richie3888

iTrader: (9)

I been looking for a 2008 and up lexus gs 350 with mark levinson that's in a 25k price range. I'm giving up hope in finding it. Should mark levinson system be a deal breaker? I seen a lot of Gs in my price range but they don't have a mark levinson system.

maficrock

I would say it depends on how much you would listen to DVD's and the stereo system. I have the ML set-up in my GS430 and didn't know what the heck DVD Audio was until a friend of mine noticed it in the car. He was totally blown away by the quality of the HDVD sound. For me, it's definately nice to have but I don't listen to music all the time. I would think more important qualities (overall condition, maintenance records, dents and dings) would be more of a deal breaker for me. Good luck.

Whitena

iTrader: (2)

I have 07 w/o ml and I'm pretty happy with the sound quality, just make sure to get nav cuz then you could just add vaistech sl2vi (for around $200 for a used unit)then you'll be able to watch movies from iPhone or iPod.

anthrax144

OP, I was in your same situation recently. I had an IS350 with ML and loved it so I was really looking hard for a GS with that option as well. I finally settled on one without it and I'm not disappointed (ok, just a tiny bit). But it's definitely NOT a deal breaker, or at least it wasn't for me. I think the condition and color/interior are a more important criteria but that's just my opinion. Personally, I'm loving the new car and not regretting going without the ML.

ISFPOWER

iTrader: (20)

hell yeah. you know you want it, why would you settle? top model is best. dont matter if you dont need or or not, lol.

dekidex

I had owned over 30+ cars in the past and gotta tell you that the ML sound system rocks....
Is it a deal breaker NO.
But also only if you are going to keep this car for not a long time....otherwise i would say look for one with the ML.
I have red somewhere that if you wanted to equip a House with a ML sound system in order to get the sound quality equal as inside of your GS,it would cost you over 100,000$

Simmsled

Its not a deal breaker. I am an audiophile and have had Mark Levinson equipment in the past.

Take a reference CD, listen to both systems with that CD. Set all the bass, treble, mid, etc. to flat... audition both.

Overall condition should be more valuable than ML or not.

drydeniv

I just bought a 2010 GS 350 that was fully loaded - with all the packages including Levinson, just missing the pre-collision system.

Honestly, the ML system was a deal-breaker for me - I wouldn't look at a car that was older than 2010, over 20k miles, or lacked the ML system and it had to be CPO- pretty hard to find / pricy specs - but I found it, and a great price, too!

I love the GS, amazing car - I had a 2001 GS 430 with the ML system back then - and it was amazing. I didn't spend much time listening to my 2010 GS' ML system before buying it ...

BUT - to be honest, I'm not blown away by the quality of the ML system in my 2010 GS - reasons: lack of control, type of music I listen to, and general picky-ness. Now, I have a fair bit of experience with electronics, audio (have an advanced degree in acoustics, played several brass instruments) and tinker with speakers/audio on the side.

If you want to listen to original CDs of Norah Jones or DVD-audio of classical music all day - the system is absolutely top-notch. I love Norah, Enya, other smooth / easy-listening and classical music in the car (that's well-mastered and high quality) - it is a really enveloping experience.

When I put on some Walk the Moon, or Metallica, or fun. (pop / more electronica rock) - the system sounds totally different, and usually not in a good way.

There are really only a handfull of options that we have to tweak the system - a basic treble / mid / bass equalizer, can move the 'focus' around the car's seating locations, and whether or not the 'Surround' mode is 'on' or 'off'. I think the system sounds pretty lifeless when the 'Surround" mode is off. I haven't been able to find much information about the "Surround" mode, either, but I'm assuming it uses a fairly standard audio codec that may or may not be modified for the specific car model... Basically, it attempts to take stereo sound and force it into 5.1 channels - and it seems to me like it is treating pure audio like the audio track of a movie - and attempts to throw voice to the center speaker, and tries to shove certain parts to only the back speakers as 'background' ...

There are times when I'm listening to a song (Walk the Moon - Anna Sun, for example), at the beginning of a vocal phrase - for a very short time (just a couple hundred milliseconds) it will start playing the vocal track in the rear of the car, but quickly 'corrects' and suppresses it in the rear, and emphasizes it in the front - it doesn't last long, but I can detect it - and it is very frustrating, and fatiguing, honestly. Perhaps I'm more sensitive than most - but this is a problem that I don't seem to see many people talk about - and one that I'm not sure how to tackle (I'm certainly not replacing the head unit...)


And perhaps it is just my particular vehicle - anyone with a GS in Miami mind if I listen to their system for a little while? - Honestly, I'd love to!


Wow - Sorry about being so long-winded, guess I needed to vent. I'd love to talk about this more if anyone else is interested...


But, my suggestion is just to interview the car thoroughly - I doubt that ML would be a deal breaker for anyone (I was picky, but I'd probably be just as happy without it - given the audio processor limitations)... If you're really interested in increased power handling - then chances are you'd have to upgrade everything anyway - gets very expensive if you want it done right.

richie3888

iTrader: (9)

Very very good reply.:thumb up: Thank you

DrexLex

That's probably because ML home gear costs that much. But I beat the sound of my car in my home theater for significantly less. It's nothing special.

The ML system was a must have back when I ordered my GS430 back in 2005. But it didn't fully meet my expectations. As Drydeniv mentioned, the Logic7 steering is a little clumsy, the center imaging is neither optimal nor adjustable, the ML EQ profiles differ quite a bit depending on whether the Logic7 is turned on or not, favoring -- wait for it -- the L7 mode! And the bass was too muddy for me no matter what. I successfully fixed the bass as detailed in my thread linked in my sig "Kicker..."

It would not be easy to replace the main processing, but it would not require changing the head unit. That is just the source unit (which could use a better AM section like an Alpine while we're at it). All the signal processing and EQ happens in the trunk-mounted amp (whether ML or not).

I'm a little surprised some aftermarket company like Rockford has not made a direct plug/play replacement box for the Harman kit. Hint hint...

Boron

Don't believe everything you read!
ML is decent audio kit, but it's not state of the art - it's more a status symbol.
Boulder, Jeff Rowland, Spectral, and no doubt various others I've either long since forgotten about or not heard since having moved away from the audiophile "game", would be sooner auditioned than the likes of Mark Levinson or even Krell.
Chances are ML have paid Lexus handsomely to supply their branding - it's made by Pioneer after all!
I'd be interested to learn who makes the B&O, B&W, and Meridian kit fitted to other high end marques.
I suspect the Burmester electronics, as fitted to the Porsche Panamera, is made in-house, if only because that's the impression I have of how Dieter would allow the use of his branding.
Who knows? But as has probably been pointed out here or another similar thread a while back, factory-fitted systems are always going to be a compromise - probably due to a price point it must meet as well as space restrictions for where it's to be located, dictated by the various Health and Safety legislations, and legal liabilities manufacturers have to adhere to.

As someone with the standard system fitted, I can honestly say I don't think I'm missing out - it sounds decent enough, but only the buyer can decide for themselves if the lack of a ML system is enough to make them walk away from an otherwise perfectly suitable car.

tbilisi79

When I was looking for my car, ML was a must. Not because its a great system which it is not, but because its the best they have to offer, and I wanted all the options. When going for a high end car, whats the point if you you are missing out on some of the cool features.

With that said, what are the CD's that have a 7.1 capacity, or what to look for in a CD to take a full advantage of the system?

I am thinking of going for the newer Audi A8 in a few years, you can bet I'll be looking for one with their B&O sound system.

passnu2

iTrader: (33)

ML is not a deal breaker in the GS. If this was a 2gen GS then yes the "upgraded" audio, Nakamichi, was well worth it and there was a noticeable difference. The only plus with the ML is the DVD function/feature and how often has anyone truly used this? Unless you like to take your dates to parking lots and sit in the oh so big back seat for your first date

TexasTaco

ML is great sound quality but shouldn't be a deal breaker, maybe use as leverage in negotiations. One thing is its not that loud, my 10 year old Toyota Tacoma oem sound system is louder surprisingly.

Chaos236

iTrader: (1)

Good thread,I do not have ML but often wish I did. Thanks