07LexusGuy

Looks are subjective - but I agree, I dont feel as attracted to the Avalon as I am to the ES.

Have you test driven the Avalon? Its actually very quiet; and rides very well. One of the goals of the current Avalon design was to reduce noise levels to that of Lexus standards. Some details such as reclining rear seats and sliding center arm rest in the Avalon aren't even available in the ES. The Limited model even uses the same acoustic glass as the ES. And unlike some of the ES, there's no wind noise on the Avalon from the A pillar.

Sure you do - I did everytime I brought my old '05 Camry in for service at the Toyota dealership, They always wash it.

PsychDoc

OMG!!!!!

The Avalon doesn't have a touch screen nav system???

I thought only the Germans were that "behind the curve."

I can't even begin to tell you how many people I know have passed on the German offerings and M35/45 because of not having a touch screen nav. I don't think those clowns realize how many sales are going bye bye because of that one issue. The summer before I bought the ES350 I came very close to buying a BMW 530xi. The **** controlled nav system was the nail in the coffin.

The fact that you can still spend >$100k for an S-class M-B without a touch screen nav system is a source of absolute amazement to me and speaks to the arrogance of the German car manufacturers.

garsarno

0-60 mph takes about 6.2 seconds in the ES350 according to Car & Driver magazine test from 9/06. The 1/4 mile in 14.7 seconds / 97 mph. If it means anything, the ES350 is as fast -60 mph as a 1968 Olds 442, 1967 Z/28 Camaro and a 1972 Corvette 454. In the 1/4 mile, it matches a 1972 Chevelle SS454 and a 1967 GTO. The ES350 is faster than many a sixties supercar.

Lexucan

Dang!...and here I was thinking I was special!

Pheonix

Buy the ES, it's still built in Japan. A place where they know how to assemble cars.

BobBass

Consumer Reports has not tested the ES350, yet.

This is what they got on an '07 Camry XLS V6:
Here is their "take" on the 2005 Avalon XLS:
You can bet if CR can manage a 6.7 second 0-60 time on the Avalon, it would be easily repeatable by anybody. When Car & Driver does their track testing, they do things to lop of a few tenths of a second that the average driver would NEVER do in a million years to their cars. IMO the ES and the Avalon would probably tie in an all-out drag race.

Regarding the Avalon’s NAV, not only is it NOT touchscreen, ALL the Toyota NAV’s are notoriously “substandard.” It and the “iffy trans” are the two factors that prevent me from getting one.

Go here to read a review by a real “techie-type” who pretty much threw in the towel when trying to use it:

http://www.gadgetguru.com/avalon.htm

LexFather

Yeah the AValon won that comparison...

LexBob2

Performance wise the Avalon and ES350 are so close, any differences wouldn't be noticed by the average driver. Styling, price and warranty would probably be the big deciding factors.

RXSF

wow, i definately have to address this problem with the car wash...my Sienna goes in dirty, comes out, if possible, even more dirty. lol

agreed! lawl

as for 0-60 times, i go by manufacturers:

ES350- 6.8 seconds
Cheap Crap- 7.0 seconds (hope i didnt affend anyone, i own a toyota myself)

07LexusGuy

All these numbers floating around is crazy. The latest Car And Driver test shows the Camry SE V6 getting 0-60mph in 5.8 seconds.

http://www.caranddriver.com/features...camry-v-6.html

-- they must have done some torque braking or something to give it a nice start.

But in terms of Avalon v.s. ES - the Avalon might, just might have an edge because there's a manual switch to turn of TRAC on the Avalon whereas on our ES's we cannot do the same. But heck, I just can't imagine an Avalon and an ES drag racing between stop lights - that seems a bit out of place.

e-man

Is this true? On my 99 ES, there was a switch under the dash to turn off the ESC. What happens if you're stuck on an icy surface? If you can't turn off the traction control, the wheels won't spin at all. Is there an automatic electronic override in situations like that?

reyrey127

i didn't know tha avalon has a switch either? interesting... someone told me that the 5 speed was quicker than the 6 speed, unless the 6 speed has a closer gear ratio than the 5 speed, we won't really see the 6th gear engaged from 0-60 anyways. correct me if i am wrong. unless anyone know where i can find the gear ratios for the two different transmission, i would like to see a comparison... but i keeping reading that the avalon is faster... i think 6.5-6.6 from motor trend...

as for styling, i agree that the es looks much better, but the transmission is really really bothering... in addition, i keep hearing people differentiate the avalon from the es as if they are made by two different manufacturers. they are both toyotas, i believe...

i do like the touch screen, but i have seen a family relative of mine with a new M450 with nav and it is also a joystick type. it was somewhat of a hassle i agree, but how often do they have to input something.. they say rare.. so i dunno... i guess it depends on the driver...

Okay SIMPLY put, if the transmission issue was the only thing keeping me from a purchase, would you go get an es350 for an avalon limited?? or should i WAIT until close to the end of the year, OR should i go with an Acura TL (which i do not want to do)?

thanks in advance

RXSF

buy an 08 es350 if you cant decide. all the bugs should be gone by the next model. I would still get the ES

LexBob2

Good advice if you're not sure about the '07. The '08 ES should be out by late-summer or early-fall.

ES350Bob

In taking a closer look at transmission hesitation I came across numerous complaints of this on the Avalon with one guy actually speaking to an engineer who said they had no plans to correct it due to not enough complaints; yet, claimed some dealers are telling customers to wait till the 08's because a fix was being worked on, and there seems numerous complaints.

I see dunno mentioned it, so he is aware of it, coming across it somewhere as well.