New ES or used GS
01-03-13, 07:14 AM
#17
Lexus Fanatic
I'm probably going to get blown off the board for this...but my buddy's 2011 Honda Accord has better interior materials than the new ES IMHO. Obviously the wood trim and nu-luxe dash are better in the Lexus (since the wood is obviously fake in the Accord), as is the switchgear and displays, but the door panels, lower dash, dare I say even the quality of the leather is better in the Accord. To me thats just inexcusable.
If you like the ride and drive of the GS, but like the price point of the ES you might want to look at a Hyundai Genesis. For $44k MSRP you can get a loaded Genesis with the V8, RWD. There are stupid deals on them too...you can get a loaded one for like $37k.
If you like the ride and drive of the GS, but like the price point of the ES you might want to look at a Hyundai Genesis. For $44k MSRP you can get a loaded Genesis with the V8, RWD. There are stupid deals on them too...you can get a loaded one for like $37k.
Last edited by SW17LS; 01-03-13 at 07:17 AM.
01-03-13, 02:44 PM
#18
Lexus Champion
Mike, have you considered a top of the line V6 new Accord or Camry? Both cars offer a lot at a resonable price point.
01-03-13, 02:54 PM
#19
Lexus Fanatic
I don't know that I'd look at the Camry, but I would definitely consider the new Accord. How about a new Avalon?
01-03-13, 02:59 PM
#20
Lexus Champion
01-03-13, 03:12 PM
#21
Yeah,I find the Camry to be one ugly vehicle.
The new Accord is really nice in and out with a lot of nice options and standard items.
The LED headlights in the Touring model and the on NAV screen blind spot pic camera are two that come to mind quickly..
01-03-13, 05:43 PM
#23
I'm probably going to get blown off the board for this...but my buddy's 2011 Honda Accord has better interior materials than the new ES IMHO. Obviously the wood trim and nu-luxe dash are better in the Lexus (since the wood is obviously fake in the Accord), as is the switchgear and displays, but the door panels, lower dash, dare I say even the quality of the leather is better in the Accord. To me thats just inexcusable.
If you like the ride and drive of the GS, but like the price point of the ES you might want to look at a Hyundai Genesis. For $44k MSRP you can get a loaded Genesis with the V8, RWD. There are stupid deals on them too...you can get a loaded one for like $37k.
If you like the ride and drive of the GS, but like the price point of the ES you might want to look at a Hyundai Genesis. For $44k MSRP you can get a loaded Genesis with the V8, RWD. There are stupid deals on them too...you can get a loaded one for like $37k.
I have also owned 3 Accords over the year and just helped my mother-in-law buy a 2011. The engine is much louder in the Honda it just dosn't feel as smooth. I also think the dash is horribly ugly. That being said, I have owned 3 Accords over the years and they are great cars... but they just don't have that sex appeal that the ES 350 has.
01-03-13, 05:45 PM
#24
01-03-13, 06:11 PM
#25
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And at this point in my life , both my wife and I want some luxury. I still like the spirited driving from time to time, so I will look at the GS very close. And as some have said, even a used LS
The ES gives us the room we want in the back and in the trunk. When we both compared the Lexus ES to the Acura TL the Lexus won easily. Not that the Acura was a bad car, but the Lexus said luxury
The ES gives us the room we want in the back and in the trunk. When we both compared the Lexus ES to the Acura TL the Lexus won easily. Not that the Acura was a bad car, but the Lexus said luxury
01-03-13, 07:10 PM
#26
And at this point in my life , both my wife and I want some luxury. I still like the spirited driving from time to time, so I will look at the GS very close. And as some have said, even a used LS
The ES gives us the room we want in the back and in the trunk. When we both compared the Lexus ES to the Acura TL the Lexus won easily. Not that the Acura was a bad car, but the Lexus said luxury
The ES gives us the room we want in the back and in the trunk. When we both compared the Lexus ES to the Acura TL the Lexus won easily. Not that the Acura was a bad car, but the Lexus said luxury
01-03-13, 08:17 PM
#27
Lexus Fanatic
I just sold my 2012 Camry for the ES 350 and they don't compare. Yes the engines are similar, but that's about it. My wife hated driving the camry and loves the ES 350.
I have also owned 3 Accords over the year and just helped my mother-in-law buy a 2011. The engine is much louder in the Honda it just dosn't feel as smooth. I also think the dash is horribly ugly. That being said, I have owned 3 Accords over the years and they are great cars... but they just don't have that sex appeal that the ES 350 has.
I have also owned 3 Accords over the year and just helped my mother-in-law buy a 2011. The engine is much louder in the Honda it just dosn't feel as smooth. I also think the dash is horribly ugly. That being said, I have owned 3 Accords over the years and they are great cars... but they just don't have that sex appeal that the ES 350 has.
I agree with you on all counts, the ES rides and drives much nicer, certainly sexier and more prestigious, the only point I made was about interior material quality. Its taken a significant step backwards with the 2013. To me, thats a big part of driving a luxury automobile. I like nice things, Apple computers, nice clothing with a nice feel, nice leather goods, well built furniture. I want my car to be a "nice thing" as well. What I have always liked about Lexus is that they don't just rest on their laurels like some of their competition does, the interiors are well designed with excellent materials that look and feel well made. I just don't get that impression when I sit in a 2013 ES, which makes me mad quite frankly.
Its a great car, but this is the first Lexus that I feel like Lexus is expecting the beauty of its design on the surface and the fact that "its a Lexus" trump the need to make it actually a beautifully built automobile.
Originally Posted by Mike218
And at this point in my life , both my wife and I want some luxury.
The ES gives us the room we want in the back and in the trunk
The two drive differently too, you should drive them back to back. The GS is more solid, feels heavier and more substantial. The ES however is more softly sprung. I would say the ES has a more traditional boaty american car ride. I really love the way the GS drives.
The GS reminds me a lot of the LS oddly enough, the solidity and the way it glides down the road. Around town though the LS is more softly sprung.
01-03-13, 08:25 PM
#28
I agree with you on all counts, the ES rides and drives much nicer, certainly sexier and more prestigious, the only point I made was about interior material quality. Its taken a significant step backwards with the 2013. To me, thats a big part of driving a luxury automobile. I like nice things, Apple computers, nice clothing with a nice feel, nice leather goods, well built furniture. I want my car to be a "nice thing" as well. What I have always liked about Lexus is that they don't just rest on their laurels like some of their competition does, the interiors are well designed with excellent materials that look and feel well made. I just don't get that impression when I sit in a 2013 ES, which makes me mad quite frankly.
01-03-13, 08:35 PM
#29
Lexus Fanatic
I like the remote touch controller a lot, I have it in the GS. My experience comes from having had two previous ES's of two previous generations, in fact I drove my old 2003 ES tonight. That car doesn't have a piece of hard plastic anywhere. Everything is soft touch, or nice metallic plastic for the switchgear, etc. Leather is excellent quality, and triple stitched. The next generation (which I also had, a 2010) saw declines in leather quality with a coarser, thinner leather being used that was only double stitched, thinner carpeting, hard touch plastics on the lower dash. Lower rent looking gauge cluster. In fact, I skipped the black interior on my 2010 because I felt the parchment made the interior look richer and hid some of the low end plastics.
The 2013 add the door panels to the list of places with hard plastic, and most inexcusably the cups around the door interior door handles where your fingernails hit every time you go to open the door, leather is even coarser to where quite frankly I felt the NuLuxe felt nicer. The plastic around the start/stop button is hard, as is the dash plastic around the climate controls and console top. You no longer have woodgrain on the console top. Then you have decontenting such as no more adaptive lighting, etc. Instead of being satisfied to hide the cheap plastic away where the driver and occupants don't touch, now its right out there when you don't see that on even non-luxury vehicles. My Jeep for instance has better materials in places where you touch.
On the exterior, you loose the chrome trim (which is a taste thing), but then trimwise you have cheap flimsy black plastic trim at the rear of the bumper, you have cheap clip on faux chrome tailpipe tips where my 2010 had beautiful welded fully rolled tips.
I think the 2013 interior looks better than the 2010 I had's, but once I really spent some time with the car and started exploring that interior with my hands...cheapness is just everywhere which doesn't work for me...so I moved up to the GS...which has all the quality I was looking for...albeit obviously at a higher cost.
My point was...you used to get that quality in the ES...but you don't anymore. I'm not trying to deride the ES, its a great car and I drove them happily for many years and hundreds of thousands of miles, I'm just really frustrated with the direction Lexus took with the car.
The 2013 add the door panels to the list of places with hard plastic, and most inexcusably the cups around the door interior door handles where your fingernails hit every time you go to open the door, leather is even coarser to where quite frankly I felt the NuLuxe felt nicer. The plastic around the start/stop button is hard, as is the dash plastic around the climate controls and console top. You no longer have woodgrain on the console top. Then you have decontenting such as no more adaptive lighting, etc. Instead of being satisfied to hide the cheap plastic away where the driver and occupants don't touch, now its right out there when you don't see that on even non-luxury vehicles. My Jeep for instance has better materials in places where you touch.
On the exterior, you loose the chrome trim (which is a taste thing), but then trimwise you have cheap flimsy black plastic trim at the rear of the bumper, you have cheap clip on faux chrome tailpipe tips where my 2010 had beautiful welded fully rolled tips.
I think the 2013 interior looks better than the 2010 I had's, but once I really spent some time with the car and started exploring that interior with my hands...cheapness is just everywhere which doesn't work for me...so I moved up to the GS...which has all the quality I was looking for...albeit obviously at a higher cost.
My point was...you used to get that quality in the ES...but you don't anymore. I'm not trying to deride the ES, its a great car and I drove them happily for many years and hundreds of thousands of miles, I'm just really frustrated with the direction Lexus took with the car.
Last edited by SW17LS; 01-03-13 at 08:46 PM.