wmalik81

Hello everyone,

Have a 2002 Lexus ES300 3.0 V6 which had a CEL and a Oil Pan + Oil Pressure Light come on.

Pressure light would flash intermittently and CEL would come and go from time to time.

Took it to autoparts store --> had scan done was given the following codes:

P0304 - misfire 4
P0306 - misfire 6
P2238 - Sensor Bank 1 Short Circuit

Went by the mechanic to get repair based on codes I had identified.. Was rescanned and different code was given

P0012 - Bank 1 OCV Valve
P022 - Bank 2 OCV Valve (pending, was later eliminated and never returned upon rescans)

Quote was 140$ + 100$ labour. Was able to purchase part for much cheaper online. Opted that route, same conditions the entire time.

Noticed heavy oil leakage past two days or so, did not have any time to pursue and solve the matter so kept driving to very minimum.

Today on a very short trip (less then half a mile), oil pressure light came on and stayed on. CEL and Oil Light came on and there was a sputter, revs dropped and etc. Turned off car immediately and topped up oil as I knew damage could potentially occur by driving with low oil Car would not turn over at this point and had to be pushed home.

Battery died along the way so recharged and tried starting one more time after adding in more than enough oil. Still no result. it seems as if the engine does not seem to want to turn over and start up, does repetitive sounds of the starter. No knocking or clunking noises observed and no smoke was ever visible.

Also upon further inspection, had my oil change done at Mr Lube approx 4k ago. Oil filter cap was loose and had oil dripping all over, tightened that and then added a little more oil, still no avail.

Worst scenario is that engine has seized up. looking for advice.

Have been instructed to do full oil change and then proceed from here.

Oro

If it were me, I'd do this.

1) Get a dependable battery (aka "known good" battery) so the car will start. Borrow one, whatever.

2) Get an oil pressure test gauge (can borrow free at most auto stores - e.g., loaner tool program)

Verify you have adequate oil pressure. This could have been the cause of the prior errors and not the OCVs at all. Eric the Car guy has a good video on checking oil pressure with a gauge, this is easy and tons of DIYs out there.

Oil pressure could have failed from sludged engine, blocked pick up (happens on other engines, not sure how common on the 1mz-fe), etc. I'm not saying this is the most likely, just an example of cause/effect. And treatable.

Getting a known god battery and verifying oil pressure is setting a "baseline" that things are as they should be before throwing more money at other parts (which is what too many mechanics, home and professional, do).

KLF

You can't check the oil pressure if the engine won't run.

I would put a wrench on the crank, see if you can turn it by hand. If not, get out your checkbook.

HomerJay

If I understand the sequence of events you had the oil changed 4K miles ago and you never opened the hood or checked the oil since, When you finally checked the oil level how low was it? Unfortunately, I think you may have caused severe engine damage driving with little to no oil. You have learned a very expensive lesson when it comes your engine and checking the oil.

ES300NZ

To me, it sounds like the car has a blocked oil pick up, which is causing the oil code. BUT, if that's not the case and the engine still turns over with no nasty noises it might just be that:

Issue with sensor causing engine idle to 'fall' causing lights to come on.
Failed sensor and poor OCV Valve installation (odd workman ship) lead to oil leakage as camshaft seal is now wreaked ?

Look, if the engine still turn over and theres no 'grinding' noises there's still hope.

HomerJay

ES300NZ- I know this off topic but Good Luck against Australia.

ES300NZ

yeah everyone wants to win cos the Australians' are kinda loud mouth's and have alot to say on the pitch, (it's called sledging) but NZ'er's are like that silent guy drinking the corner of the bar, we'll take em to the pitch and show them what's up.

Actually, that's a sort of general cultural difference between the Australian's and NZ'ers, we're all reserved and quiet, and they're all .. making nick names for everything that end in 'ie' or 'y', like Barbie (BBQ) and cozzy (female swim suit), budgie smuggler (male swim suit) and ed-u-ma-ca-tiony (what you do until 10yrs old).

They're great neighbours though, they stick to their side of the 'ditch' and and we can rely on them to be butt of jokes like this one.

wmalik81

Thank you all for your replies:

@Oro - Have heard about oil pressure being affected by engine sludge, however can't get the engine to fire up and cannot verify

@KLF - engine still cranks and seems like it wants to turn on, maybe theres still hope?

@Homerjay - sorry I'm Canadian haha, 4000kms ago maybe 2.5k miles. Oil level essentially was bone dry when I checked after the initial incident, put in 4.5 quarts and tried again. No avail. Definitely have learned my lesson but all hope isn't lost as of yet. Please see below.

@ES300 - one of my buddies had a similar hypothesis about how sludge has blocked the OCV valve and is causing it to disfunction. However, OCV valve was never replaced, only have the code for Bank 1 as it is right now. However, the engine still cranks and turns over but just won't fire.

Okay so spent the past day or so evaluating and also tried the following.

Did oil change on car, initial start almost fired and sputtered out.
Upon re-attempt only cranked and turned over but did not fire.

Charged battery, reattempted start, got the revs to rise but car sputtered out for unknown cause.

So far, I'm leaning towards stating the engine has not seized because of the ability to still crank and turn the motor NO clunking, grinding, metal on metal, clashing or anything. Also no metal shavings when I drained the oil. ---> it just won't fire and it may have to do with the oil pressure and sludge.

Any advice on how to proceed from here? Just looking for some reassurance on whether engine has seized or not, in my honest opinion does not seem like the case, seems like maybe a compression issue or something else, the cranking for sure gives me hope. Any thoughts?

Oro

If the OCVs (or one) are not in time/functioning, the car won't start and will just splutter as you described.

At this point, sludge would not keep it from starting. Basic rule of shade tree mechanics: fuel+ spark + compression = start.

OCV issue means no effective compression (you have physical compression, but not effective since it is not happening in time with the spark. Since you had a code here, it is worth looking into that. There is a great thread here on dx'ing OCVs with stuff from the FSM. I will try to find it for you. It is a monster-length thread and the really good info isn't until the middle.

Edit: this is not the thread I meant, but here's some info to give you and idea of what it all looks like there:

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/rx-...ement-diy.html

If you want to see if you have oil pressure, just pull an OCV oil line and crank. Should squirt oil out in a strong stream (catch it or it will make a mess). Easy shade tree test on these engines. You don't need a car running to see what the oil pressure is - cranking it a bit should give a reading. It is a mechanical process, not dependent upon a computer/voltage/etc.

There are filters in-line behind the OCV oil inlets, see if they are clogged. if you take off the air intake, both the OCV bits are readily accessible with some contorting.

You can pull out the OCVs, put 12v across their terminals on the bench and see if they open/close; basic function test.

You can think about if you have a skipped timing belt, which will cause this problem on starting. I didn't see a mention (or missed it) of total mileage and if/when belt was last done?

These engines are not known to consume oil, so where yours went is a question that needs resolved in general. OTOH, engines can be driven dry and if shut down in time and warnings not ignored, no harm is done. No reason to fear the worst, yet.

ES300NZ

Two things
a seized engine will not turn over, at all.
fuel+ spark + compression = start., also Air + Fuel = Run.


You can add fuel by squirting starter fluid (its in a car) past the AFM (avoid the sensor), while someone cranks it for you. If wont fire it's probably either compression or spark.

can test spark you can remove the coil (leaving wiring in place), and a spark plug, ground the spark plug against the head and turn the motor over. If there is spark you will see it (best if less light/dark). Watch were you hold that arrangement it can deliver a nasty shock.

tests for OCVs are above. personally I would take a shot (gamble?) on the car and replace them both when you can

You can test compression by removing a spark plug (or all one by one), and turning motor over. You will hear the compression, you can put your hand over it and tell the strenght of the compression by how much it pushes on you hand. It's safe to do that. If you own a compression testing tool that would be a good time to use it. ($50 - 100 new)

Sludge, will not stop and engine firing. Neither will no oil. There's video's on youtube to prove that and several of my wife's old cars proved that too. This is probably not an oil alone issue.

A 1mz-fe will run (oddly) just fine having skipped one or two teeth on the cam's and one on the main crank. I know, that's exactly what my 1999 was like prior to me doing the cam belt after we bought it. But that's a non vvti engine.

wmalik81

Just got a call back from the mechanic,

started off by stating that he had bad news for me, continued to state that there is no compression in the engine. However yesterday when I went to the actual shop he managed to get the car started for approximately 10 seconds before it died out, at that moment he was confident it was just the OCV valve and quoted me 160$ for the part + 50$ labour. Today he says motor is no good. Went on to say that it is cheaper to replace the motor instead of rebuild (see below)

Advice on how to proceed from here? Friend of mine thinks he is trying to scam in some way as he could have done a compression test the initial day and come to that conclusion instead of sitting with the car for a night. may have also realized he can convince me to replace, repair old motor and sell for profit once I am gone.

Heres the breakdown

70 KM Engine Replacement + OCV Valve = 2210$

~ 170 KM Engine Replacement + OCV Valve = 1860$

However, rebuild cost is 3500-4000$ which seems absolutely ridiculous to me,

definitely gonna get a second opinion, but seems very very sudden to me.

lsiberian

IMO It's time to sell it. Get a carmax offer and then see if the mechanic will beat it.

You can buy another Lexus ES 300 with 130k miles for around 6k in Wisconsin. Then you can start checking your fluids every week. I saw several on CL in you area just be sure to check the seams and get an inspection from a good mechanic.

fastnoypi

I think the tech is pulling your leg. Dorman OCV replacements are cheap and easy to replace.
If the VVT is in the wrong position, your valve timing will be all off and cause a poor compression reading.

wmalik81

@lsiberian - not actually from Wisconsin, actually Ontario, Canada. however thank you for your suggestion, however see below for new details. thanks.

@fastnoypi - friend of mine thinks he's being shady as well. gonna head over there soon and take a look myself if the motor is no good. mechanic went ahead to state that the car builds compression and takes very long to eventually start off. sorry if I didn't mention this earlier. He then stated that he changed the OCV valve with an original toyota one (160$) and still couldn't get the car to start --> bence he concluded that the motor is no good. so the valve has been replaced.

interestingly enough, found a motor with 50 KMS on it for 900$ from a JDM engine supplier, says he know a mechanic who can do the work for 700$ flat, so 1600$ total cash, or 1800$ if I want a receipt with detail of the work done (preferred in the case of resale)

fastnoypi

@wmalik. sounds like the mechanic didnt bother to change or clean out the screens for a failed OCV. The OCV cannot control anything if there is a lack of oil flow. Limp and/or tow your car away from that hack.

If you have a 10mm socket and needle nose pliers, you can swap them out and clean the screens yourself.
RockAuto has the Dorman replacements for close to $37 each. aka variable timing solenoids.