Mark Levinson Audio?
06-17-13, 12:47 PM
#468
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New owners ML feedback
Just picked up my new ride 300h and very happy with the car however the only complaint would be the ML stereo as others have indicated. It is very clear and crisp for Highs and mids but the bass is flat and distorted when listening to punchy music (top 40, r&b, etc). Coming from an 2006 acura tl the sounds are not as deep and full as the stereo in the Tl. I feel the reason why some may dispute this quality of this stereo is that it is very clear unless it is louder on sounds with more bass. I'd even say that I'm hearing high tones that were not present in many other systems so there are some positives. Phil Collins,John mayer, Ben Harper, and sting all sound amazing.
I'd compare it to a bose home theater system, they sound great for movies (voice and details) but for music they lack the fullness compared to other systems. I will be in touch with lexus Canada as it should deliver more that what it offers. When any high end audio product makes a "flapping"noise something is not right.
I'd compare it to a bose home theater system, they sound great for movies (voice and details) but for music they lack the fullness compared to other systems. I will be in touch with lexus Canada as it should deliver more that what it offers. When any high end audio product makes a "flapping"noise something is not right.
06-18-13, 12:52 PM
#469
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to all! brand new amp installed, currently titled experimental.
Just picked up my ES350. Had a meeting with the head engineer from Mark Levinson who was in charge of re programing the amp for this fix. He had his laptop plugged into the amp and ready to make any changes based on my comments.
here is my review. WOW! What a difference!!!! Seriously.
for example, the song. Started from the bottom by Drake. that ***** hits!!!! even at max Bass and Max volume the rear sub does not distort at all!!!
The only issue now is vibration. Everything vibrates at the high end volume like 55 or 60, with high Bass. but its really hard to hear the vibration so don't worry too much about it. The representative from Lexus told me now the amp will get reviewed in Torrance and all necessary anti vibration gear will be issued for the new cars in Japan, and in the future door panels and things with new upgraded anti vibration gear can be installed at the dealer for all of us who already have the car.
so all in all, I am very very happy! I am giving it a week to give my all ok to corporate. but so far so good.
The amp is still not available to the public so I have been told. The reason I got it is because of my lemon law case and persistence. give it a week or two.
I recommend you all take advantage of this new amp! you will be pleasantly surprised. Night and Day, seriously.
Glad that battle is over with.
I did ask why this wasn't done in the first place. answer, time, and schedule.
Will there be a long term fix involving a larger diameter subwoofer? "We are looking into that as a possibility for model 14 or 15, i.e. 2014, 2015.
Just picked up my ES350. Had a meeting with the head engineer from Mark Levinson who was in charge of re programing the amp for this fix. He had his laptop plugged into the amp and ready to make any changes based on my comments.
here is my review. WOW! What a difference!!!! Seriously.
for example, the song. Started from the bottom by Drake. that ***** hits!!!! even at max Bass and Max volume the rear sub does not distort at all!!!
The only issue now is vibration. Everything vibrates at the high end volume like 55 or 60, with high Bass. but its really hard to hear the vibration so don't worry too much about it. The representative from Lexus told me now the amp will get reviewed in Torrance and all necessary anti vibration gear will be issued for the new cars in Japan, and in the future door panels and things with new upgraded anti vibration gear can be installed at the dealer for all of us who already have the car.
so all in all, I am very very happy! I am giving it a week to give my all ok to corporate. but so far so good.
The amp is still not available to the public so I have been told. The reason I got it is because of my lemon law case and persistence. give it a week or two.
I recommend you all take advantage of this new amp! you will be pleasantly surprised. Night and Day, seriously.
Glad that battle is over with.
I did ask why this wasn't done in the first place. answer, time, and schedule.
Will there be a long term fix involving a larger diameter subwoofer? "We are looking into that as a possibility for model 14 or 15, i.e. 2014, 2015.
06-18-13, 03:20 PM
#471
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I'm glad too, and I know you all will be as well. I am 99% sure this amp is the same one that will go in the ES300h, so your distortion will be resolved as well.
The car has plenty of bass now, possibly to much for most. more that the base ES350 for sure.
your pants will get pushed up against your legs now from all the air that is being pushed out of those door woofers, and the thing is you can't really tell where the bass is coming from. The engineers did a pretty good job at blending the bass through the car.
The side mirrors do vibrate alot, and the rear view mirror vibrates alot, but this is expected given the increase in bass.
The engineer told me they improved the efficiency of the sysytem, I.e. it requires less power to re create the same tone as before. they also increased the loudness by 3db, wich is alot.
Anyways, there will for sure be one forum user here that will not be 100% happy, I would like to konw what their beef is now because personally, its performance now matches its value in my opinion which is what we all wanted.
The car has plenty of bass now, possibly to much for most. more that the base ES350 for sure.
your pants will get pushed up against your legs now from all the air that is being pushed out of those door woofers, and the thing is you can't really tell where the bass is coming from. The engineers did a pretty good job at blending the bass through the car.
The side mirrors do vibrate alot, and the rear view mirror vibrates alot, but this is expected given the increase in bass.
The engineer told me they improved the efficiency of the sysytem, I.e. it requires less power to re create the same tone as before. they also increased the loudness by 3db, wich is alot.
Anyways, there will for sure be one forum user here that will not be 100% happy, I would like to konw what their beef is now because personally, its performance now matches its value in my opinion which is what we all wanted.
06-19-13, 06:51 PM
#474
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Sorry I have been away taking care of family matters.
I have drafted the letter that we can all send to the heads of Lexus/ML.
I will post it this weekend for review and comments.
It is great news that they found a fix! However, it is not a real until we all receive the fix and are happy with the solution.
I have drafted the letter that we can all send to the heads of Lexus/ML.
I will post it this weekend for review and comments.
It is great news that they found a fix! However, it is not a real until we all receive the fix and are happy with the solution.
06-20-13, 11:11 AM
#475
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Yes!!
Congratulations Robdog! I am very excited now, I hope I get news on the fix. Is it okay to tell my dealer about this to maybe hurry up their process? I call them every week and they give me the same old " it's up to lexus now , we submitted the product report and we cannot do anything about it. They did tell me that one of their customers for the ES kept complaining about rattling and vibrations in the back and in the door panel and they flew out ML representatives to troubleshoot.
06-20-13, 08:41 PM
#476
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Current Lexus Customer Service Feedback to this Issue
From my last update, my previous call/claim was lost and the process with Lexus Customer Service @ 800-25L-EXUS started anew.
This time the results were different even though I was talking to the same CSM.
I was told that when they discussed this with engineers available to the CSM that there was a known issue with the fin and wiring harness effecting a small amount of vehicles. I did explain that I could understand how that might be a source for broadcast based sources, but local CD sources seemed far fetched. I did not get agreement but I was told that by the end of summer a resolution would be made available.
Discussion of some sort of service credit due to the >6 months of "tolerating" the defect was mentioned. I politely declined to discuss this further - make a decision as I wanted to talk to the dealership.
After discussing this with my dealer's service manager it was mentioned again that this is being built for the 2014 and that these parts would then be made available for 2013s with the issue.
So the news of the "expermental amp" hasn't reached the ears of the CSM responsible for Chicagoland yet...
Read the next post, this could have finally turned a corner.
Cheers
This time the results were different even though I was talking to the same CSM.
I was told that when they discussed this with engineers available to the CSM that there was a known issue with the fin and wiring harness effecting a small amount of vehicles. I did explain that I could understand how that might be a source for broadcast based sources, but local CD sources seemed far fetched. I did not get agreement but I was told that by the end of summer a resolution would be made available.
Discussion of some sort of service credit due to the >6 months of "tolerating" the defect was mentioned. I politely declined to discuss this further - make a decision as I wanted to talk to the dealership.
After discussing this with my dealer's service manager it was mentioned again that this is being built for the 2014 and that these parts would then be made available for 2013s with the issue.
So the news of the "expermental amp" hasn't reached the ears of the CSM responsible for Chicagoland yet...
Read the next post, this could have finally turned a corner.
Cheers
Last edited by calm; 06-20-13 at 08:59 PM. Reason: Spelling
06-20-13, 08:53 PM
#477
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If given the choice, would you trade the car for a new sample or wait for 2014?
In discussing this issue with the dealer, it was mentioned that there might be an opportunity to trade the vehicle (in my case leased) to get another car.
Options discussed were:
If this was the deal you were being presented with, would you go for it and test the heck out of it before signing, play it safe with a non ML, or wait for a fix if it really was only 2-3 months away at this point?
Cheers
Options discussed were:
- get a nearly identical 2013 UL packaged ES300h; nearly as I am not after a specific external color. We would test the audio to see if the defect manifested. Service has not mentioned if they know this defect can be traced to build date or serial number.
- get a almost identical 2013 packaged ES300h without the Mark Levinson but with the highest non UL package with the UL package oriented safety features I was after in the first place.
If this was the deal you were being presented with, would you go for it and test the heck out of it before signing, play it safe with a non ML, or wait for a fix if it really was only 2-3 months away at this point?
Cheers
06-21-13, 01:49 AM
#478
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Mark Levinson Sounds like CRAP!
I have read every posting on this forum, and I have experienced the same exact issues with my 2013 ES300h ever since I purchased it last August. Every time I listen to any music with any type of bass (I like pop, hip-hop, R&B, and rock), the subwoofer rattles and "booms" and sounds horrible to me and nearly every passenger that's ridden in my car.
The sound was so bad that I found myself turning the volume way down from where I wanted to listen (high 40's to low 50's) just to stop the torture. Before I ever stumbled across this forum, I took my ES to the service department of the dealership where I purchased it (Lexus of Escondido). I took it there twice before they told me "it's operating within specifications and there's nothing more we can do about it". I then decided to call Lexus's Customer Service 800# and filed a complaint, asking them to buy-back my vehicle under the lemon laws since their service departments were unable to resolve the problems, and I was definitely not satisfied, especially after paying thousands extra for a "premium" audio system. They told me I could try bringing the car to a different dealership for further assessment. This all happened in the fall of 2012.
As much as I LOVE Lexus of Escondido (it's an amazing dealership, with multiple luxury amenities for their customers), since I live in central San Diego, I decided to try taking it to Lexus San Diego (in Kearny Mesa). There, they acknowledged hearing the poor audio quality but told me that they had received a call (prior to my arrival) from Lexus Customer Service advising them of my issues with the sound system. I was told by Lexus San Diego's service department that "a fix to the amplifier was in the works, and would be released shortly". True to their word, approx. 2 weeks later I was contacted and informed that the new amplifier had been received. So I took my vehicle in and dropped it off, and requested to see the new amplifier to confirm that they were replacing my ML amp with another ML amp, not a downgraded amp. They complied and showed me the new and old amps (which looked identical, by the way).
Since the replacement (which took place about 3 months ago), I have noticed a slight improvement in sound quality, but the subwoofer still vibrates, rattles and booms whenever I turn the volume past 45 or so. In my opinion, this is not acceptable. I am planning to take the car back to Lexus San Diego's service department soon. I am not sure if I am still potentially eligible for a lemon-law buyback (Lexus informed me in December 2012 that they had decided to deny my request for a buyback). I am at a loss for what to do, and anxiously await hearing what resolutions others are receiving, if any. Lexus Customer Service did offer me a small financial compensation "for my inconvenience", but nothing like the thousands of dollars extra I paid for the ML system, which really sounds like crap in my opinion.
Two other points I would like to make, I have owned several Lexus vehicles with ML audio previously, including an RX400h and two different LX470's with ML. The sound systems in those vehicles was amazing, especially in the RX. I actually used to look forward to driving just so I could enjoy my music (I live in a condominium so I can't listen at loud volumes where I live, only in my car). The final point I was going to make is that recently I have noticed that the backup camera in my vehicle is now lagging, in other words, when I shift into reverse, instead of the display immediately appearing on the navigation display, it is now staying blank/off for approx. 20 seconds for some reason, so long that it defeats the purpose of having a camera as I am now having to look back (like in the olden days!) while backing up, since my rear-view display is blank. I am not sure if others are experiencing this or other issues, but please let's hear from everyone who is experiencing ML audio quality issues or other technical issues with these cars. I'm ready to participate in a class-action suit if Lexus doesn't step up to the plate and fix these issues!
The sound was so bad that I found myself turning the volume way down from where I wanted to listen (high 40's to low 50's) just to stop the torture. Before I ever stumbled across this forum, I took my ES to the service department of the dealership where I purchased it (Lexus of Escondido). I took it there twice before they told me "it's operating within specifications and there's nothing more we can do about it". I then decided to call Lexus's Customer Service 800# and filed a complaint, asking them to buy-back my vehicle under the lemon laws since their service departments were unable to resolve the problems, and I was definitely not satisfied, especially after paying thousands extra for a "premium" audio system. They told me I could try bringing the car to a different dealership for further assessment. This all happened in the fall of 2012.
As much as I LOVE Lexus of Escondido (it's an amazing dealership, with multiple luxury amenities for their customers), since I live in central San Diego, I decided to try taking it to Lexus San Diego (in Kearny Mesa). There, they acknowledged hearing the poor audio quality but told me that they had received a call (prior to my arrival) from Lexus Customer Service advising them of my issues with the sound system. I was told by Lexus San Diego's service department that "a fix to the amplifier was in the works, and would be released shortly". True to their word, approx. 2 weeks later I was contacted and informed that the new amplifier had been received. So I took my vehicle in and dropped it off, and requested to see the new amplifier to confirm that they were replacing my ML amp with another ML amp, not a downgraded amp. They complied and showed me the new and old amps (which looked identical, by the way).
Since the replacement (which took place about 3 months ago), I have noticed a slight improvement in sound quality, but the subwoofer still vibrates, rattles and booms whenever I turn the volume past 45 or so. In my opinion, this is not acceptable. I am planning to take the car back to Lexus San Diego's service department soon. I am not sure if I am still potentially eligible for a lemon-law buyback (Lexus informed me in December 2012 that they had decided to deny my request for a buyback). I am at a loss for what to do, and anxiously await hearing what resolutions others are receiving, if any. Lexus Customer Service did offer me a small financial compensation "for my inconvenience", but nothing like the thousands of dollars extra I paid for the ML system, which really sounds like crap in my opinion.
Two other points I would like to make, I have owned several Lexus vehicles with ML audio previously, including an RX400h and two different LX470's with ML. The sound systems in those vehicles was amazing, especially in the RX. I actually used to look forward to driving just so I could enjoy my music (I live in a condominium so I can't listen at loud volumes where I live, only in my car). The final point I was going to make is that recently I have noticed that the backup camera in my vehicle is now lagging, in other words, when I shift into reverse, instead of the display immediately appearing on the navigation display, it is now staying blank/off for approx. 20 seconds for some reason, so long that it defeats the purpose of having a camera as I am now having to look back (like in the olden days!) while backing up, since my rear-view display is blank. I am not sure if others are experiencing this or other issues, but please let's hear from everyone who is experiencing ML audio quality issues or other technical issues with these cars. I'm ready to participate in a class-action suit if Lexus doesn't step up to the plate and fix these issues!
06-21-13, 06:40 AM
#479
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If you want to give your dealer my dealer’s info please do so. Have them call Lexus of Riverside California. Speak to Robert in service. Robert is the one that has been dealing with my case.
And yes, Mark levinson flew out one of their engineers to meet with me to see how I liked the new amp.
So call Riverside, speak to service and get as much info as you can. since this is technically still a lemon law case Robert may not be able to tell you everything, but I'm sure it will be more than what you have already been told.
I am under the impression that the new amp will be available shortly (week or two). There will also be an official bullion made up by Lexus corporate sent out to all dealerships to inform them of this issue and the resolution.
Thanks to everyone who called the 1800 number to tell Lexus about your issues and also for going to your dealer to complain as well. I truly believe it was this joint effort that really started the fire under the issue. Well done.
And yes, Mark levinson flew out one of their engineers to meet with me to see how I liked the new amp.
So call Riverside, speak to service and get as much info as you can. since this is technically still a lemon law case Robert may not be able to tell you everything, but I'm sure it will be more than what you have already been told.
I am under the impression that the new amp will be available shortly (week or two). There will also be an official bullion made up by Lexus corporate sent out to all dealerships to inform them of this issue and the resolution.
Thanks to everyone who called the 1800 number to tell Lexus about your issues and also for going to your dealer to complain as well. I truly believe it was this joint effort that really started the fire under the issue. Well done.
06-23-13, 03:07 PM
#480
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It seem as a fix may be around the corner, however we cannot let them off the hook until we all have a car working to the specs of what we were sold and meets reasonable expectations. I have drafted a short letter to outline our issues to Lexus and Mark Levinson.
June 2013
Dear Lexus/ Mark Levinson Audio
Lexus ES300h/350
I and several other Lexus owners purchased a 2013 Lexus ES300h with the Mark Levinson Premium Surround Sound Audio System at various dealerships throughout the US. We are unhappy with the performance of the Mark Levinson Premium Surround Sound Audio System. We have communicate with our respective auto dealership and requested they repair our vehicles. They have not adequacy corrected the issue.
The Mark Levinson Premium Surround Sound Audio System with 15 speakers and 835 watt Amplifier does not function, as it should. Most of the owner notices the distortion staring around the volume of 40. Several owners have had more than two trips to the dealership with no results. This is a waste of our time and efforts.
Currently we are communication on the Club Lexus Blog and sharing our experiences. We have decided that we need to address this problem as a collective instead of individually. The fault about which we originally complained is still present. The dealerships have advised us there is nothing the dealership can do to fix the problem. We are not turning to the manufacturing of the vehicle and the Mark Levinson Premium Surround Sound Audio System for a permanent solution to our issue.
There may be some confusion between you and the dealer on this point but now I have brought the problem to your attention I look forward to a prompt and effective repair under my warranty.
Yours sincerely
June 2013
Dear Lexus/ Mark Levinson Audio
Lexus ES300h/350
I and several other Lexus owners purchased a 2013 Lexus ES300h with the Mark Levinson Premium Surround Sound Audio System at various dealerships throughout the US. We are unhappy with the performance of the Mark Levinson Premium Surround Sound Audio System. We have communicate with our respective auto dealership and requested they repair our vehicles. They have not adequacy corrected the issue.
The Mark Levinson Premium Surround Sound Audio System with 15 speakers and 835 watt Amplifier does not function, as it should. Most of the owner notices the distortion staring around the volume of 40. Several owners have had more than two trips to the dealership with no results. This is a waste of our time and efforts.
Currently we are communication on the Club Lexus Blog and sharing our experiences. We have decided that we need to address this problem as a collective instead of individually. The fault about which we originally complained is still present. The dealerships have advised us there is nothing the dealership can do to fix the problem. We are not turning to the manufacturing of the vehicle and the Mark Levinson Premium Surround Sound Audio System for a permanent solution to our issue.
There may be some confusion between you and the dealer on this point but now I have brought the problem to your attention I look forward to a prompt and effective repair under my warranty.
Yours sincerely