Please evaluate my lease.
03-15-15, 09:11 PM
#16
Lexus Test Driver
I don't think there's anything you can do.
You already signed the dotted line.
You can let them know you figured out what happened.
And ask for some compensation, like free service after the complimentary 10,000 miles.
We've all been there.
Remember, the dealer/sales rep has been doing this for years.
To think that we/you can outsmart them is an exercise in futilty.
We've been buying/leasing/trading cars for more than 2 decades now and STILL we get screwed, just not as much as the regular guy.
We've tried everything, from coming in with a boatload ( an exaggeration of ocurse) of cash.
BUT they can still play with you/us by sticking with thE MSRP.
And offering deep dicsount by using Lexus Financial etc.
The only pleasant experience i had was with the TESLA model S.
It's like buying an iphone.
Of course it's an overpriced electric car BUT the 4-6 hours of haggling was a bonus.
You already signed the dotted line.
You can let them know you figured out what happened.
And ask for some compensation, like free service after the complimentary 10,000 miles.
We've all been there.
Remember, the dealer/sales rep has been doing this for years.
To think that we/you can outsmart them is an exercise in futilty.
We've been buying/leasing/trading cars for more than 2 decades now and STILL we get screwed, just not as much as the regular guy.
We've tried everything, from coming in with a boatload ( an exaggeration of ocurse) of cash.
BUT they can still play with you/us by sticking with thE MSRP.
And offering deep dicsount by using Lexus Financial etc.
The only pleasant experience i had was with the TESLA model S.
It's like buying an iphone.
Of course it's an overpriced electric car BUT the 4-6 hours of haggling was a bonus.
03-15-15, 09:16 PM
#17
Lexus Test Driver
Do you have email exchange showing that they offered you $54.5?? If so take it to the GM. Call them ask for GM and tell them you were lied to, you were told the price was $54,5
03-15-15, 09:20 PM
#18
Lexus Test Driver
I don't think there's anything you can do.
You already signed the dotted line.
You can let them know you figured out what happened.
And ask for some compensation, like free service after the complimentary 10,000 miles.
We've all been there.
Remember, the dealer/sales rep has been doing this for years.
To think that we/you can outsmart them is an exercise in futilty.
We've been buying/leasing/trading cars for more than 2 decades now and STILL we get screwed, just not as much as the regular guy.
We've tried everything, from coming in with a boatload ( an exaggeration of ocurse) of cash.
BUT they can still play with you/us by sticking with thE MSRP.
And offering deep dicsount by using Lexus Financial etc.
The only pleasant experience i had was with the TESLA model S.
It's like buying an iphone.
Of course it's an overpriced electric car BUT the 4-6 hours of haggling was a bonus.
You already signed the dotted line.
You can let them know you figured out what happened.
And ask for some compensation, like free service after the complimentary 10,000 miles.
We've all been there.
Remember, the dealer/sales rep has been doing this for years.
To think that we/you can outsmart them is an exercise in futilty.
We've been buying/leasing/trading cars for more than 2 decades now and STILL we get screwed, just not as much as the regular guy.
We've tried everything, from coming in with a boatload ( an exaggeration of ocurse) of cash.
BUT they can still play with you/us by sticking with thE MSRP.
And offering deep dicsount by using Lexus Financial etc.
The only pleasant experience i had was with the TESLA model S.
It's like buying an iphone.
Of course it's an overpriced electric car BUT the 4-6 hours of haggling was a bonus.
Most of the time they dont send out docs ro the bank u till the next working day. So there is a chance.
03-15-15, 09:30 PM
#19
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Okay. I just found an email that stated : " Also the price is $56421.00 so I dropped the price $2237.00 to make you a great deal." I found this figure on the top of my retail lease agreement as "Cash Price Of Vehicle".
03-15-15, 09:36 PM
#20
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Fast Tags. You should start an internet business. I pay you 1000.00, and you, with your vast knowledge become my negotiating expert. I would totally pay for something like that, and in my current situation, would have saved a boat load.
03-16-15, 04:44 AM
#21
Lexus Test Driver
I help out for no charge occasionally. In fact a few folks from here purchased a vehicle with my help. One guy did exactly as I said and he got a hell of a deal!
03-16-15, 04:47 AM
#22
Lexus Test Driver
$56,421 is the price? There must be other charges. They can add a package called "fix tires" for $2000
03-16-15, 04:57 AM
#23
Lexus Test Driver
I don't think there's anything you can do.
You already signed the dotted line.
You can let them know you figured out what happened.
And ask for some compensation, like free service after the complimentary 10,000 miles.
We've all been there.
Remember, the dealer/sales rep has been doing this for years.
To think that we/you can outsmart them is an exercise in futilty.
We've been buying/leasing/trading cars for more than 2 decades now and STILL we get screwed, just not as much as the regular guy.
We've tried everything, from coming in with a boatload ( an exaggeration of ocurse) of cash.
BUT they can still play with you/us by sticking with thE MSRP.
And offering deep dicsount by using Lexus Financial etc.
The only pleasant experience i had was with the TESLA model S.
It's like buying an iphone.
Of course it's an overpriced electric car BUT the 4-6 hours of haggling was a bonus.
You already signed the dotted line.
You can let them know you figured out what happened.
And ask for some compensation, like free service after the complimentary 10,000 miles.
We've all been there.
Remember, the dealer/sales rep has been doing this for years.
To think that we/you can outsmart them is an exercise in futilty.
We've been buying/leasing/trading cars for more than 2 decades now and STILL we get screwed, just not as much as the regular guy.
We've tried everything, from coming in with a boatload ( an exaggeration of ocurse) of cash.
BUT they can still play with you/us by sticking with thE MSRP.
And offering deep dicsount by using Lexus Financial etc.
The only pleasant experience i had was with the TESLA model S.
It's like buying an iphone.
Of course it's an overpriced electric car BUT the 4-6 hours of haggling was a bonus.
03-16-15, 05:03 AM
#24
Lexus Test Driver
here is a small portion of the thread. As you can see Seehox, you got screwed by technique #1
********************************
Negotiating techniques:
The common mistakes people do when negotiate:
1. they trust the dealer to honor the deal without looking at the contract
2. they negotiate the monthly payment.
3. Not patient enough. It can take 6-8 hours to get the deal done, so be patient.
What you need to understand is the the salesman is a pawn, he doesn't make the deals nor he writes the contracts. Manager does the deal, Finance manager writes the contract.
The common trick dealers use to pressure you:
1. How much you want to pay a month?
Say for example for MSRP $50,000 the car the payments are actually $500/m term and Down payment doesn't matter.
The manager will tell the salesman to tell you that the payments are $630/m. After going back and forward they will drop it to $530/m just to leave something if your credit is not so good, if your credit is good, they will sell it to you for about $520/m at the MSRP price and a Higher MF. (This technique above is called packing, dealer packs payments with fees then he drops the price to get you better payment.)
As SW13GS said above, the dealer will manipulate either the payment or the MF, he will raise the MF at bring it down to get you "YOUR" payment. Even if you get the price you want, you may end up paying a high MF .002 or 5-6% APR even with 780 FICO Score, while the tier 1 could get 1.5% or .0006MF.
Yes, dealers increase points on the percent to make money!! This is why it is so important to look at the Rent charge on your contract.
Another thing you need to know is that, NOT all CAR makers offer Great Residual and great Money Factor. For instance, Porsche offers MF.002, which is extremely high. It doesn't mean that it is wrong, they just do not offer good incentives like other car makers. Same thing with a residual, some cars just DON"T keep their value, there for the Residual for example: on a FORD TAURUS will be around 47% or less. not an actual values.
2. The Salesman sometimes wants to know if you are serious and committed to buy today. If the dealer feels that you are committed, you more likely to get a good deal. The salesman will take this approach and will ask you to sign a small paper "i am such and such will buy the car TODAY for $400/m" do not panic, the paper doesn't mean jack, in fact it can play in your benefit if you use it right.
when going to the dealer, you should know the following:
If the dealer feels that you are not committed to buy today, he will not give you BEST PRICE because then you can simply go to a different dealership and ask them to beat the price. That is why you have to make them feel like you ready to buy TODAY, even if you are not ready at all. They cant make you do anything. You can get up and leave any time, in FACT this is a very good negotiating technique which shows customer POWER.
3. Another neat trick is REBATE. Know your Rebate amount. Most people are not aware that REBATE can be applied after the negotiated Price, as the REBATE is usually given to the DEALER from the MANUFACTURER.
Do not mistake it for DEALER CASH, which is ONLY given to you at that specific dealership as a form of discount.
4. KBB and Edmunds.com you can find INVOICE price of almost any car with any options. Most cars these days you can buy at Invoice, some even below. Dealer makes money regardless, don't you worry about them.
Generally a pretty good deal is, an Invoice price, or Invoice price minus the rebate.
5. Know exact options on the car you want to buy. Know exact INVOICE price with those options (Dealer will often show it to you, but it doesnt mean they will sell it to you at that price)
6.Know exact Money Factor for your Tier, That will depend on your CREDIT. For example, Tier 1 is .0006 (720-850), Tier 2 .0012 (665-720), Tier 3 (600-665) .0035.
As mentioned above, UNLESS you let the dealer run your credit they will NOT know what Tier you are, so they will quote you just in case as a Tier 3 or worse. So generally when you agree on the price, and you ask them to give you a run down, they will quote you with a Higher MF. Same thing amply is when you Buying a car.
7. Dont forget about calling / emailing around even if the Dealership not near by, this way you can create an illusion that you are willing to buy anywhere as long as the deal is good. The dealers will fight for your business. You tell one dealer that you got an offer for $50k and you tell the other that you got an offer for $48k and so forth.
8. If the negotiation is not going your way, GET UP and say that you are leaving, believe me you can always go back and say "YES". The more you threaten the dealer that you are going to leave the more likely you get a good deal.
Buying car is an ART. you need to understand how the system works, and be a good actor. You go to the dealership and you act, you pretend that you are READY to BUY TODAY if the price is right. Even if the Dealer does not have your car, they can do what's called a Dealers Trade. Dealers trade is when a dealer trades vehicles with another dealer, so that they can sell you the car you want.
You never stop pushing. Even if you got a good number on the phone, when you get there tell them that your wife said that you cannot buy unless the price is such and such, keep pushing them until you get what you want.
******************************************************************
******************************************************************
NATION WIDE ADVERTISED DEALS. + BAIT AND SWITCH TECHNIQUES
When you see a commercial or a news paper AD:
Come on over, you can lease/buy a Lexus for $299/m -0 Down
You really need to know all the fine print, unless you want to waste a trip to the dealer.
When you see the AD, they are not actually giving you a discount on the price, UNLESS it says Additional Dealers CASH or Dealers Discount is $$$$$$
1. Normally the advertised price is MSRP, what you do get is either a very good Residual value (which helps to keep the payment down)
2. or/and a great MF / APR % for Tier 1 CREDIT (710 and up) customers ONLY
3. they include all the rebates and discounts (Military, College, etc...) which you may or may not be qualified for.
4. they will not Include Taxes + Lic fees, which you have to pay as well, even if it says 0- DOWN
The Below Info is usually applies to a Local AD, not nation Wide.
5. Some times the AD Only reflect 1 specific vehicle they have on the lot (In this case they will post a STOCK #), when you get there it will be either sold or they will try to switch you into another vehicle that cost more $$$ anyway.
6. The car that advertised could be ONLY 2WD, Manual transmission, and BASIC options, Brown color.
When buying/leasing a car, remember that Dealer is in the business of making money, not loosing. If you got a good value on your TARDE IN, that means you are either loosing on APR / MF, or the Price. You cant have Both. occasionally you can get lucky, most of the time you will NOT.
***************************************************************
AFTER THE DEAL IS MADE!
1. GO OVER YOUR CONTRACT. As you may find hidden fees (packing technique) there like: Disposition fees, Documents fees, Outrageous Rent Charges fees etc..
2. Sometimes the dealer will call you the next day and ask you to come back, because there was a mistake, 90% of the time it is not in your benefit. Unless they can explain to you exactly what is it they doing, and unless they are Lowering your payment by a lot, do not AGREE to come down, tell them " I am sorry, I left the country" LOL
3. the finance guy sometimes will try to SELL you additional services, I am not saying that its a bad thing to have, as some of the services can be useful depending on your situation. What you need to know is, the dealer and the sales guy is also making MONEY(commissions) on those services, there for you can negotiate on the price as well.
Obviously if you are not planning to keep the car, do not get Extended Warranty (which is never BUMPER TO BUMPER), same thing with under body coating, not need it in the Southern states.
4. When picking up the car, make sure everything works, make sure all the things like Carpets, wheel nuts, spare tire, is all there. Look for scratches, wheel rashes, even look for body work, dealers do damage their cars, and they will not let you know, so you need to look for any damage.
5. if you bought a car and the next day or even two, realized that you are not happy with it for any reasons, you have the power to RETURN it and get your old car back. It is not an easy task to do, and the dealer will tell you that it cannot be done. Its a LIE. Tell them that you know it can be done, and you will not settle UNTIL it is done, or you will be coming down every day and talking to every customer about the weather, wink wink
**********************************************************
********************************
Negotiating techniques:
The common mistakes people do when negotiate:
1. they trust the dealer to honor the deal without looking at the contract
2. they negotiate the monthly payment.
3. Not patient enough. It can take 6-8 hours to get the deal done, so be patient.
What you need to understand is the the salesman is a pawn, he doesn't make the deals nor he writes the contracts. Manager does the deal, Finance manager writes the contract.
The common trick dealers use to pressure you:
1. How much you want to pay a month?
Say for example for MSRP $50,000 the car the payments are actually $500/m term and Down payment doesn't matter.
The manager will tell the salesman to tell you that the payments are $630/m. After going back and forward they will drop it to $530/m just to leave something if your credit is not so good, if your credit is good, they will sell it to you for about $520/m at the MSRP price and a Higher MF. (This technique above is called packing, dealer packs payments with fees then he drops the price to get you better payment.)
As SW13GS said above, the dealer will manipulate either the payment or the MF, he will raise the MF at bring it down to get you "YOUR" payment. Even if you get the price you want, you may end up paying a high MF .002 or 5-6% APR even with 780 FICO Score, while the tier 1 could get 1.5% or .0006MF.
Yes, dealers increase points on the percent to make money!! This is why it is so important to look at the Rent charge on your contract.
Another thing you need to know is that, NOT all CAR makers offer Great Residual and great Money Factor. For instance, Porsche offers MF.002, which is extremely high. It doesn't mean that it is wrong, they just do not offer good incentives like other car makers. Same thing with a residual, some cars just DON"T keep their value, there for the Residual for example: on a FORD TAURUS will be around 47% or less. not an actual values.
2. The Salesman sometimes wants to know if you are serious and committed to buy today. If the dealer feels that you are committed, you more likely to get a good deal. The salesman will take this approach and will ask you to sign a small paper "i am such and such will buy the car TODAY for $400/m" do not panic, the paper doesn't mean jack, in fact it can play in your benefit if you use it right.
when going to the dealer, you should know the following:
If the dealer feels that you are not committed to buy today, he will not give you BEST PRICE because then you can simply go to a different dealership and ask them to beat the price. That is why you have to make them feel like you ready to buy TODAY, even if you are not ready at all. They cant make you do anything. You can get up and leave any time, in FACT this is a very good negotiating technique which shows customer POWER.
3. Another neat trick is REBATE. Know your Rebate amount. Most people are not aware that REBATE can be applied after the negotiated Price, as the REBATE is usually given to the DEALER from the MANUFACTURER.
Do not mistake it for DEALER CASH, which is ONLY given to you at that specific dealership as a form of discount.
4. KBB and Edmunds.com you can find INVOICE price of almost any car with any options. Most cars these days you can buy at Invoice, some even below. Dealer makes money regardless, don't you worry about them.
Generally a pretty good deal is, an Invoice price, or Invoice price minus the rebate.
5. Know exact options on the car you want to buy. Know exact INVOICE price with those options (Dealer will often show it to you, but it doesnt mean they will sell it to you at that price)
6.Know exact Money Factor for your Tier, That will depend on your CREDIT. For example, Tier 1 is .0006 (720-850), Tier 2 .0012 (665-720), Tier 3 (600-665) .0035.
As mentioned above, UNLESS you let the dealer run your credit they will NOT know what Tier you are, so they will quote you just in case as a Tier 3 or worse. So generally when you agree on the price, and you ask them to give you a run down, they will quote you with a Higher MF. Same thing amply is when you Buying a car.
7. Dont forget about calling / emailing around even if the Dealership not near by, this way you can create an illusion that you are willing to buy anywhere as long as the deal is good. The dealers will fight for your business. You tell one dealer that you got an offer for $50k and you tell the other that you got an offer for $48k and so forth.
8. If the negotiation is not going your way, GET UP and say that you are leaving, believe me you can always go back and say "YES". The more you threaten the dealer that you are going to leave the more likely you get a good deal.
Buying car is an ART. you need to understand how the system works, and be a good actor. You go to the dealership and you act, you pretend that you are READY to BUY TODAY if the price is right. Even if the Dealer does not have your car, they can do what's called a Dealers Trade. Dealers trade is when a dealer trades vehicles with another dealer, so that they can sell you the car you want.
You never stop pushing. Even if you got a good number on the phone, when you get there tell them that your wife said that you cannot buy unless the price is such and such, keep pushing them until you get what you want.
******************************************************************
******************************************************************
NATION WIDE ADVERTISED DEALS. + BAIT AND SWITCH TECHNIQUES
When you see a commercial or a news paper AD:
Come on over, you can lease/buy a Lexus for $299/m -0 Down
You really need to know all the fine print, unless you want to waste a trip to the dealer.
When you see the AD, they are not actually giving you a discount on the price, UNLESS it says Additional Dealers CASH or Dealers Discount is $$$$$$
1. Normally the advertised price is MSRP, what you do get is either a very good Residual value (which helps to keep the payment down)
2. or/and a great MF / APR % for Tier 1 CREDIT (710 and up) customers ONLY
3. they include all the rebates and discounts (Military, College, etc...) which you may or may not be qualified for.
4. they will not Include Taxes + Lic fees, which you have to pay as well, even if it says 0- DOWN
The Below Info is usually applies to a Local AD, not nation Wide.
5. Some times the AD Only reflect 1 specific vehicle they have on the lot (In this case they will post a STOCK #), when you get there it will be either sold or they will try to switch you into another vehicle that cost more $$$ anyway.
6. The car that advertised could be ONLY 2WD, Manual transmission, and BASIC options, Brown color.
When buying/leasing a car, remember that Dealer is in the business of making money, not loosing. If you got a good value on your TARDE IN, that means you are either loosing on APR / MF, or the Price. You cant have Both. occasionally you can get lucky, most of the time you will NOT.
***************************************************************
AFTER THE DEAL IS MADE!
1. GO OVER YOUR CONTRACT. As you may find hidden fees (packing technique) there like: Disposition fees, Documents fees, Outrageous Rent Charges fees etc..
2. Sometimes the dealer will call you the next day and ask you to come back, because there was a mistake, 90% of the time it is not in your benefit. Unless they can explain to you exactly what is it they doing, and unless they are Lowering your payment by a lot, do not AGREE to come down, tell them " I am sorry, I left the country" LOL
3. the finance guy sometimes will try to SELL you additional services, I am not saying that its a bad thing to have, as some of the services can be useful depending on your situation. What you need to know is, the dealer and the sales guy is also making MONEY(commissions) on those services, there for you can negotiate on the price as well.
Obviously if you are not planning to keep the car, do not get Extended Warranty (which is never BUMPER TO BUMPER), same thing with under body coating, not need it in the Southern states.
4. When picking up the car, make sure everything works, make sure all the things like Carpets, wheel nuts, spare tire, is all there. Look for scratches, wheel rashes, even look for body work, dealers do damage their cars, and they will not let you know, so you need to look for any damage.
5. if you bought a car and the next day or even two, realized that you are not happy with it for any reasons, you have the power to RETURN it and get your old car back. It is not an easy task to do, and the dealer will tell you that it cannot be done. Its a LIE. Tell them that you know it can be done, and you will not settle UNTIL it is done, or you will be coming down every day and talking to every customer about the weather, wink wink
**********************************************************
Last edited by FastTags; 03-16-15 at 05:21 AM.
03-16-15, 05:46 AM
#25
Lexus Test Driver
Here is what I have, without seeing your contract and going only by what you posted:
MSRP 58,700
sell price $58,700
RV $36,000
Fees $1000 (aqus.. and others)
Tax $0
Cash back $1500
Down Paym $3000
MF .0012 ( $3800)
Payment $642.
So, if they sold you the car at say $56,000, there must be a package of some sort worth $2700. or just more fees.
$519 x 36 +$4000 = 22,684
you $650 x 36 +$3000= 26,400
It also seems that they over charge you for rent fee. I dont think that is the Mf they used in the nation wide deal. Bu my calculations they used .00038MF which is $1100 .9% apr
MSRP 58,700
sell price $58,700
RV $36,000
Fees $1000 (aqus.. and others)
Tax $0
Cash back $1500
Down Paym $3000
MF .0012 ( $3800)
Payment $642.
So, if they sold you the car at say $56,000, there must be a package of some sort worth $2700. or just more fees.
$519 x 36 +$4000 = 22,684
you $650 x 36 +$3000= 26,400
It also seems that they over charge you for rent fee. I dont think that is the Mf they used in the nation wide deal. Bu my calculations they used .00038MF which is $1100 .9% apr
Last edited by FastTags; 03-16-15 at 06:25 AM.
03-16-15, 07:21 AM
#26
Lexus Test Driver
You right, dealers always try to stick you with msrp. Even if you twll them that you a GM at another dealershio they will still do the same thing. They goal is to make as much $ as they possibly can. Just because you bought many cars doest mean you become an expert in buying. Me and some other memebers posted a great thread about Leasing and Negotiation tecniques so that people would not get screwd. It a sticky in Car Chat. I would advise you to read it. perhaps your next deal will be better!
you should have it as a sticky here at club lexus!
definitely helpful.
thanks!
03-16-15, 12:38 PM
#28
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Thank you so much. I have read your thread and am now 15 times smarter than I was 2 days ago. I got what I came here for, and will proceed to let the regional office of Lexus know what kind business Lexus of Spokane is running. They told me, "we want your next car to be a Lexus. And the one after that. We want our cars out there." Well. They got a strange way of getting it done (in Spokane anyway).
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