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Am I the only one that thinks the Mark Levinson system in our car sucks?

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Old 01-24-13, 11:18 PM   #16
hypnotika
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No complaints here either...love listening to music in my car.
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Old 01-24-13, 11:41 PM   #17
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why you guys turn off surround? that cuts off some speakers no? i listened to it w surround off and i didn't like it as much. now i dont support sound processing, but if i have speakers, i'll use them =)
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Old 01-24-13, 11:51 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joeb427 View Post
I had ML in a '08 GS and didn't think it was great then either.
Sounds the best in a LS460.
The 2005-12 3GS ML system only had 300 odd Watts of power.
The LS presently has 450 Watts, so it should be better.
However, the current 4GS has 835 Watts [because it's a newer model], so it should be by far the best, esp for conventional pop musics that needs a big boomy bass.
Remember that the power must be to the power of three - in other words eight times increased, in order just to double the volume!
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Old 01-25-13, 05:39 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peteharvey View Post
The 2005-12 3GS ML system only had 300 odd Watts of power.
The LS presently has 450 Watts, so it should be better.
However, the current 4GS has 835 Watts [because it's a newer model], so it should be by far the best, esp for conventional pop musics that needs a big boomy bass.
Remember that the power must be to the power of three - in other words eight times increased, in order just to double the volume!

It may sound better but wattage isn't everything when it comes to a great sound system.If that was the case the A8's 1400 watt Bang and Olufsen would blow away the 450 watt ML in a '13 LS 460.Why doesn't the flagship LS have a 835 watt unit?
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Last edited by Joeb427; 01-25-13 at 05:48 AM..
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Old 01-25-13, 07:29 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by modthispny View Post
why you guys turn off surround? that cuts off some speakers no? i listened to it w surround off and i didn't like it as much. now i dont support sound processing, but if i have speakers, i'll use them =)
I dont know about it turning off speakers. I think it just balances the sound differently.

It made the sound more balanced and not as front heavy IMHO.
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Old 01-25-13, 09:07 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joeb427 View Post
It may sound better but wattage isn't everything when it comes to a great sound system.If that was the case the A8's 1400 watt Bang and Olufsen would blow away the 450 watt ML in a '13 LS 460.Why doesn't the flagship LS have a 835 watt unit?
Sure, commonsense tells that Wattage isn't everything in a hi-fi system, just like horsepower isn't everything in a car.
However, like horsepower in a car - the Wattage plays a major role in the hi-fi system.
Just ask 4GS owners how their 835 Watt system sounds better than their old 300 Watt system in the 3GS?

The current aging flagship LS was first released in 2007, so it's really long in the tooth with its 450 Watt system.
It's best to compare the current flagship 2007-14 4LS's 450 Watt system with the 2005-12 3GS's 300 Watt system.
With a model cycle of roughly 7 years, the next generation 5LS is roughly due some time next year in 2014, and it will usually have an even more powerful amplifier than the 4GS's current 835 Watt unit.
I wouldn't be surprised if the 5LS matched or exceeded the A8's 1400 Watt unit; you know how these manufacturers are?


Also remember that in the world of audio, Bang & Olufsen is more famous for its styling, than its fidelity.
Mark Levinson is famous for fidelity.
Mark Levinson is actually famous for the amplifier, and not the original source, like the digital radio and DVD player, nor the output speakers.
The source eg the digital radio and DVD player could possibly be from some Japanese supplier, especially Sony and Pioneer etc.
It was the Sony and Pioneer joint venture that brought us the DVD back in the 1990's.
Toyota typically uses Pioneer.
The speakers are possibly from some other company famous for speakers like Bowers and Wilkins, JBL etc, or could even be plain Pioneer?
Actually, the speakers used in Lexus cars are probably just basic speakers, because if they were really famous B&W speakers, or Kef speakers etc, Lexus would promote their hi fi as being amplified by Mark Levinson, and speakers by Bowers & Wilkins etc etc.

The Japanese are famous for producing a very clean signal, but the Japanese are not famous for the amplifier, nor the speakers.
Amps belong to Mark Levinson and a number of other companies including: Electrocompaniet, Krell, Classe, Denon, NAD, and Marantz etc.
Speakers belong to B&W, Kef, and dozens of other famous brands.
Mark Levinson is actually not famous for speakers.
Both Mark Levinson and Harmon Kardon are actually owned by the same owner - Harman Industries; ML specializes in hi end exotic audio, while HK specializes in lower end consumer audio.
British Bowers and Wilkins - famous for speakers, actually owns both Canadian Classe and Japanese Rotel; Classe is for hi end amps, while Rotel is for middle of the range amps.

Benz use Harman Kardon.
BM 5 Series base hi fi 205 Watts; while a Bang & Olufsen 1200 Watt system is optional.



Also with that Audi A8's massive 1400 Watt of power; is it a traditional Class AB analog amplifier that is large and heavyweight with a warm sound?
With 1400 Watts, the traditional Class AB analog amp would be massive in size and weight!
Or is that 1400 Watts the more recent digital switching Class D type amp, which is compact and lightweight, very power efficient and runs very cool, but it sounds "colder" and harsher etc?
I suspect the A8 has a digital switching Class D type amp, unless there is quite a huge box in the boot?
I haven't dealt with audio for a while, but if my memory is correct - Bang & Olufsen is one of the leading pioneers of the latest generation of digital switching Class D type compact efficient amplifiers?
Class D amplifiers do have their pros and cons.
Thus, there's power, and like you say, there's also fidelity to consider too, esp in the Audi A8's case.

Audiophiles often prefer the cleanest amplifiers, which are the old Class A [valve type] amps, which require 100% of the signal as the input.
The Class A amps are the largest, heaviest, most inefficient, hence run the warmest, but they give the very best sound.
Because Class A amps are so inefficient and run hot, they cannot produce much power at all.
Apparently they are great for Classical Music, but not for pop music like Beyonce singing the National Anthem.
However, the purest of audiophiles use them...

Last edited by peteharvey; 01-25-13 at 05:17 PM..
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Old 01-25-13, 12:57 PM   #22
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Seems to be an aspect of human nature when subjectively supportive rationals flow directly proportional to amounts invested...
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Old 01-25-13, 01:46 PM   #23
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I love my ML except for when there is a low bass frequency the sub sounds terrible (like it is farting). Other than that I think the sound quality is excellent. I have to say there is a major sound difference between iPod and Satellite, Satellite not sounding that great (obviously because they compress the signal so much).

I really don't listen to the radio all that often but believe it or not, the stations that come through in HD sound really really good!
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Old 01-25-13, 02:52 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peteharvey View Post

The current aging flagship LS was first released in 2007, so it's really long in the tooth with its 450 Watt system.
It's best to compare the current flagship 2007-14 4LS's 450 Watt system with the 2005-12 3GS's 300 Watt system.
With a model cycle of roughly 7 years, the next generation 5LS is roughly due some time next year in 2014, and it will usually have an even more powerful amplifier than the 4GS's current 835 Watt unit.
I wouldn't be surprised if the 5LS matched or exceeded the A8's 1400 Watt unit; you know how these manufacturers are?
wait, i thought the 2013 LS is a new body?
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Old 01-25-13, 02:54 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by modthispny View Post
wait, i thought the 2013 LS is a new body?
The 2013 4LS is actually a major re-skinned facelift ie 4.5LS.
The real 5LS is coming soon...

Last edited by peteharvey; 01-25-13 at 03:03 PM..
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Old 01-25-13, 04:02 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by peteharvey View Post
The 2013 4LS is actually a major re-skinned facelift ie 4.5LS.
The real 5LS is coming soon...
ahh ok. because the interior was changed too, what a huge revision.
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Old 01-25-13, 04:26 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by modthispny View Post
ahh ok. because the interior was changed too, what a huge revision.
I suspect they were trying to bring the LS in line with the new corporate spindle grill look, and that 2012 major facelift of the 4.5LS may even lengthen the model cycle to 8 years, but I hope not, because Benz and Beamer are said to be reducing their model cylcles from 7 years to 6 years.

However, they didn't do much to beef up the LS's audio?
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Old 01-25-13, 05:16 PM   #28
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ML in my 07 GS sounds fantastic on movies. for CD's or IPOD, it needs more bottom end, which i wil solve by adding my own subs. Highs and mids are fine.
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Old 01-25-13, 05:20 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KAZEMBE View Post
ML in my 07 GS sounds fantastic on movies. for CD's or IPOD, it needs more bottom end, which i wil solve by adding my own subs. Highs and mids are fine.
Remember to get a powerful power-amp for that sub too, because their 10" sub need a lot of power to power them, and the 2007 GS's ML only has some 300 Watts....
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Old 01-25-13, 05:23 PM   #30
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Thanks for all the input guys. I guess what I was hoping for is if someone was actually having problems with there system and there was a fix for it. I just can't imagine the system would sound this way and there not be a problem with it. I'm almost wondering if there are a few speakers not firing which are creating holes in the frequency ranges.
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Old 01-25-13, 05:23 PM
 
 
 
 
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