:31 AM.
