Steering issue-wanders at high speeds
03-10-17, 07:22 AM
#1
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
Steering issue-wanders at high speeds
Hello everyone! I discovered this forum just this morning and signed up to learn and share, and to ask about a specific issue with the electric power steering. I purchased my '15 IS350 F Sport CPO two weeks ago. I live in Orange County and work in L.A. While driving in to work early the next day, I could feel that steering wasn't quite right. While driving straight, the car would wander slightly in the lane. The steering felt "notchy", right in the center. I googled "Lexus IS350 notchy steering" and discovered that this is a known issue, but with 2006-2011 Lexus', not this generation. I emailed my salesperson and also the sales manager about this; they recommended that I bring the car in to the service department and have a diagnostician drive the car with me as a passenger. I'd like to share the subsequent email chain with you...
"Greg and Maria,
Upon your recommendations, I visited your service department yesterday and asked for Chris, the shop diagnostician. With Chris driving the car, we went for about a 20 minute drive. Chris explained that the steering felt normal to him, and that there wasn’t a problem with it. Chris was very personable and I believed that he was being honest with his assessment. I drove home (slow, rush hour traffic) feeling better about the issue. Driving in to work early this morning at a normal freeway speed, the steering was again imprecise and difficult to control. Simply put, the car wanders back and forth; it takes concentration to stay in the lane. Without my constant concentration, the tires will be hitting the lane bumps/reflectors. The steering is accurate while turning, but will not allow the car to drive in a straight line. I feel a “dead” spot with the steering wheel at precisely 12 o’clock. The car will wander from this point left or right, and I’ll need to correct to the opposite direction. This condition is continuous and I need to correct left/right/left/right, over and over.
I love the car, but I’m nervous while driving it because of the steering problem. Please elevate this or do whatever it is you need to do to authorize your service department to fix this issue. Replacing the steering rack, aligning the wheels, or whatever will make the car drive in a straight line."
Thank you,
My salesperson replied: "Thank you for your email! I am forwarding your email to Martin, who is the assistant service manager and is already informed about the issue. I will be off for the next few days but this needs to be discussed with our service department and since they already test drove the car for 20 minutes and told you there is nothing wrong with it, I don’t really know what to tell you at this point. All of our service department staff are very experienced and well educated and trained and if there is any issue with any of our customer’s vehicles they will recognize and take care of it for them. If you feel you need to discuss this further please contact Martin at service department and share it with him in detail. I will follow up with you when I come back."
So I emailed the assistant service manager: "Martin, I’d like to leave the car with you to check alignment and all EPS components, tie rods, etc. I noticed that the TPMS readings vary as much as 4-5 pounds from tire to tire; could this contribute to the wandering at high speed? Please call or reply asap to discuss. My personal cell # is best: 310-xxx-xxxx.
Thanks in advance,
He replied: "I understand Chris, our Shop diagnostician, test drove your IS with you. He stated the car drove straight and with no abnormal findings. If the EPS system was failing, the computers would set a code. The tie rods would be a constant noise or issue, definitely not intermittent, but we have had no problems with 2014-2016 IS tie rods. As far as the tire pressure, they would need to be set when cold. After that, there is a fluctuation when the tires heat up; they will not all stay at the same pressure. There were no concerns with the previous owner and our technician does a thorough inspection of our pre-owned vehicles.
Our first recommendation would be to get a second opinion from a Lexus dealer near you, your IS350 is covered under warranty.
Otherwise, you may contact Lexus customer care at (800)25-LEXUS and they will address your concerns.
Sincerely,"
I apologize for the long post.
I wanted to share not only the steering issue, but the email responses by the dealer/service department and ask if anyone here has had this experience. As you can see, the dealership has dismissed this. At this point, I don't know if I can keep this car. I seriously love everything about it, even the steering while turning or driving surface streets. The wandering happens at 60+ mph. I've owned many cars and have never felt steering like this. Is this normal for EPS, and I only need to become accustomed to it?
"Greg and Maria,
Upon your recommendations, I visited your service department yesterday and asked for Chris, the shop diagnostician. With Chris driving the car, we went for about a 20 minute drive. Chris explained that the steering felt normal to him, and that there wasn’t a problem with it. Chris was very personable and I believed that he was being honest with his assessment. I drove home (slow, rush hour traffic) feeling better about the issue. Driving in to work early this morning at a normal freeway speed, the steering was again imprecise and difficult to control. Simply put, the car wanders back and forth; it takes concentration to stay in the lane. Without my constant concentration, the tires will be hitting the lane bumps/reflectors. The steering is accurate while turning, but will not allow the car to drive in a straight line. I feel a “dead” spot with the steering wheel at precisely 12 o’clock. The car will wander from this point left or right, and I’ll need to correct to the opposite direction. This condition is continuous and I need to correct left/right/left/right, over and over.
I love the car, but I’m nervous while driving it because of the steering problem. Please elevate this or do whatever it is you need to do to authorize your service department to fix this issue. Replacing the steering rack, aligning the wheels, or whatever will make the car drive in a straight line."
Thank you,
My salesperson replied: "Thank you for your email! I am forwarding your email to Martin, who is the assistant service manager and is already informed about the issue. I will be off for the next few days but this needs to be discussed with our service department and since they already test drove the car for 20 minutes and told you there is nothing wrong with it, I don’t really know what to tell you at this point. All of our service department staff are very experienced and well educated and trained and if there is any issue with any of our customer’s vehicles they will recognize and take care of it for them. If you feel you need to discuss this further please contact Martin at service department and share it with him in detail. I will follow up with you when I come back."
So I emailed the assistant service manager: "Martin, I’d like to leave the car with you to check alignment and all EPS components, tie rods, etc. I noticed that the TPMS readings vary as much as 4-5 pounds from tire to tire; could this contribute to the wandering at high speed? Please call or reply asap to discuss. My personal cell # is best: 310-xxx-xxxx.
Thanks in advance,
He replied: "I understand Chris, our Shop diagnostician, test drove your IS with you. He stated the car drove straight and with no abnormal findings. If the EPS system was failing, the computers would set a code. The tie rods would be a constant noise or issue, definitely not intermittent, but we have had no problems with 2014-2016 IS tie rods. As far as the tire pressure, they would need to be set when cold. After that, there is a fluctuation when the tires heat up; they will not all stay at the same pressure. There were no concerns with the previous owner and our technician does a thorough inspection of our pre-owned vehicles.
Our first recommendation would be to get a second opinion from a Lexus dealer near you, your IS350 is covered under warranty.
Otherwise, you may contact Lexus customer care at (800)25-LEXUS and they will address your concerns.
Sincerely,"
I apologize for the long post.
I wanted to share not only the steering issue, but the email responses by the dealer/service department and ask if anyone here has had this experience. As you can see, the dealership has dismissed this. At this point, I don't know if I can keep this car. I seriously love everything about it, even the steering while turning or driving surface streets. The wandering happens at 60+ mph. I've owned many cars and have never felt steering like this. Is this normal for EPS, and I only need to become accustomed to it?
The following users liked this post:
OwnerSince1990 (06-03-23)
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OCbeachguy (03-10-17)
03-10-17, 12:57 PM
#5
Instructor
It's the Tires or alignment, i'm pro to this, i get why your Lexus dealership dismissed your concerns, i just bought gen3 IS350 Fsport last week, i fell the same, my car did wandered 80km-100km per hour 60-65mile/h, i today it's gone ! , what i did was >> (SOmetimes the ROAD CROWN makes your car pull)
1, unplug battery for 10 mins and plug them back to reset the ECU (Computer will relearn your driving habits)
2, Morning commute use Normal Mode +Eco, afternoon use Sport and Sport++
3, So this is the 3rd day, you use Manual Shifting, shift it like crazy bro and then turn on Sport mode + Manual if u can
4, keep an eye on the steering system and see, if not then now you go check your Tires and alignment, Tires and Alignment don't help ? time for you to call Lexus America.
If you switch to Manual Shifting you'll notice the steering wheel feels firmer than normal mode, Manual+sport even better feel, Gen3 Tires Pressure is 36 PSI all around, not 35 front 38 rear like 2011-2013 or 35f-37R like 2006-2010,
If your car has been involved in an accident, Lexus will not certified, if your tie rod is bad they'll notice when doing safety, If you buy a car from Lexus within 30 days before the safety expire, they should take care of your problem and concerns about the car, They should check your tires, balancing and alignment even though the Chris guy fell the car is normal, bring the car back and talk to them or else you call Business Bureau or Minister of Transportation (thats what we do in Ontario Canada) Lexus Corp won't do anything they will tell you to bring the car elsewhere .
PS: don't mention about the issue mention about SAFETY and you BOUGHT The car from them, no one wanna mess with SAFETY GUY !
1, unplug battery for 10 mins and plug them back to reset the ECU (Computer will relearn your driving habits)
2, Morning commute use Normal Mode +Eco, afternoon use Sport and Sport++
3, So this is the 3rd day, you use Manual Shifting, shift it like crazy bro and then turn on Sport mode + Manual if u can
4, keep an eye on the steering system and see, if not then now you go check your Tires and alignment, Tires and Alignment don't help ? time for you to call Lexus America.
If you switch to Manual Shifting you'll notice the steering wheel feels firmer than normal mode, Manual+sport even better feel, Gen3 Tires Pressure is 36 PSI all around, not 35 front 38 rear like 2011-2013 or 35f-37R like 2006-2010,
If your car has been involved in an accident, Lexus will not certified, if your tie rod is bad they'll notice when doing safety, If you buy a car from Lexus within 30 days before the safety expire, they should take care of your problem and concerns about the car, They should check your tires, balancing and alignment even though the Chris guy fell the car is normal, bring the car back and talk to them or else you call Business Bureau or Minister of Transportation (thats what we do in Ontario Canada) Lexus Corp won't do anything they will tell you to bring the car elsewhere .
PS: don't mention about the issue mention about SAFETY and you BOUGHT The car from them, no one wanna mess with SAFETY GUY !
Last edited by Solara350; 03-10-17 at 01:01 PM.
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03-12-17, 01:58 PM
#6
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: MA
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I posted about something similarish a week or so ago - have a '14 IS350 F Sport AWD which wanders like a drunk at highway speeds in cross winds. Worst cross-wind stability I've experienced in a while, made for a nervous long drive...I'm planning on having an alignment done.
03-12-17, 02:37 PM
#7
Lexus Test Driver
Are you referring to when you leave your steering wheel at 12 o'clock driving straight, and the steering wheel drift to the right or left? slightly..?
I always thought this was due to the fact that the IS is sensitiveness to road chambers?
For me, When I'm driving straight & have my hands off the steering wheel. It would drift to the left slightly.. Is this the same problem?
I always thought this was due to the fact that the IS is sensitiveness to road chambers?
For me, When I'm driving straight & have my hands off the steering wheel. It would drift to the left slightly.. Is this the same problem?
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03-12-17, 07:41 PM
#8
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
Are you referring to when you leave your steering wheel at 12 o'clock driving straight, and the steering wheel drift to the right or left? slightly..?
I always thought this was due to the fact that the IS is sensitiveness to road chambers?
For me, When I'm driving straight & have my hands off the steering wheel. It would drift to the left slightly.. Is this the same problem?
I always thought this was due to the fact that the IS is sensitiveness to road chambers?
For me, When I'm driving straight & have my hands off the steering wheel. It would drift to the left slightly.. Is this the same problem?
03-12-17, 08:58 PM
#9
You can move the steering wheel two inches and there is no steering response? That's absolutely not normal. And the dealer tech could not assess this as an issue? Try another dealer as two inches of wheel movement before you get any response is not how my vehicle operates. Does this also occur at slower speeds or just at highway speeds?
I didn't read the entire OP since it was uber long and there was no coles notes. But a car wandering at speed is commonly a sign of a toe setting that needs to be adjusted. I would be bringing it in for an alignment check.
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OwnerSince1990 (06-03-23)
03-13-17, 09:09 AM
#10
Instructor
2 inches and 2 degrees, are very different measurements.
I didn't read the entire OP since it was uber long and there was no coles notes. But a car wandering at speed is commonly a sign of a toe setting that needs to be adjusted. I would be bringing it in for an alignment check.
I didn't read the entire OP since it was uber long and there was no coles notes. But a car wandering at speed is commonly a sign of a toe setting that needs to be adjusted. I would be bringing it in for an alignment check.
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OwnerSince1990 (06-03-23)
03-13-17, 09:14 AM
#11
Instructor
If your steering wheel movement more than an inch left or right = the steering rack or gearbox has a problem, steering wheel uses inches measurement unlike the suspension Camber Toe Caster uses degree. i Don't mention about Rack and Pinion because it's a 2015 Lexus, i would recommend Tires and Alignment !
03-13-17, 05:24 PM
#12
Lexus Test Driver
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Richmond Hill, Ontario, Canada
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Hey OCbeachguy...seems like a lot of great feedback on tires, alignment, and steering...and all quite possible.
It's hard to believe that you are having such issues with such a new car, especially a Lexus...but stuff happens.
If the vehicle is wondering to the left AND to the right when at speed, then i would suggest that it's not an alignment issue...or at least it's less likely to be an alignment issue.
Alignment issues are usually a single issue...meaning...the vehicle will either wander to the left OR the right (indicating a Camber issue), but not both.
Another issue is the steering being off center (indicating a Toes issue), but it will only be off center to one side, not both sides.
The issues you are describing are usually related to worn suspension or a steering issue.
Worn springs and/or shocks/struts can cause wandering, especially at highway speed.
If a spring is weak, or a shock is leaking, then a side to side wandering can occur with the vehicle at speed.
Given the age of your vehicle, hard to believe this may have happened....but like I said, stuff happens.
Lastly as the vehicle has electric steering, it's possible that if the steering hasn't been calibrated properly, that wandering may also occur at speed.
The calibration could have been undone by some type of steering related repair, or maybe an alignment was done and the steering not calibrated after.
A simple calibration performed using the Toyota/Lexus scan tool will address any calibration issues.
Good luck and let us know what happens.
It's hard to believe that you are having such issues with such a new car, especially a Lexus...but stuff happens.
If the vehicle is wondering to the left AND to the right when at speed, then i would suggest that it's not an alignment issue...or at least it's less likely to be an alignment issue.
Alignment issues are usually a single issue...meaning...the vehicle will either wander to the left OR the right (indicating a Camber issue), but not both.
Another issue is the steering being off center (indicating a Toes issue), but it will only be off center to one side, not both sides.
The issues you are describing are usually related to worn suspension or a steering issue.
Worn springs and/or shocks/struts can cause wandering, especially at highway speed.
If a spring is weak, or a shock is leaking, then a side to side wandering can occur with the vehicle at speed.
Given the age of your vehicle, hard to believe this may have happened....but like I said, stuff happens.
Lastly as the vehicle has electric steering, it's possible that if the steering hasn't been calibrated properly, that wandering may also occur at speed.
The calibration could have been undone by some type of steering related repair, or maybe an alignment was done and the steering not calibrated after.
A simple calibration performed using the Toyota/Lexus scan tool will address any calibration issues.
Good luck and let us know what happens.
The following 2 users liked this post by Sasnuke:
OCbeachguy (03-15-17),
OwnerSince1990 (06-03-23)
The following users liked this post:
OCbeachguy (03-15-17)