gr8fulRed

if that is the case (which I'm not sure they are 100% the same, at least not when one works in conjunction with hybrid components) then I'm no better off...except I've eliminated the hybrid component risk. Again, I'm not saying the hybrid is not a "good car"...rather...I did not think the incremental mpg/torque were worth the long term risk of failure (I keep cars a looong time). There is a reason that service contract providers charge more premium for hybrids and cvt trannies.

Stoodo

iTrader: (4)

"incremental"

rl9010

I too keep my cars for a long time. I put 298k on my second gen gs300 before deciding on upgrading to a gs450h. I intend to keep my 450h for a very long time. I believe that the fears of the hybrid system are unfounded. Consider this, the hybrid battery replacement thread only has 40 replies(not all of those replies are indications of failure). I think that is a very low failure rate considering the number of cars that are out there. I do understand that not all issues are reported in the thread, obviously, but considering the pool of enthusiasts that frequent this forum I believe it is low. I mean have you even thought about other competitors and the cost of their repairs? I bet the GS450h will still undercut them all.

Sure the cost of battery repair could be high when out of warranty, but what equivalent car can you get for the cost of repair? "but RL9010 that repair cost is something that I shouldn't have to pay!" There is a saying "Pay to play" You are right you don't have to pay, just don't play. Besides, now that the hybrid tech has somewhat matured, there are very cost effective ways of performing a repair. I.e. simply replacing dead cells in the hybrid battery. (Thank you prius drivers!)

I believe the main reason for the premium change for hybrids and cvt transmissions is simply preying on market ignorance of a new technology. Fear is a very powerful selling tool.

Back all of this up with Lexus/toyota customer service (just don't act like a $#!^ and you won't be treated like one) and it's hard to go wrong.

At the end of the day, we all base our decision on the facts that are presented to us as well as our own perception on what is good and bad. For you perhaps the fear of the unknown prevented you from picking up a hybrid and that is ok. If you believe that the advantages are incremental that is your choice. I think it's a rather night and day difference between the two cars, but that is just me. (Not everything can be seen on paper with figures)

The best thing to do is simply make the best decision you could in your current situation and roll with it! I am sure we all enjoy our cars here. I mean why else would we bother to post our thoughts on them in such an awesome forum. Let's all just shut up and drive.

gr8fulRed

you would be factually wrong here. I have more than just a cursory knowledge of how service contract providers underwrite risk...and believe me...the claims are more costly AND/OR more frequent (relative the to the number of cars equipped as such) for Hybrid and CVT's. I do believe that once those technologies are further developed, enhanced, tweaked, etc...that the differences will be negligible, but as of now...there is certainly a higher risk for failure/cost compared to the traditional gas motors/tranny's. So..my "fear" was based on "facts", just for the record.

Drift King

Same exact engine as the 350 supplemented with a hybrid drive system...

jbuffett

It's simply a question of whether or not the benefits of the hybrid system and CVT transmission outweigh the extra costs. From FuelEconomy.gov:

2008 GS350 MPG - 19 / 27
2008 GS450H MPG - 22 / 25
2008 GS460 MPG - 17 / 24

If highway MPG is your goal, it seems like you'd save the money and get the 350. If you want a little more performance, the highway MPG isn't a big enough difference between the 460 and 450H to justify the hybrid IMO.

And in either case, if you're the type to keep your car for a very long time then complexity is the enemy of reliability. "More stuff to break", as my dad says about every car made after 1979.

I had the same dilemma last year and opted for the 460. I doubt that the new GS-F will ever appeal to me (dat grille), plus I hate that the new navi's are going away from touch screen.

LexusLive

It seems like all you 460 owners are currently reporting better average MPG than I'm getting out of my GS 300 AWD. Currently I'm at BARELY 22, with a city/hwy mix of about 70/30.

Now I wish I had the 460, never mind the 350. But all the road tests of the 460 seemed pretty grouchy about the handling/ride/styling. Of course they refused to admit that the real problem was the badge on the grill...

jbuffett

My LS460 got 29 MPG consistently between Dallas and Baton Rouge, but that car was too soft for my liking. So a big part of why I went with the GS460 was because it had an excellent powertrain in a not-as-soft car.

Drove the GS460 back to Denver from Augusta, GA. 1550 miles over 2 days, and I was getting right at 27 MPG with the cruise set at 71-72 MPH.

ThomasGS4

iTrader: (19)

I'll take my 460 any day of the week.

TRD_Power

This was about 200 miles into my road trip with my 460 through WA, even after punching it a few times. Was averaging around 80 MPH the whole way. I calculated it out, and I did around 28 MPG, little less. By far the most enjoyable road trip I've ever been on Super comfortable the whole way.

ThomasGS4

iTrader: (19)

I have a similar one, TRD. Here's after 149 miles on the highway with my GS460.

Stoodo

iTrader: (4)

I'll take my GS450h Any day of the week, twice on Sundays, and possibly three times on holidays, give or take.

bolido

I have a 2007 GS450H with 70K miles. Zero problems so far. CVT gets a bit used to but now I really like it. When you punch it it feels like a train as it just goes. From what I've read (someone correct me if wrong) if the battery fails one day you basically end up with a GS350 at that point

jbuffett

No, the car refuses to function without the battery:

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/hyb...d-battery.html

Drift King

The post you linked to was from a 2nd gen RX, not a GSh... Just a FYI, my HV Battery went out a few weeks ago and was replaced under warranty (see my post here). Car drove normally with the bad battery less the extra oomph. My wife noted that when she drove the car to the dealership, she watched the battery go from green to purple again and again. But the car drove normally... So Bolido is correct in his statement.