Rockville

Whenever I have trouble falling asleep I just get out that telephone book of a manual and brush up on my I-Drive instructions. ZZZ..........

biker

True, but I bet next month you can pick up any leftover 05 GS for several K off sticker.

SpoonSport

I really think the Infinit M 35/45 will shock the industry. I know about the heritage of the others but many sedan owners are ready for something fresh and affordable. I have owned 2 G-35s and greatly appreciated their balance of performance and value. I'm in the air right now between the previous 540ia, M 35 and GS 300. Price will probably be a large deciding factor.

LexFather

I am not sure of shock the industry, the car hasn't made a cover yet on any auto magazine.. It will sell well for Infiiniti and finally give them luxury car success. Credit the low price, which is attaniable by sharing so many important parts. They want to sell 20k a year, which is very modest. At its debut in 1998, 30k GSs were sold and just last year, over 50k 5 series and E classes were sold (though they have so many varients with engine choices, wagons, etc, that is what helps).

The car is outstanding competiton and will give buyers finally another Japanese alternative.

SpoonSport

1SICK-Lex: I've seen so mnay people concerned about the price of the car. They equate price with prestige and quality. I don't think that's the case. Until the GS, I felt my '02 Maxima ws one of my best overall cars. It had power, space and a well appointed interior. I chose to drive it instead of the G-35. I haven't seen the interior of the M-series and I can't until May. I get out of the desert then. I've missed a whole year of car shows ad test drives. I base a lot of my assessment from you guys. I'm glad pix are starting to pop up.

Spoon

LexFather

Well you know your cars, the 02 Maxima is a very solid ride, I love the updated looks, the strong VQ and a well made interior. Maxima (before the 6th gen)=4DSC, and it was thought of as "the affordable BMW 5 series". From here and reading other forums, it seems the M interior is as solid as the pics suggest. The wood or aluminum trim is very nice, seems the needles swing when you start the car (needles on the gauges) and the quality and fit is near Lexus/Benz/BMW levels. Also, it seems the sound system is really nice, with the speakers on top the seats. In test drives, the lane depature system does work, it seems over speeds of 45mph.

If u mean the desert like "the desert" ,dude, if I can e-mail you anything about these cars (anything real specific) or maybe send a brochure (I think it may take a month or 2 to reach, correct?)let me know. seloc1@gmail.com

In all honestly, for Nissan fans, I can now finally see progressive steps, up to the M35/45 for those that don't want to leave the company.

SpoonSport

I had a great experience with the dealership in Hawaii from Infiniti. That's where I bought the two G 35s. My sedan was shipped to Bama and traded for the GS. I'm really liking the new GS and my short list is down to M-35 Sport, '06 GS 300, E-39 540i or '04 LS 430. The market is tough these days. The new GS and M raised the bar enven higher. I also dabble at freshalloy for Infiniti info. It looks like its gonna come down to a coin toss. My wife is test driving for me but I want to lean on the sport end of the sport-sedan market.

Mail isn't slow like it was during Desert Storm. The military realizes how important mail really is to us. This time around isn't bad at all. I have a Dubs GS430, IS 300 and R-34 Skyline on my desk right now. I went off topic.....

Spoon

LexFather

All right, now its too early to tell but here is what we can say
1. The first full month of battle, the E took the biggest hit in sales.
2. The 5 seems to be untouched so far.
3. The GS is 3rd in sales after the E and 5 and Lexus has fully hit its target with the GS.

In comparisons, the GS has beat the 5 and E every time, based on price and in the new Automobile, based on engine size (V-8). There have been no GS 300 vs E/5 comparison tests yet but its gonna be tough, both the E and 5 will have updated V-6s when this battle rolls around.

encore888

The Kelley Blue Book thing with BMW is disingenous, because it is based on 'projected value' of which only in the most recent year has BMW come out slightly ahead. So, no, on the contrary I don't think Lexus doesn't want the customers (you) to read the Kelley Blue Book at all.

gs430jw

"We like fake ***** but they are not better than some nice naturals"

The best quote ever!!! Awsome!!!

LiquidBlue

I remember a post a few months ago in which you stated that a maxed out M would run around 60K, and that it seemed as if by the high price, it would replace the Q as the flagship.. Now, suddenly, it's the M's "low price", that has made it a sales success thus far? I don't think 60k for this class is exactly what one would call a "bargain"..

chiawei

There is a misconception on the resale value.

It really depends on which model of BMW vs Lexus you are talking about. The 5 series actually hold value very well as compared to the GS. While the E46/E65 (due to 2002 disaster roll out of the I-drive and electronic issues) tends to depreciates faster.

Mercedes resale value has gone down quiet a bit and is actually worse than BMW and in some cases Audi.

BMW M models depreciates very slowly even when new one comes out.

As far as dealer service goes. The lexus and mercedes are both quiet good. BMW on the other hand needs professional help.

As far as price goes, if you owned the car over 4 year period, the BMW price is not that bad. Since the maint program also covers brakes and host of others. I did a comparison a while back between my wife's TL and my 530i. My TL actually costed me more to own than the 530i.

Lexus service is not that cheap. You are looking at 5k service for around $100 (in bay area), 15k at around $300, and 30k at $600.

Plus you will probably spend close to $1k on the brakes in 4 years.

Adding up service through out 50k miles 5k, 10k, 20k, 25k, 35k, 40k, 50k=$700 15k/45k=$600
30k $600= $1900 in expense. In addition add another $1k for brakes and other wear items.
You are adding about $3k to the price of GS.

The initial price difference is high, but figuring overall cost through out 4 year period you will find that the price difference is not really that bad. Also, it will also depends on the insurance cost.
I haven't had a lexus since 01. So I won't comment on that. But wife's TL an my sienna costed me more to insure than my E500 (per Wanwanesa).

So pricing issues needs to be carefully reviewed.

In addition, although BMW does not publish incentives. They are currently blowing the E60 (old engine) and E46 out of the door right now. I know that E46 currently has $6,000 incentive (i.e. you can get one for about $5k off invoice on stock cars). I think E60 has $4k incentive.

You just need to take time to find better deal. I also believe that mercedes is also offering around $6k incentives on 05 W211 as well. A loaded E500 can be bought for around $59k easily right now.

flipside909

$1k on brakes in 4 years? That's overinflated as well as the service costs you just listed. Granted you take your vehicle for service outside the dealership and plan to keep it more than 4 years or put a lot of mileage like myself, servicing/maintaining a Lexus isn't as expensive as most people perceive it to be.

longjohn

SpoonSport,
Don't let yourself fall too much in love with the M, based on reading, before you get a chance to see it in person. A lot of people (myself included) don't find the styling very attractive. About the only part I can stomach is the side profile. The rest of the car (from a styling perspective) doesn't do it for me at all. Of course, everyone sees things differently, so you might see it and fall in love.

chiawei

That's how much it cost in SF Bay area. A simple 5k miles service i actually understated as it was close to $140. The toyota dealer charged close to $100 for 5k service, (i just had 20k miles service on the sienna done at fremont toyota about 2 to 3months ago).

You wish this is inflated. But this is how much dealers in silicon valley charges.

I am simply comparing things on equal footing. The BMW are serviced at dealers for free of charge. In order to compare on same footing, you have to compare what Lexus charges to service their vehicles. Everyone can change their own oil, replace their own brakes. But that's not the same as having dealers working on it.

BMW's free maint program is very good for people that keeps their car less than 4 years. I never keep my cars that long, hence the initial price difference is not really there.

However if you are going to put a lot of miles or keep the car past the 4 year period, the lexus becomes cheaper to own. German service are expansive. Oil change alone is already over $100.

BTW, if you have problem with the service cost, then go complain to lexus dealers in the bay area. I did not make up the cost. The cost is simply what it is.