sick21

And I have to say I'd by far rather have an Avalon Limited than an ES.

Mike728

And I much prefer the size of my ES, over the cramped GS. That's why there are choices.

sick21

So true. The backseat of my GS is surprisingly small. It was the F Sport I was wanting though and the IS was too small.

Arty101

I still prefer my ES. That said, there's another member here that claims the Hyundai Genesis is better,

Zman1

No big deal - they switched from the camry to the Avalon chassis in 2013.



http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2...al-appeal.html

Mike728

Glad you're up to speed, now!

ls430lover

just to clairfy again the thread was a baby es getting 30mpg
i am sure your all getting high mileage combined for those looking to get a 2.0 liter turbo es which i i think is a year away the camry xle with the 4 cylinder will return almost 30mpg combined and out the door for 24k
just making sure the tit for tat stays on target not about which is better
the es 350 is a superior automobile the camry is the best value with nav for 24k out the door in the market

Arty101

You can get a baby Camry that gets 38-40 mpg for less than 20k. It's called a Corolla LE Plus that has a great 4 cylinder and is also a superior automobile and a great value. Although right now they're only giving a $500 incentive as opposed to the fantastic $4k incentive for the Camry during the Presidents holiday sale. We're just making sure we're talking vis a vis comparables and not which car is superior

PirelliRC

+1

The ES backseat has acres of spaces, that is definitely one aspect that i am not missing about the GS, it actually has more legroom than a bmw 750i base, not the iL version. And because there is no drive shaft on the hyrbid, a 3rd person can sit in the middle seat without their knees touching their chin.

chromedome

More backseat room than a 5 series iL and a normal wheelbase S class too, although a 7iL and the extended S class have more room at multiple times the price. It's a cheapster's limo

I think the only other car that shares the ES' FWD design with a swoopy, coupe-like roof and decent rear space is the Ford Fusion/Mondeo.

Poppa

I'm not going to speak to which car is better.. that's a personal choice.. but I will speak to the mileage... last month I made a quick little 300 mile weekend round trip.... speed limit was 75 and I probably avg.ed about 78 mph... based on the computer, I got 29.2 mpg on the highway.... as far as "mixed" driving, to and from work I avg. 25.5 mpg. I'll take that..

Poppa

SW17LS

The Avalon chassis is essentially the Camry chassis...it's just stretched. So to say the ES isn't based on the Camry it's based on the Avalon makes no sense. There is a lot of similarity between the Camry and the ES, as there always has been. As there is between the Camry and Avalon.

Buying an XLE Camry does get you a lot of the feel of an ES. no longer gets you the space, the ES is more refined, more prestigious, better warranty. Would I buy a Camry over an ES. No. Would I buy a Camry and extole its virtue if I couldn't buy an ES? Sure.

gemigniani

Normally that would be true. But the 2015 Camry has been significantly refined. It now has the same secure directional stability and steering feel of an ES. Door and window sealing has been brought up to ES standards - so wind noise at highway speeds is absent and the doors close was very nearly the same degree of deep, solid thunk as the ES. Front door panels of even the base Camry LE are now fully padded from the armrest on up, just as on the ES. Simulated wood strips have been added to the dash of even base model Camry LE's. Added welds in the body of the 2015 Camry contribute to a more solid and vibration free ride nearly matching the ES.

The main driving experience differences I have found between the two cars is that the dash/firewall/floorpan of the ES is slightly better insulated against engine and road noise. And the front seats of the ES are a bit softer. Overall, the 2015 Camry no longer has the cheap car look and driving feel of the 2012-14 Camry's. It's quite close to the 2015 ES and is $14,000 cheaper if you get the base LE Camry with ES-like Optitron dash gauges and the 4 cyl engine that has V6-like response and power at low to medium throttle openings.

ls430lover

did the research or from what i read in your post has been involved working with the company with the changes.. after about 3500 miles i give the car an 8.5 from 1-10 the front seat is not great for those use to comfort from an es or ls.. i am starting to get use to it. agreed with everything you said i bought an xle with nav for 23,500
new jbl audio is good , same nav interface, but the new controls which are hughe and back to round discs with good feel are better than the es, simpler more driver oriented for ease of use.
two pieces to show you the level of commitment to the new camry relative to all the things to bring it closer to es specs. i was at a local lexus dealer with the gm showed him my car told him my other choice was buying a 13 es for around 28k i didnt want to go over 400 month so decided against with the gas mileage i wanted to have a car around 30mpg combined with regular unleaded..
when you mentioned the sound deadening it has sipes by the side mirrors which deflect wind noise, no the es does not have them... look at the hood on the xle the new lines formed for wind deflection, then see how they rise above the wipers to deflect the wind.. no the es doesn't have.
they stepped up the game its not a perfect car by any means but it provided me a way to get the ride i was missing the suspension of the accord ex i went to coming out of my ls was to stiff, this struck the perfect balance.. quite remarkable both the es and the camry xle what they have done with a fwd car,
safe driving to all

Mike728

The Avalon has always used a stretched Camry chassis. The ES, prior to 2013, used the un-stretched Camry chassis. Does it make sense, now? I'm sure you're just arguing for the sake of arguing, as I have no doubt you already knew this. Come on, tell us again how much you love the interior quality of the 2013+ ES.