Daber

Hi Guys-

So I was watching a clip on Consumer Reports about what to do if the braking system fails on the Lexus HS cars. It said, put the car into neutral so as the gas throttle sticks (and revs) there is no energy going to the engine to accelerate the car.

Seems to make sense... I decided to try it. Here's the problem:

How do you put the HS250h into neutral when its in drive? You can't move the little gear shift to N cause it doesn't change anything (it stays in D). And I tried moving it to B, but the accelerator still works.

Short of hitting the P button I can't figure out how to put the car into N...

Anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks

flipside909

It's no problem at all. Like the Prius, while in DRIVE mode either while you're moving or stopped, hold the shift lever over to the left into N mode for a second and let go. It will shift into Neutral. The shift lever is an electronic control so it will revert back to it's same position regardless of if you shift into Reverse, Neutral. Drive or B mode.

You may want to watch these demonstrations:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=II_03lbr-Jw

This one is a bit vulgar but funny:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZ4PtafRB9c

RXSF

Like Flip said, you cant just slide it to neutral and let go, you have to hold it there for a sec. You can also put it in R in which case the car will make a beep sound and put the car to neutral.

Canesguy

Um, in the case of the Prius, you have to hold it in the correct neutral position for a few seconds (3-5), not just one sec.

RXSF

i dont think its as long as 3 seconds. maybe 2.

flipside909

3 seconds at the most but it really doesn't take long for it to shift out of Drive. The point is, you have to hold the lever over to the left in the N detent and it will shift out of Drive into neutral.

Prius and HS share the same type of shift selector mechanism. It's all electronically controlled.

Magellan55

That was a funny video, but that's only for a normally-functioning car. What happens if it goes HAL-9000 on you, and decides not to respond, as what appears to be happening with these runaway Prius cases? The shifter and engine button both go through the computer - there's no mechanical by-pass. Heck even the brakes are partly controlled by the computer.

Makes me wonder if they need some kind of kill switch somewhere - though I'm sure the marketing department would never agree to it - gives the appearance that you can't trust their computer.

YotaCarFan

The brakes have a mechanical backup - if you push the pedal hard while the computer controlled power assist & regenerative braking system has failed, you get conventional hydraulic braking w/o power assist. The steering is the same way - if the electric motor power-assist fails, just apply more pressure to the steering wheel to manually steer the car.

tonyscv

Also keep in mind that you can also shut the car off while driving, even if the car is in gear by holding down the engine start button for more than 3 seconds. You'll want to find a VERY empty parking lot if you want to try this out though.

Honestly... if there is anything Toyota needs to re-think, it's making this 3 second rule more obvious to anyone driving the car. I totally understand why it exists since you don't want to accidentally bump the button and have the car shut off while driving, but most people, particularly people who rent these cars with push-button starts/stops have no idea the "3 second rule" exists. People in a panic don't have time to fumble through the owner's manual to find out how to turn the car off while it's speeding uncontrollably. It needs to be obvious.

BTW... not to take anything away from the folks who did have legitimate problems with their cars, particularly those that died, but the latest Prius incident appears to have been a hoax. http://www.opposingviews.com/i/gover...-up-prius-hoax

RXSF

thats over thinking it. Nobody knows the chances of that happening, but its close to 0. And it "appears" that is happening because people dont know what they are doing.


yeah, mazda has it so that holding it down for 3 seconds AS WELL AS tapping the button will both shut down the car.

flipside909

So far the biggest/latest runaway Prius case was a big hoax.

http://jalopnik.com/5493693/america-...ax-on-yourself

Magellan55

Oh I'll bet the majority of these unintended stupidity...er, acceleration cases are operator error, starting with Audi back in the 80's. I'm just coming from 27 years in manual transmission cars, so all this computer-controlled stuff has me spooked. Doesn't help that I'm a software quality analyst, and see every day all the unexpected ways software behaves. Think "blue screen of death" in car terms

Hey, ever notice every one of these unintended acceleration cases over the years is an automatic? Is it something about automatic trannies, or just that morons can't drive stick?

flipside909

It's more like people are like monkeys. They follow along and push common sense aside.

Oh yeah and morons can't drive stick either.

sttnSdwys

Good god man, didn't your car come with a manual? Anyway, slide the stick over to the left so that it is adjacent to the little "N" printed on the shifter. The car will then beep when it's in neutral if I remember correctly.

As for the unintended acceleration problem, just make sure your floor mat isn't lodged into the accelerator pedal before you drive.

Magellan55

IMO, any time a new car introduces a novel way to accomplish something that's been standardized another way across the industry, especially if it involves safety, the dealer should be required to explain it before you drive off. My dealer explained neither how to put the car in neutral nor how to shut it down at speed (but we spent an hour on how to engage Bluetooth, work XM radio, load CD's, and what to do if the key fob battery dies and you're in an underground parking garage with no satellite signal for Lexus to remotely start your car - and I don't even have the nav system or other goodies).

Having to hold the shift lever to the left, or to hold the power button for 3 seconds, isn't intuitive as you don't have to do this with other cars. Heck, when I park my HS a quick hit of the power button shuts it down, so it's totally understandable that when someone does that at speed, and it doesn't work, they might panic. This is a car, not a computer, and for the majority of folks old enough to be able to afford a Lexus, it's just not intuitive to treat it like a computer. Heck, I'll bet most Lexus owners don't even know how to force a PC to shut down to begin with.

And who ever reads the whole owner's manual? That's not an acceptable solution. The salesperson needs to show this stuff.

Here's another safety concern, unique to the HS (maybe other hybrids) - does everyone know how to jump start the car (or jump someone else)? Starter battery is in the trunk, and not easily accessible. So where do you hook the jumper cables? My sales guy had no idea, and had to ask the service manager. Anyone? No peeking at the manual!