"I didn't want this car" - Akio Toyoda, about the 4GS
08-30-11, 05:51 PM
#16
Akio joined management in the year 2000, TMC started heading south right around the same time frames.
Last edited by BNR34; 08-30-11 at 06:10 PM.
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bjjones (03-09-22)
08-30-11, 06:16 PM
#17
That's why I always say, if Lexus make a GS-F at all, it will be a half *** low budget effort of just taking whatever is in the IS-F part's bins type deal, it won't be a E63/M5 conquering, 550 hp twin turbos V8 that cost $100k.
They barely want to make a GS at all, let alone another super sport F sedan, Akio probably got yell at enough from all the money he blew on F1 and the LFA.
It does seems the longer we wait, the more it seems there won't be a GS-F at all. Some of you guys got your wishes, if it aren't hot, don't make it at all. Wow, that would be weak, no V8 at all in the entire line up.
They barely want to make a GS at all, let alone another super sport F sedan, Akio probably got yell at enough from all the money he blew on F1 and the LFA.
It does seems the longer we wait, the more it seems there won't be a GS-F at all. Some of you guys got your wishes, if it aren't hot, don't make it at all. Wow, that would be weak, no V8 at all in the entire line up.
08-30-11, 06:33 PM
#18
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
What really is disappointing is most people on CL LOVE the GS & SC, and Lexus cancelled the SC and was about to cancel the GS??? Then Lexus would be just as bad as Acura.
To all the people making excuses for Toyoda - How can the CEO not be aware of how important the GS & SC are to the Lexus brand? They carry prestige, luxury, and styling that the ES and RX do not.
BTW he only LISTENED, after the Lexus execs acted crazy and probably threatened a revolt.
This is honestly a crazy story IMO and shows how little Lexus means to Toyoda. The sad thing is that management was not on the same page and therefore the 4GS probably could of been a much better product than what it is.
To all the people making excuses for Toyoda - How can the CEO not be aware of how important the GS & SC are to the Lexus brand? They carry prestige, luxury, and styling that the ES and RX do not.
BTW he only LISTENED, after the Lexus execs acted crazy and probably threatened a revolt.
This is honestly a crazy story IMO and shows how little Lexus means to Toyoda. The sad thing is that management was not on the same page and therefore the 4GS probably could of been a much better product than what it is.
Last edited by RNM GS3; 08-30-11 at 06:39 PM.
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bjjones (03-09-22)
08-30-11, 07:13 PM
#20
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Posts: n/a
I think there was misinterpretation, exaggeration and the media and anti-Lexus crowd is running with this. There is no way the GS was going to be canceled, it was always in the product pipeline, I can 100% assure you all of this.
I think maybe he meant "i didn't want the V-8" or maybe " I didn't like the direction of the GS" rather than outright cancel. The car sold very well initially and sales tapered off and between increased competition, a higher price, the recall mess and a product that didn't really lead the field it was difficult during later years.
Sadly the media instead of praising the GS for going against the grain for not growing in size and for LOSING weight is now sensationalizing a few words/sentences to further crap on Lexus.
The story is crazy and some of you are eating it alive. Its not that serious, the GS is here, the GS was never going anywhere.
I think maybe he meant "i didn't want the V-8" or maybe " I didn't like the direction of the GS" rather than outright cancel. The car sold very well initially and sales tapered off and between increased competition, a higher price, the recall mess and a product that didn't really lead the field it was difficult during later years.
Sadly the media instead of praising the GS for going against the grain for not growing in size and for LOSING weight is now sensationalizing a few words/sentences to further crap on Lexus.
The story is crazy and some of you are eating it alive. Its not that serious, the GS is here, the GS was never going anywhere.
08-30-11, 07:25 PM
#21
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
I think there was misinterpretation, exaggeration and the media and anti-Lexus crowd is running with this. There is no way the GS was going to be canceled, it was always in the product pipeline, I can 100% assure you all of this.
I think maybe he meant "i didn't want the V-8" or maybe " I didn't like the direction of the GS" rather than outright cancel. The car sold very well initially and sales tapered off and between increased competition, a higher price, the recall mess and a product that didn't really lead the field it was difficult during later years.
Sadly the media instead of praising the GS for going against the grain for not growing in size and for LOSING weight is now sensationalizing a few words/sentences to further crap on Lexus.
The story is crazy and some of you are eating it alive. Its not that serious, the GS is here, the GS was never going anywhere.
I think maybe he meant "i didn't want the V-8" or maybe " I didn't like the direction of the GS" rather than outright cancel. The car sold very well initially and sales tapered off and between increased competition, a higher price, the recall mess and a product that didn't really lead the field it was difficult during later years.
Sadly the media instead of praising the GS for going against the grain for not growing in size and for LOSING weight is now sensationalizing a few words/sentences to further crap on Lexus.
The story is crazy and some of you are eating it alive. Its not that serious, the GS is here, the GS was never going anywhere.
Several top Toyota executives confirmed that the 2013 GS redesign had been as good as dead.
"There were some executives, including Akio, who thought, in terms of our priority list, that the GS should be delayed or canceled," said Andrew Coetzee, now U.S. vice president of Lexus Brand Development. He was a Lexus product planner in Japan at the time.
BTW 1sicklex - was the SC not cancelled? was the V8 not dropped? To me thats pretty serious.
Lexus was being managed the wrong way by their own admission, and its not quite clear if they fixed this.
08-30-11, 07:35 PM
#22
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The media did not state this:
Several top Toyota executives confirmed that the 2013 GS redesign had been as good as dead.
"There were some executives, including Akio, who thought, in terms of our priority list, that the GS should be delayed or canceled," said Andrew Coetzee, now U.S. vice president of Lexus Brand Development. He was a Lexus product planner in Japan at the time.
BTW 1sicklex - was the SC not cancelled? was the V8 not dropped? To me thats pretty serious.
Lexus was being managed the wrong way by their own admission, and its not quite clear if they fixed this.
Several top Toyota executives confirmed that the 2013 GS redesign had been as good as dead.
"There were some executives, including Akio, who thought, in terms of our priority list, that the GS should be delayed or canceled," said Andrew Coetzee, now U.S. vice president of Lexus Brand Development. He was a Lexus product planner in Japan at the time.
BTW 1sicklex - was the SC not cancelled? was the V8 not dropped? To me thats pretty serious.
Lexus was being managed the wrong way by their own admission, and its not quite clear if they fixed this.
The SC's 4.3 is gone, no Lexus uses the 4.3 anymore. Lexus offered 5 V-8s at the time
4.3
4.6
4.7
5.0
5.7
The 4.3 got canned. Lexus still offers 4 V-8s in different vehicles.
Now what I don't doubt is the confusion internally at Lexus and from MY UNDERSTANDING the situation is actually flipflopped, something I mentioned before.
1. Lexus wants to move sportier, they want to offer more packages, they want to offer more and more
2. Dealers are pushing back b/c they got really accustomed to making tons of money selling ES/RX/LS in white/silver/black with beige leather with minimal competition. They don't want sportier Lexus vehicles. Employees want easy sales, not complicated ones like a IS F or GS.
So I was surprised to read the opposite, that Lexus wants to can the GS and dealers saved it. I find that odd.
Bottom line, Lexus needs to wake the hell up and stop moving so slow. Audi has seriously ascended and the German 3 are now the strong German 3. Contrarily, you have Lexus leading the Japanese charge with issues and the other two are non-existent. Lexus showed FOCUS, tremendous grit, determination and ***** with the LFA and they need that same attitude with every product.
The other issue is out of Toyota's hands and its really hurting Japanese exports. THE YEN IS DOING TERRIBLE. Japan cannot seen to figure out how to stabilize it and make things better. You then are left with eroding value with Japanese brands, a HALLMARK they sell on many times. It is another thread I started in the past, the VALUE IS ERODING and people will simply go with a German car. There was a time the IS F would cost around $50-55k loaded when the yen was acting right. Today the IS F increased again and it STARTS at 61k. The ES now starts at 36k. The value is being lost.
Mr. Toyoda stated he is not sure what the focus is now or what they stand for and that can be a giant problem. They need to chose a path, stick with it and go with it. I am confident they will succeed.
In the meantime, Porsche is looking more and more yummy.
Last edited by LexFather; 08-30-11 at 07:39 PM.
08-30-11, 08:06 PM
#23
Lexus Champion
Yeah, I don't pay any attention to the naysayers that speak like they know what's going on. Toyoda isn't 'running the company in the ground'. Quite the opposite. He's not Focused on being #1, rather being the best, not the most. Quality over quantity. Dude was responsible for saying YES to the LFA! How can you not like this? His changes will be felt, and obviously if he was ruining the company, the board wouldn't have him in his position. Regardless of his last name.
08-30-11, 08:10 PM
#24
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Posts: n/a
Yeah, I don't pay any attention to the naysayers that speak like they know what's going on. Toyoda isn't 'running the company in the ground'. Quite the opposite. He's not Focused on being #1, rather being the best, not the most. Quality over quantity. Dude was responsible for saying YES to the LFA! How can you not like this? His changes will be felt, and obviously if he was ruining the company, the board wouldn't have him in his position. Regardless of his last name.
If we remember he even got a new test track built as well. He is an enthusiast, he drove the LFA in races a few times. So it makes no sense for him to want to cancel the GS. Maybe he is protecting dealers, who rather sell ES's all day long instead of a GS or IS.
08-30-11, 08:31 PM
#25
Lexus is gonna be a dead brand anytime soon, selling "rebadged" camry's with leather over the seat. That's my opinion. Any way, i don't like new car styles, edges and hard lines everywhere. i like smooth and flowing like the first gen gs and the sc. But ohh well, we cant do anything about it. And Toyoda will continue to make Lexus a easy seller rather than a sport-luxury brand. I'm sorry if i offended anyone, but when the only good car is expensive like hell to make and you've been using technology from 2004, things go bad. Take a look at the now vanished pontiac. Same 6 cylinder since the 2002 Grand Am. Bland looks and not a good performer.
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bjjones (03-09-22)
08-30-11, 08:35 PM
#26
I was certainly expecting more. Instead, all the boldness was directed to the grill. The rest looks like a hybrid Camry/ES350/IS. It's nice but not beautiful or hot. It looks more taut and the interior is sweet but I wanted more.
Many think the 3GS is unattractive. I don't see it. But whatever floats your boat. It sold pretty well if you ask me. I see them all over. It didn't sell more because it isn't the IS, ES or RX. Those are the sales leaders and this 4GS won't change that at all.
They should have killed the 4GS if this was the best they could do. Since it was put together in short notice and seems to be a mix of cars, I'll call it Frankenstein.
Many think the 3GS is unattractive. I don't see it. But whatever floats your boat. It sold pretty well if you ask me. I see them all over. It didn't sell more because it isn't the IS, ES or RX. Those are the sales leaders and this 4GS won't change that at all.
They should have killed the 4GS if this was the best they could do. Since it was put together in short notice and seems to be a mix of cars, I'll call it Frankenstein.
08-30-11, 08:42 PM
#27
Lexus Champion
Critics out in force when they haven't even seen the car in person. Supposed to be Lexus fans, guess not. It looks fine to me, just needs different wheels and a flashier color.
08-30-11, 08:59 PM
#28
Lexus is a good brand, not great. I like it, but not its recent decision. All the money that went to limited edition LFA could of been used for research and development of better technology that would go to cars accessible to the public, not just the mega rich. Ohh, btw, most people on here are here because they own a car and had a question, like me. Some just decide to stay. If it werent for this site, i would of never kept the car, but the people here showed me the potential of the car. I agree with the rims, they should atleast give it a "sports" package, not necessarily a "F-Sport", things like aggressive rims or a sort of aero kit.
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bjjones (03-09-22)
08-30-11, 09:33 PM
#29
I agree with jtrue28. They F'ed up With the 4GS looking like a mutt car with the front looking like a nissan maxima, the headlight of an honda accord, slap on an lexus es rear end looking. What happen to the GS trademark 4 headlight front? IMO, I think the 4GS is gonna be a flop, so sad.
08-30-11, 09:52 PM
#30
The V8 is just dropped from the normal line of GS for now, is not that serious. Everyone is down sizing cylinder count now a days, look at all the Europeans, pretty much every car is losing 2 cylinders on the new generation.