Tire Replacement
02-15-14, 05:51 AM
#31
Just don't confuse the Pilot MXM4 with the newer Primacy MXM4. The Primacy gets higher ratings, even on Michelin's site: http://www.michelinman.com/tire-sele...rmance-touring. In my experience, the Primacy MXV4 and MXM4 are close in performance, with the only difference being the MXM4's come in lower profile sizes. I would think that your Camry would better fit the MXV4's.
02-15-14, 06:04 PM
#32
Just don't confuse the Pilot MXM4 with the newer Primacy MXM4. The Primacy gets higher ratings, even on Michelin's site: http://www.michelinman.com/tire-sele...rmance-touring. In my experience, the Primacy MXV4 and MXM4 are close in performance, with the only difference being the MXM4's come in lower profile sizes. I would think that your Camry would better fit the MXV4's.
02-18-14, 11:08 AM
#33
We turned in out '10 HS with 35k miles on the original Toyo's, the ones with the window sticker disclaimer that warned that 20k would be considered normal tire life. The final snow days were a bit dicey with 4/32" remaining!
If we were to have bought out the lease I was leaning toward the Continental DWS's.
If we were to have bought out the lease I was leaning toward the Continental DWS's.
02-18-14, 12:37 PM
#34
Anyone tried the Hankook Ventus S1 noble2 tires? Garners good reviews on TR at a decent price although with limited mileage being reported. What intrigues me with these are the ratings for ride comfort that are excellent. I got the 18" rim size on my car and with the oem Yokos the ride was pretty harsh.. I can live with it but on a bumpy road I'm on a verge of freaking out.. Luckily I recently moved so that one stretch of road I used to travel is now behind me.
BTW my Continental PC's arrived yesterday but the earliest appt I could get for mounting and alignment is tomorrow. I hope to get at least 50k (tire warranty at 70k) on them before buying again or I'm gonna be a bit disappointed. We'll see how it goes. If anyone else get these tires be informed that they are mounted as marked on the sidewall (inside, outside)..
BTW my Continental PC's arrived yesterday but the earliest appt I could get for mounting and alignment is tomorrow. I hope to get at least 50k (tire warranty at 70k) on them before buying again or I'm gonna be a bit disappointed. We'll see how it goes. If anyone else get these tires be informed that they are mounted as marked on the sidewall (inside, outside)..
02-19-14, 07:23 PM
#35
Got the PC's mounted and car aligned. I've only had experience w/ the stock Yoko's on this car so take this with a grain of salt.
The Yoko's are no comparison, even having driven today only about 15 miles the improvement was multiple levels better with the PC's. Tire pressure on dash display read 38, then 39 psi as the mileage built up. Alignment shop test drove the car a bit before handing me the keys so not sure what the cold tire pressure was. There was a smoothness in the ride that the Yokos could never deliver. Felt like the first time I replaced my tires with BS Turanzas on my old '00 ES 300 back in the day. This was on relatively even road/freeway conditions, when encountering rougher roads my ES was superior as it should have been. In comparison the PC's were a 10 on a 10 scale and the Yoko's probably be like 7.5.
Handling again was notably better than the Yoko's (only dry roads today). Exiting the freeway near where i live there's a bend in the off ramp where I live. With the Yoko's I always felt the need to hit the brakes before making this bend but the PC's effortlessly maneuvered through it without the need to slow down. Sorry but can't comment on emergency type situations as none was needed.
Tire noise? Here the PC's were quieter but only marginally. Rolling resistance? I'm thinking that the Yoko's were better but can't really confirm that in my short jaunt. Perhaps because the pleasantness of the ride and handling the PC's gave me the illusion that the Yoko's are better in this department. I'll ask my son his opinions after he puts some mileage under his belt.
I often regretted the ride with the 18" rims but with the PC's alleviating most of its obvious faults, I think I can live with them now. To be fair, the Yoko's were not meant to be a great tire but rather one that was economically built to meet a need for Lexus. Case in point my '13 450h came with Dunlops and I know there are better tires out there. My dealership gave me a bigger discount because I insisted on better tires before making the purchase which they refused to do. Happy trails everybody.
The Yoko's are no comparison, even having driven today only about 15 miles the improvement was multiple levels better with the PC's. Tire pressure on dash display read 38, then 39 psi as the mileage built up. Alignment shop test drove the car a bit before handing me the keys so not sure what the cold tire pressure was. There was a smoothness in the ride that the Yokos could never deliver. Felt like the first time I replaced my tires with BS Turanzas on my old '00 ES 300 back in the day. This was on relatively even road/freeway conditions, when encountering rougher roads my ES was superior as it should have been. In comparison the PC's were a 10 on a 10 scale and the Yoko's probably be like 7.5.
Handling again was notably better than the Yoko's (only dry roads today). Exiting the freeway near where i live there's a bend in the off ramp where I live. With the Yoko's I always felt the need to hit the brakes before making this bend but the PC's effortlessly maneuvered through it without the need to slow down. Sorry but can't comment on emergency type situations as none was needed.
Tire noise? Here the PC's were quieter but only marginally. Rolling resistance? I'm thinking that the Yoko's were better but can't really confirm that in my short jaunt. Perhaps because the pleasantness of the ride and handling the PC's gave me the illusion that the Yoko's are better in this department. I'll ask my son his opinions after he puts some mileage under his belt.
I often regretted the ride with the 18" rims but with the PC's alleviating most of its obvious faults, I think I can live with them now
. To be fair, the Yoko's were not meant to be a great tire but rather one that was economically built to meet a need for Lexus. Case in point my '13 450h came with Dunlops and I know there are better tires out there. My dealership gave me a bigger discount because I insisted on better tires before making the purchase which they refused to do. Happy trails everybody.
03-29-14, 08:27 AM
#36
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I finally just bit the bullet and bought the Michelin MXM4 Primacy. I got a flat tire and took the tire to Discount Tires for repair. Just so happens that they had the $70 rebate from Michelin and tires for $159 each. Essentially about $141.50 each tire. I was able to buy the full replacement tire if any reason with tax "out the door w rebate" $815. Still alot for tires but pretty close to the $130 they were offering the tires for during the summer. I still had about 4-5/16 on the tires at 35000 miles. Given that, it is truly amazing the difference in the ride, noise, handling compared to the stock Toyo.
Living in Seattle, as they say, the "rainy city", it has rained steadily already passing the 1962 record of 8.2 inches to 8.8 inches and we are not over the month of March yet. I will give you an update on the handling of the car in this rainy city on the next post.
Living in Seattle, as they say, the "rainy city", it has rained steadily already passing the 1962 record of 8.2 inches to 8.8 inches and we are not over the month of March yet. I will give you an update on the handling of the car in this rainy city on the next post.
03-30-14, 10:59 PM
#37
My car got 45K miles with Toyo tires. Since I bought the car used a year ago, not sure if it's the very original set or second. Anyway, they are running low and I spotted this thread. Called around and quote from dealer, they range from $850 - $1000 as Michelin Primacy MXM4 at the higher end. I happened to check Craigslist and found one tire shop has two sets left with $550 per set, install and balance included. Called them with down payment. Even I had to drive an hour to have them put on. I think it's worth it with $610 out the door.
The wear life seems a lot better for the Primacy. Tire shop recommended to inflate the tires to 38-40. The max is 51psi on the sidewall. The ride is very smooth with low noise. It's even less noise than the old Toyo at 34-35 psi and less stiff, too. So far I like it after driving for about two weeks.
The wear life seems a lot better for the Primacy. Tire shop recommended to inflate the tires to 38-40. The max is 51psi on the sidewall. The ride is very smooth with low noise. It's even less noise than the old Toyo at 34-35 psi and less stiff, too. So far I like it after driving for about two weeks.
03-31-14, 05:46 PM
#38
Just bought the Continental PureContact with LRR EcoPlus Technology from Tire Rack.
They were $665 delivered. Of course they haven't been installed yet, but there is a certified installer right down the road, so add about another $100 to get them installed.
I went with the Conti's because they had the highest tread wear at the lowest price when I compared them on Tire Rack. 700 as compared to 500 for the Michelin.
I'm sick of buying tires. That's all I ever did with my "other" cars.
I got about 23,000 out of the original Toyo's, so I hope to at least double that.
I'll report back when installed and broken in a little.
They were $665 delivered. Of course they haven't been installed yet, but there is a certified installer right down the road, so add about another $100 to get them installed.
I went with the Conti's because they had the highest tread wear at the lowest price when I compared them on Tire Rack. 700 as compared to 500 for the Michelin.
I'm sick of buying tires. That's all I ever did with my "other" cars.
I got about 23,000 out of the original Toyo's, so I hope to at least double that.
I'll report back when installed and broken in a little.
03-31-14, 05:51 PM
#39
Costco list the Primacy MXM4 online for $178 each and Michelin is offering a $70 rebate through mid-March for a set of 4. Costco gives you the "full meal deal" w/ installation, balance, tire flat warranty, etc. Comes to somewhat around $166 a tire. Good luck. I am still a hold out w my Toyo's. I have 6/16" left which should get me through the winter and only at 33,000 miles.
Last edited by TheAirman; 03-31-14 at 05:52 PM. Reason: spelling
03-31-14, 08:32 PM
#40
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Liweil, that is an amazing price. Great steal.
I have had the Michelin MXM4 Primacy for about 4-5 days in sunny weather, drenching wet weather and the usual drizzle we have almost year round.
First off, the car seems to "stick" to the road. Literally. The tires seem to be glued to the road more than the Toyos. I don't know if they still need some breaking in, but from day 1 to today, they seem less sticky. I can clearly say the ride is much much softer. The tires are slightly higher profile than the Toyo, but not by much, but maybe the added cushion or the tire itself gives a much more comfortable, softer ride, so you don't feel like you are riding on gravel or clearly on the road without something inbetween. This has improved road noise substantially. I would have the radio volume up at 30-32 to hear anything. My first reaction on the road with the Michelins were that I could hear the voices clearer on NPR and I did not have to crank up the volume. I now can listen at 24-26. I am amazed in the noise level differences, but did not have a comparison. Now there is a comparison. The Michelins also handle and tred water so much better than the Toyo in the drenching rain. I wasn't so comfortable flying down the highway in rainy weather w the Toyos after i started hydroplaning. The Michelins just stuck to the road and didn't come off the road at all. I have not tested the Michelins on a fast curve yet though. I think someone had mentioned that they were less stiff around corners. Makes sense given the softer ride. So my next measure will be if I am sacrificing any mpg with the Michelin's, although the purpose of these tires is low rolling resistance and green. We shall see. I am hoping this will be the last and only set of tires that I will need, given the 55000 mile warranty. I am pretty light on my tires and probably could have gotten up to 45K or more on the Toyo, like Liweil got, but I am glad I switched.
I have had the Michelin MXM4 Primacy for about 4-5 days in sunny weather, drenching wet weather and the usual drizzle we have almost year round.
First off, the car seems to "stick" to the road. Literally. The tires seem to be glued to the road more than the Toyos. I don't know if they still need some breaking in, but from day 1 to today, they seem less sticky. I can clearly say the ride is much much softer. The tires are slightly higher profile than the Toyo, but not by much, but maybe the added cushion or the tire itself gives a much more comfortable, softer ride, so you don't feel like you are riding on gravel or clearly on the road without something inbetween. This has improved road noise substantially. I would have the radio volume up at 30-32 to hear anything. My first reaction on the road with the Michelins were that I could hear the voices clearer on NPR and I did not have to crank up the volume. I now can listen at 24-26. I am amazed in the noise level differences, but did not have a comparison. Now there is a comparison. The Michelins also handle and tred water so much better than the Toyo in the drenching rain. I wasn't so comfortable flying down the highway in rainy weather w the Toyos after i started hydroplaning. The Michelins just stuck to the road and didn't come off the road at all. I have not tested the Michelins on a fast curve yet though. I think someone had mentioned that they were less stiff around corners. Makes sense given the softer ride. So my next measure will be if I am sacrificing any mpg with the Michelin's, although the purpose of these tires is low rolling resistance and green. We shall see. I am hoping this will be the last and only set of tires that I will need, given the 55000 mile warranty. I am pretty light on my tires and probably could have gotten up to 45K or more on the Toyo, like Liweil got, but I am glad I switched.
03-31-14, 09:50 PM
#41
If you are in the SF Bay Area and looking to replace your tires, go to Craigslist and search for Michelin Primacy MXM4 225 45 18. They still have it available at $549 plus tax. I am not associated with the the tire shop. It is a steal.
04-23-14, 10:52 PM
#42
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Here is a follow up on the tires now that I have put around 750 miles on them. Remember the Toyo's were changed early with still 6/32 on them. Lots of tread life left.
I can say for sure that the car drives like a totally different car. I never figured that tires would make that big a difference in the feel and handling of the car.
1. It is a softer ride. For those that like to feel the road like a European sports car, you should not get these tires. It makes the car drive like a larger car. It almost floats and the feel of the road is not as harsh. It is a very comfortable ride. I got a rental from the Lexus dealer when I had my car in for repair and got a ES350. It drove somewhat similar.
2. Sound: Totally quieter. I thought I was imagining it when I first drove off with the new tires, but the noise level must be at least a few decibels lower. I can actually hear the radio without blasting the volume to 32 on the dial. It is now at most 24 to 26 on the highway and 20 to 22 on the streets.
3. Cornering: I wondered how it would handle the corners at high speeds and actually is better. The toyos took the curve off the freeway recommended at 35 mph at 35 mph. Going faster seemed like the car was going to slide or flip. The Michelins handled the curves easily and tighter at 45 mph. I was truly impressed.
4. Braking: The reports said braking distance was shorter. I did not understand this, but braking is much shorter and cleaner. The car comes to a stop not a slow stop but a sharp clean stop. You can really feel the stop when you put your foot on the brakes. I am not applying any more pressure than usual and the car clearly stops at a shorter distance on my routine stop lights to work.
5. Rain: It has exceeded our usual rain fall this winter and spring in Seattle ( dudd) . When I got the tires, the week was sunny and thought I wasn't going to see anymore rain. My mistake. It has rained constantly and it is noticeable better driving in the rain. I am not hydroplaning down the freeway. It has great, great traction and I again have confidence in driving in this car.
6. Gas Mileage: It seems that I have lost a couple MPG from 35-37 down to 33-34, but only have filled the tank a couple of times. The trade off is will worth it to me.
All in all, I now really feel good about the car. I can blame all of the bad feeling that I had and willing to unload the car to the tires. Bad selection by Lexus. I wonder what the 17 inch wheel feel like since they had Michelin MXM's on them compared to the Toyo's.
Enough already. I wish I could test drive different tires now and get the feel with the other tires commented on in this blog.
I can say for sure that the car drives like a totally different car. I never figured that tires would make that big a difference in the feel and handling of the car.
1. It is a softer ride. For those that like to feel the road like a European sports car, you should not get these tires. It makes the car drive like a larger car. It almost floats and the feel of the road is not as harsh. It is a very comfortable ride. I got a rental from the Lexus dealer when I had my car in for repair and got a ES350. It drove somewhat similar.
2. Sound: Totally quieter. I thought I was imagining it when I first drove off with the new tires, but the noise level must be at least a few decibels lower. I can actually hear the radio without blasting the volume to 32 on the dial. It is now at most 24 to 26 on the highway and 20 to 22 on the streets.
3. Cornering: I wondered how it would handle the corners at high speeds and actually is better. The toyos took the curve off the freeway recommended at 35 mph at 35 mph. Going faster seemed like the car was going to slide or flip. The Michelins handled the curves easily and tighter at 45 mph. I was truly impressed.
4. Braking: The reports said braking distance was shorter. I did not understand this, but braking is much shorter and cleaner. The car comes to a stop not a slow stop but a sharp clean stop. You can really feel the stop when you put your foot on the brakes. I am not applying any more pressure than usual and the car clearly stops at a shorter distance on my routine stop lights to work.
5. Rain: It has exceeded our usual rain fall this winter and spring in Seattle ( dudd) . When I got the tires, the week was sunny and thought I wasn't going to see anymore rain. My mistake. It has rained constantly and it is noticeable better driving in the rain. I am not hydroplaning down the freeway. It has great, great traction and I again have confidence in driving in this car.
6. Gas Mileage: It seems that I have lost a couple MPG from 35-37 down to 33-34, but only have filled the tank a couple of times. The trade off is will worth it to me.
All in all, I now really feel good about the car. I can blame all of the bad feeling that I had and willing to unload the car to the tires. Bad selection by Lexus. I wonder what the 17 inch wheel feel like since they had Michelin MXM's on them compared to the Toyo's.
Enough already. I wish I could test drive different tires now and get the feel with the other tires commented on in this blog.
04-24-14, 03:58 AM
#43
Glad you like them :-) I've found the MXM's get about 1 mpg better than my old Conti DWS, but 1 mpg worse than the original Toyo's. The biggest handling difference to me is steering response / turn-in. The MXM's are much more relaxed, probably due to the rounder shoulders. But IMO that also makes them more forgiving at the limit and on uneven surfaces.
I also think they are a better match for the suspension, which as far as I can tell was tuned for the stock 17's with MXV4's. I'm pretty sure only the sport suspension available on the base model was tuned for the 18's and tires with square shoulders. With the Toyo's, a sharp steering input would give near-instant response, but the car would be unsettled, and rock a bit like it bit too hard and leaned too far over. The MXM's, and the Conti's to a lesser extent, the response was less sharp, but the car now confidently leans over and just turns in nicely, with no erratic behavior. IMO, like a luxury sport sedan should.
As for snow and rain, I've now had a chance to drive them on snow (packed/icy, not deep). Seemed confident, though now I'm not sure my ABS is working. I was on a long sheet of ice, and hit the brakes to slow, but the tires locked up and I started to slide sideways. Yikes! No brake pedal pulsing or dash indicator lighting up to tell me the ABS kicked in. Fortunately it was an empty country road so I just coasted down to a safer speed. Haven't had any ice since, but I wanted to reproduce it again before taking it in for service. So far, no matter how wet the road is, I can't get these tires to slip. I hit the brakes, I hear a little chatter, but the car just stops cold. ABS would come on quite frequently with the Toyo's. The dealer recently replaced the O2 sensor, so I'm wondering if maybe they unhooked something when they were under my car. I'll ask them to check during my next oil change - with winter over, and these tires, I don't feel the need for a special trip just for ABS.
I also think they are a better match for the suspension, which as far as I can tell was tuned for the stock 17's with MXV4's. I'm pretty sure only the sport suspension available on the base model was tuned for the 18's and tires with square shoulders. With the Toyo's, a sharp steering input would give near-instant response, but the car would be unsettled, and rock a bit like it bit too hard and leaned too far over. The MXM's, and the Conti's to a lesser extent, the response was less sharp, but the car now confidently leans over and just turns in nicely, with no erratic behavior. IMO, like a luxury sport sedan should.
As for snow and rain, I've now had a chance to drive them on snow (packed/icy, not deep). Seemed confident, though now I'm not sure my ABS is working. I was on a long sheet of ice, and hit the brakes to slow, but the tires locked up and I started to slide sideways. Yikes! No brake pedal pulsing or dash indicator lighting up to tell me the ABS kicked in. Fortunately it was an empty country road so I just coasted down to a safer speed. Haven't had any ice since, but I wanted to reproduce it again before taking it in for service. So far, no matter how wet the road is, I can't get these tires to slip. I hit the brakes, I hear a little chatter, but the car just stops cold. ABS would come on quite frequently with the Toyo's. The dealer recently replaced the O2 sensor, so I'm wondering if maybe they unhooked something when they were under my car. I'll ask them to check during my next oil change - with winter over, and these tires, I don't feel the need for a special trip just for ABS.
04-28-14, 06:29 AM
#44
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For those looking to get some 225/45R18 Michelin Primacy MXM4 tires, there is a double discount going on at tire rack dot com. They are selling them discounted to $146 each. If you buy four of them in a single order by May 10th, you also get a $70 rebate card, knocking total cost for the tires down to $514 plus shipping (which cost me just under $50). I have no financial interest in them or the website but would offer on the "good deal".
As a data point, I'm finally biting the bullet and replacing my original Toyo tires that came on the car new. For what ever reason, I've had exceptional luck with them...just hit 61,000 miles but am now down to a 3/16 depth and need to replace them. Would go back with new Toyos based on the performance I got, but the price is a killer and it appears I got the only set of tires manufactured the day after employee bonuses were given out... :-)
As a data point, I'm finally biting the bullet and replacing my original Toyo tires that came on the car new. For what ever reason, I've had exceptional luck with them...just hit 61,000 miles but am now down to a 3/16 depth and need to replace them. Would go back with new Toyos based on the performance I got, but the price is a killer and it appears I got the only set of tires manufactured the day after employee bonuses were given out... :-)
04-30-14, 01:35 PM
#45
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Got the tires, installed them myself and just submitted the paperwork for the $70 Michelin rebate. Hard to compare rides today (it was raining all day) but the ride seemed quieter. Will see how things go over the next few days.
For anyone running the Michelin Primacy MXM4's -- what tire pressure are you using? I've heard recommendations from 31 all the way up to 40 psi....
For anyone running the Michelin Primacy MXM4's -- what tire pressure are you using? I've heard recommendations from 31 all the way up to 40 psi....