LexFather

Yes thats the list I help compile every month for years here. So let me tell you more. The INifniti M is selling at 50% of the rate as the previous model. Meanwhile the new E/5 are selling at pre-recession levels. In other words its a flop. There have been heavy discounts and the usual Infiniti cheapo leases since about May. Their own QX outsold their M37/56 which was unheard of last generation.

Whats impressive is the Jag XF since it is a V-8 model only with a tiny dealer network and the MSRP is higher than most of these cars (they recently unveiled a $599 lease).

Lexzam

Interesting list with lots of great alternatives. XF for sure has earned its place in the top 5 given its quality, results in comparos and the prestige it has.
Just curious, as I find Volvo and Saab out of place in this list...do you guys consider them as competitors in the luxury car market? For me they are a class below, maybe premium cars, but no more than that....

*Batman*

I would delete Lincoln MKS and Volvo S80 from this list. Those are ES competitors in my mind. Otherwise add the ES to the list.

Can you show us a line chart trending this for the last 10 years?

LexFather

Won't be making an excel sheet anytime soon. If you or anyone else wants to try, you can search each month in the title under "Car chat" and find the sales threads easily. I think we've done it for about 6 years now maybe a little longer.

EyeKutr

iTrader: (5)

How is it that there is not 1 spy pic of a car that is slated to be released in 2012 as a 2013 model ? I would think it would be debuted within the next 12 months at the latest at the 2011 LA auto show.....

LexFather

It was just like this for the 1GS, 2GS and 3GSWe got our first 3GS spy pics from Lexus with shots of it at the Nurburgring with the emblems covered lol.

EyeKutr

iTrader: (5)

Correct, that was early 2004 if I am not mistaken, so maybe in the next few months.....

TRDFantasy

Toyota is a very secretive company, and future products are typically kept a big secret for competitive reasons.

So far we have seen spy pics of 4GS development mules undergoing testing with modified 3GS bodies. We have not yet seen any spy pics of the 4GS with the final production body yet.

Due to intensifying competition, and also some confidential company information that was stolen by a few former employees and later brought over to direct competitors, Toyota is more secretive than ever. This is with good reason.

Years ago, months before the current Camry debuted, a few pictures leaked of the Camry from a Toyota dealer meeting. Now the next-gen Camry is debuting very soon, and not a single picture has been leaked. You can tell Toyota is tighter than ever in terms of security when it comes to future products.

LIMS407

really hope GS comes late 2012,,,

MR_F1

Will anything be at Detroit next month?

BNR34

iTrader: (1)

You are 100% correct, the Model S will have a base price of $57k, and it will have 2 extra battery packs to boost the range to 300 miles. I expect a fully loaded Model S will be in the low to mid $80k.

Tesla makes very nice vehicles, but they have the huge issue of coming with an outrageous price due to their low volume. A fully loaded Roadster Sport 2.5 is $160k. $160k today can buy you some insanely nice gas power car that would smoke that Roadster hard in everyways.......V10 R8, V8 Vantage, 997 Turbo S......etc.

szilu

Hi Everyone! Just been at the dealer for tire sensor change (second in a row) and had a little disucssion with the guys there. They told me that the 4GS will come in q1 2012 (at least here in Europe). There will be two hybrids, one for economy with a 2.4L petrol and around 200bhp and one for performance exceeding the present at around 400bhp. The styling will be more or less the same as the present but the front lights will be more like the LS's and they will stay under one glass instead of the two per side of the 2GS and 3GS. The trunk will be large as they will use a different technology for the batteries - no Li-Ion - which takes less spaces and will be a big hit for the market. They think that the Li-Ion batteries used by Merc and BMW are a dead-end and they will have serious problems after the first one-two years. Can't wait to see pictures hope that they will not ruin the design.
Hope that this info is interesting for you.
Best,
Sz

jruhi4

Nothing new from the Lexus brand.

*Batman*

Because they are not planning to do extensive road testing like the Germans do. They prefer to test on indoor driving rigs.

This might explain why they never sorted out the rattles, and why they have a completely misinformed view of how effective the car's voice recognition is.

LexFather

They are very heavily road tested but in the past more so for comfy then sport. The IS F was the most heavily tested car in history until the LFA. I think we can assume they will inject more sport in the cars so the road testing will be different, more on track then on road. FYI the new Lexus NAV voice recognition is a huge upgrade over what we have.

Also Mr. Toyoda is having a new driving facility built that emphasizes sport.

Sz thank for the info and that sounds like something we have speculated and something we heard recently, more hybrid options within a range instead of just one hybrid engine.

If they drop the V-8, it makes sense to offer a base hybrid, then base V-6, then a high power V-6 hybrid then a GS F. Won't please some people but to me its better than just offering one high power hybrid like today.