Evitzee

Staying with dino juice....we have plenty of it and those that say it is 'unsustainable' have been saying that since the Carter days....and we have more oil now than then due to human ingenuity. Hybrids or electric cars are not the future. Let research continue on alternative fuels in the laboratory, but for practical use nothing is going to beat fossil fueled vehicles for a long, long time.

Jaquimo

I'm from South Africa and it is nothing like the developed world where most Lexus drivers are from but here are some of the benefits that I enjoy by using a hybrid (2009 Prius and 2009 RX450h):

- the smooth torque at slow speeds makes them ideal for travelling in the red Kalahari sands
- driving and pulling away on steep gravel slopes without spinning the tyres is as easy as pie
- driving more than 1000 km without refuelling makes those long trips a pleasure
- driving right up to wildlife in EV mode without disturbing them is priceless
- using my vehicle as a power supply for the electric fridge/freezer when camping is just so convenient

If I have to choose another vehicle it will most likely be another hybrid.

ericsan13

Those are good benefits, very specific to your area.

How are you using your 450h as a power supply? Were you able to connect to the traction batteries somehow?

Jaquimo

I put the vehicle in park with the ignition switched on. The ICE runs for around 2 minutes every half an hour to charge the traction batteries.
I have fitted a fused Anderson connector (http://www.rebel-cell.com/shop/connector-50ah-type-anderson.html?open&lang=en) directly to the 12 Volt battery that I mainly use for the portable compressor when I need to inflate the tyres after driving on gravel or sand. I connect the freezer to the same connector.

ericsan13

Very cool - how long are you able to run the freezer that way?

Doesn't the alternator charge the 12V battery? I thought the traction batteries can't charge the 12V battery.

Dale91952

Electric, hydrogen fuel cells, hybrid and who know what else are the future. A Porsche 919 Hybrid just won Le Mans. Le Mans. More and more automotive engineers are recognizing the potential of hybrid powered sports cars. Nothing beats electric for torque while gas is superior at higher speeds (for now). Tesla's P85 is faster than all but a hand full of super cars. Don't give up on the future just because of temporary lull in loyalty to a product that is in its infancy.

rns

There's no traditional alternator but transformer/converter that converts the hybrid battery voltage to 12 volts. This base on Rx400 and doubt nothing has changed. Although at least in Rx400 you have to keep system in ready mode or "ignition on", otherwise it will drain the 12 volt battery as recharge is not possible then.

oldcajun

One of the advantages of the hybrid as executed by Lexus is that the air conditioner is electric powered. Driving in town and slow traffic, the A/C operates very well as opposed to those driven by the engine. At idle, the engine driven compressor is turning slowly and (at least here in Arizona) the A/C struggles to keep the car cool. My 2006 RX400h had the best auto air conditioning I ever experienced.

Even when the RX350 has the same horsepower as the RX450h, the mid-range acceleration will be much better due to the extra torque.
Steve

rns

Really nice that electric powered A/C. Just opposite situation in winter affect fuel economy a lot as the ICE is running much more (RX400h). Dealer told (haven't read anywhere, somebody to confirm?) that newer hybrid models have electric heating element in the air ducts to reduce the need to generate heat with ICE as the car is standing still in traffic.

NateJG

Back on topic (Hybrid worth it):

Be sure to take the cost of fuel into account/calculation.

I don't know what's happening around here (Michigan), but the up-charge for Premium USED to be under ten percent -- only now it's over TWENTY PERCENT.

My local Marathon station sells Premium for $0.55 more than for Regular; and I pulled out of a neighboring Shell station without buying anything because their up-charge for Premium was a new-high-for-me $0.60 more than for Regular.

I just read a lengthy article (Motor Trend Aug 2015) comparing the Chevy Trax, Honda HR-V, Jeep Renegade Lattitude, Mazda CX-3, Nissan Juke SL, Subaru XV Crosstrek -- and the Juke, which prescribes Premium when the others can use Regular, might cause buyers to take a second look at one of the other less "fuel efficient" vehicles.

The $0.55~$0.60 per gallon upcharge is currently annoying me as I fuel up my 2013 RXh (a car that is the first of my vehicles - since the EPA started posting their mileage estimates on the window sticker - in which I DO NOT exceed the EPA mileage estimates.

Update:

The Michigan Senate today passed a $0.15 per gallon tax increase AND a tax and registration fee increase FOR hybrid vehicles only - since, it seems, that they believe that Hybrid vehicles won't be paying their fair share otherwise.

Hmmm.

TechNut

I think this is becoming pretty common. The Idaho legislature voted the same registration increase on hybrids this year, using the same argument. Fortunately our ES hybrid doesn't require premium (nor does our RX-350) so I'm not sure what the up-charge is, but I think it is only ten cents per gallon around here. Regardless, it certainly seems the financial benefits of a hybrid are eroding.

Cruiter

My burning question is How does your state know how many gallons you put into your Hybrid? Many people own more than one car and it's likely not a hybrid. To know which car you're filling with 'X' gallons seems an impossible act.

FLYCT

They don't know how many gallons you put in your car.

Michigan did 2 things in the recently passed 2015 bill increase revenue

1- It increased the state gas tax 7 cents per gallon
2- Increases vehicle registration fees (including motorcycles, hybrid and electric vehicles). Also allocates future budget surplus to road maintenance. Signed by Governor April 21, 2015.

Iowa bill:

The bill calls for a 7 cent gas tax increase as well as increased registration fees for all vehicles. Light vehicles and passenger car registration will increase by $21 while commercial trucks will be subject to a $25 increase. Motorcycle registration will be raised by $19. Under the plan there will also be a $75 fee for hybrid cars and a $140 fee for electric vehicles.

Wisconsin:
If Wisconsin’s governor and legislature give the transportation budget a thumbs up owners would pay an annual transportation fee — $50 for the Prius, another $50 for the Leaf.

TechNut

Yes, Idaho did the same by raising gas taxes and hybrid registration at the same time. This was how they "overcame" the shortfall in the transportation budget. I don't recall the exact increase per gallon, but I believe it was around the same, 7 cents or so per gallon.

It is personally disappointing because I spent the extra $$ on a hybrid in the thoughts that I would save over the years. Now I realize that I will save less. I'm still not dissapointed as others here have already noted, there is much more to like about a hybrid than merely the fuel economy. I just have to live with the fact that I will save less and hybrids could easily be targets for further tax increases in the future.

coolsaber

Hybrids are worth it for short city driving primarily.