bunka

The Lexus Touch screen doesn't work the way a "standard" touch screen on a PC would. In that I mean that trying to "move the cursor" via touching the screen and dragging simply doesn't work very well on the Lex. I do have the older system. As I undersand it, the new system is "more crisp" and may be a little quicker form screen to screen. IMHO, the crippling techniques of disabling the interface while in motion is significantly detrimental. The secondary problem is related to the poor search functions.

BobBass

The NAV systems in my '02 STS and '04 Maxima disable most functions while the vehicle is in motion. I always assumed it was the car manufacturer doing a "CYA" in case a vehicle was involved in an accident due to driver distraction.

To tell you the truth, I am surprised that Honda doesn't do the same. Consider yoursefl lucky because I agree - it is a drag to stop the vehicle to access the NAV.

About all you can do on the Maxima is to cancel the guidance or "change priorities" (toggle from shorter distance to shorter time) preference.

<VENOM>

When I was looking for a new car I drove the TL and Maxima, the TL has a great Nav system but honestly it's overpriced for what it offers, I could lease a loaded 550i for what Acura wanted, still can but I ended up with a loaded Maxima but my old man picked up a UL ES350 and compared to his ES300 this car is in a different class, just the size and features has taken this car into Mercedes E350 and BMW 530i competition even with the Germans being RWD, even RL.

bobbyg123

Not to split hairs with your point, but I don't think this is always the case. I wouldn't want any of the low to mid range Mercedes Benz. They're bland, unreliable, and grossly overpriced. The same can be said for Jags as well. Honestly, I drive a 2005 Infiniti G35 and there's no way I would trade it in for the previous ES330 model. I love the new ES350 (which is why I'm here), but the 330 would have ranked behind the G35 and the TL in my personal opinion. The 330 has numb steering, poor handling, below average acceleration, and a wonderful interior. For my money, that's not getting what I would have paid for.

<VENOM>

The low end MB/BMW are not my cup of tea but you sure do see lots of them on the road, at least I do

Rockville

and was decent for its time. The new high resolution Gen. 5 Lexus nav just smokes the Acura TL's in clarity, graphics and brightness. You should go see it yourself and you'll want one too. The new Gen. 5 has a quick search by saying "nearest (pick your POI)" then it will show the closest one on the screen. You can ask for "showlist" if you want more selections. If you get the the fully loaded Ultra package it will play a DVD movie on this VGA screen with 5.1 surround sound in the Mark Levinson. The Bluetooth section is all new and has voice commands for 20 numbers, dial by number by repeating the number and 1000 number phone memory. You can pair up to 6 phones. The instruments on the ES350 are 3D and bright white against a black background and have a high tech precision. The Acura is less expensive due to its decontent in materials. The leather, the wood, the plastic etc. is inferior to the Lexus. Its only saving grace is that it performs and handles very well. The ES350 is more about luxury and quiet. The windshield has a low durometer plastic layer that reduces the noise transmitted through the glass by two thirds at conversational frequencies. It has a 3 foot better turning circle which does make a difference when maneuvering. The very refined ES350 lives in an area between the RL and the TL.

On the subject of horsepower the SAE accepted method of testing horsepower with the normal accessory loads of the power steering, air conditoning and alternator have lowered the ratings. The ES350 is rated at 272 HP with its accessories included under the newer rating system. It has dual exhausts and scoots to 60 in 6.8 seconds without torque pull....

Rock

chinaman38

I'm saying you cant compare the 2 since the ES350 is on a newer platform than the TL is. I'm sure when the TL came out back in 2004 the reviews were better than the ES. Wait until 2009 when thte new TL comes out, I"m sure you will be surprised on what new features it comes with. I never said that the TL was better. Coming from a family of TL's and ES I love them both. For a basic TL and a basic ES the TL comes with more options. I'd be damned if I paid 40+K for a fully loaded ES. just not worth it.

Rockville

but the rules have changed and the TL isn't in the same class as the ES350 no matter how many gadgets you add to it. Plastic instead of Walnut. Shiny silver plastic. The lighting is crass. The large 8" nav screen has stick figure graphics. The Lexus backup camera and sonar parking assist are flagship quality. Acura doesn't make a car as refined as the ES350 even if you step up to the RL. The RL has excellent handling and AWD but not the luxury of the ES350. The Lexus has a better history of reliability and retention of value. The new powertrain on the ES350 should be more than most people need. In fact if it were any faster the suspension would not be up to the task of containing it. It's a luxury sedan and it pampers you. The Acura wants to be a sport sedan but is somewhat of a poseur in that segment. Its appeal is mostly based on price.

Rock

<VENOM>

The TL and ES are the same category, 1 will always outshine the other but that's how the cookie crumbles, lots of cars are compared that are not direct competitors so what

Rockville

monikers will need some revision now that the ES350 has come to market. The FWD aspect eliminates the Europeans from the discussion of a similar car. You can use price points as a comparo and you won't find much similarity either. Lexus used the Acura TL, Cadillac CTS 3.6 V6 and the Mercedes C350 for its launch comparisons. I guess the Acura comes the closest in configuration and theme but it is not the same type of driving experience. The ES350 is full on luxury that coddles the senses. It has a cockpit second to none under $50,000 or possibly more with its aniline leather and Walnut paneling.... It is stress reducing quiet inside so you can think without interference....Go for the Mark Levinson and you have a surround sound home theater on wheels. 10 airbags shield you from harm. The HID's swing their gaze back and forth through the dark night. It should be called "Excessive Luxury".

Rock

bunka

I agree that the new ES350 is a nice configuration but it's not really THAT much better than the TL. The cabin is nicer and it's getting closer to the Mercedes so that is a step up but the TL's stereo is every bit as good as the ES. The Xenon headlights have been standard on the TL for over 3 years. The price is also another $5K higher so it SHOULD have these advantages. IMHO the C-series from Merc isn't really the direct competitor to the TL or the ES. Rather, the E-series is more in alignment. The TL is $35K, the ES is $40K, the E-class is $48K. The ES fits in the gap between the TL and the E-class and IMHO they did a good job of price positioning it.

As for the New NAVI - I think you are missing my CORE point. The FUNCTIONALITY of the Lexus NAVI is a PIG! By adding better graphics and bigger processor, you are simply putting that pig in a nice dress, makeup and a pretty hairdo. But (news flash), it's STILL got poor functionality and therefore it's still a pig in a pretty dress IMHO

jeffofla

Actually the E-350 for Mercedes starts at $50k, but fully loaded to match the ES with features, it runs $68k MSRP. So it's quite a bit more. Two things you can get with Mercedes that you can't with the ES are bi-Xenon headlights and the indicators on the mirrors. But their is no Bluetooth on the E350 for Mercedes and you have to use a proprietary phone and connection. I suspect that will be addressed in the 2007 model. I almost bought the merceds. But I'm happy with my car and after taxes I saved more than $20,000.

wanderer99

Rock, that is the coolest description I've read yet on the ES. Excessive Luxury - I like that. You could almost use that description in a Lexus commercial.

The TL is a nice car, but its more Entry Level Sports-Luxury, with not a whole lot going on in the Luxury department. Given Rock's description above, I don't see how the TL compares to that at all.

The TL weighs much more on the Sports side. If anything, the TL should probably be compared more with the IS and Infiniti G35. I wonder who would win that comparison?

I'm glad my new ES is coming later next week

LexFather

I think the TL does nothing great but everything good. Acura sold 8k of these old puppies last month. Its the best selling entry level luxo sedan. It sells to people who want "value" and who want to "look" sporty but also want to "look" luxurious, while it provide a little of both, not a lot.
Its not sporty, b/c in comparos, it gets spanked everytime by true RWD competiton. Its not luxury b/c its made in America and uses fake wood and some horrible leather and not in entry luxury comparos.

However, people LIKE that, its a great BLEND and it is a good looking car, IMO, its aged well.

Its hard to argue, with 70k being sold every year. Clearly, CONSUMERS, love this car.

As for HIDs, the TL has offered them standard since 1999, with the 2nd gen. Of they were getting stolen left and right, b/c Hondas cost cutting made them easy to swap out with Hondas and with basically one bolt holding the whole bumper down, thieves could steal in 10 seconds.

This was even published in Car and Driver and on the news.

The 3rd gen doesn't have this problem but never has a TL had auto leveling headlights or now the AFS, adaptive units, b/c of cost. Its just a bulb, like an aftermarket kit.

Rockville

Navigation you might underestimate the quantum leap it has made. If you like Nav you will want one. The Mark Levinson with 300 Watts of Surround Sound further enhances the experience. Those that already have the GS and IS versions know what I mean. This will be the final touch that will make the '07 GS350 the first AWD home theater with 306 HP. Acura Nav was better before these new generations showed up at Lexus. I like Acuras in general and they offer good value but they don't measure up in refinement to the new ES350. They literally reek of plastic. Acura has been in retrograde since the Legend was jettisoned in an attempt to follow the other lux brands. They offer reliable and somewhat sporty models but do not use the expensive interior materials that create separation between the ES350 and its Acura counterparts at this time. So many features on the ES350 are "not available" on the TL so how can you compare them fairly?

Rock