jjbodean

honestly, not really. i guess i am fortunate to be a small dealer - we have had no oil leak problems from any model, and, believe it or not, not a single trans flare complaint to my service dept. we did have one es350 buyback when the first batch of 2007 models came out with the trans issue, but nothing since.

the dealers have confidence that lexus will work to pro-actively to address any concern that is service related. thats how lexus has operated in the past, and the results speak for themselves: number one in jd power year after year. consumer reports highly recommended year after year. the highest percentage of repeat buyers in the luxury segment.

the issues that we read about on CL i believe are an extremely small percentage of owners, and most have an excellent ownership experience. based on the fact that sales continue to outpace the competition, the dealers arent too concerned. most either dont have issues, or they are isolated. lexus tsibs number in the few thousand numbers typically. compare that to the recalls that other manufacturers contend with.

lexus has been and will continue to produce one of the highest quality vehicle lines in the world today, and they will continue to embrace the ideology of "kaizen", or continual improvement

purebliss

There will be a TSB on this soon for the ES350 it's bascailly the same TSB that was listed for the GS and IS. For some reason there are more cases reported on the ES even thought there are more GS's and IS's effected but few of them are having the problem. I don't get it ? So ES owners make sure you take look at your engines and makes sure no leaks. You will have up until 70,000 miles or 7 years when they post the TSB. Another suggestion is if you going to have the tranny replace have them also do it anyway even if you don't have a leak this way they don't have to pull the engine twice.

ES350Bob

I ran into a guy last night paranoid about his overall oil level in his ES350 and scheduled to have the oil leak TSIB performed on his car, after it is confirmed that is. He mentioned TSIB existed for this for ES350 and I hadn't seen it or heard of official TSIB for it so I looked and sure enough found one, what I could on it since it is not as detailed as an actual copy of the TSIB.

Seems Purebliss is owned a big sorry by some, he was only trying to be helpful.

http://www.lexusforum.com/recalls-an..._01007/TSB.htm

onepointon

Yes, there is an offical TSIB. I was doing the repairs long before it was offical out however. I can get an offical copy Monday morning if interested.

I dont know if it was covered, this thread had a lot of reading.

What happens when they are manufacturing the engine, they used too much sealant around the timing chain tensioner for the timing cover. For some reason it didnt create a good bond and the oil leaks out right there. If you look under your car, you will see engine oil leaking on the bottom of the power steering pump. It requires removal of the engine, there is no way around it. I have seen a decent amount of them.

I have heard there were a lot of problems with the IS and GS, especially when talking to techs at different dealers while at training. My dealer has never had an issue with them, I dont know why?

ES350Bob

The guy who takes his car and details it is the one who caught it, the owner was otherwise clueless until then and I think that is why he was so unduly concerned about overall oil level.

Bravo to the observant detailer for sure

I think if people don't know to look for it, or as happened to purebliss who also works for Lexus and tries to be honest with folks, see where he is called cry fire and worse for trying to give a heads up it goes unoticed or doubt is cast on him, others who time proves end up knowing exactly what they were talking about.

Cannot hurt regardless to at least know to check for it.

The TSIB copy may be helpful but better if put up top there on forum in List of TSIB thread.

MD350

Shouldn't this be a recall? Has it been common?

onepointon

NP.


Recall, or as Lexus likes to call them, 'Special Service Capaigns', are only on safety issues. Since an oil leak isnt necessarily a safety concern, its just a TSIB. TSIBs are only done on customer complaint, its not something we are allowed to 'upsell' since its under warranty. However, as a service, I look at every ES350 I work on to see if its leaking. If it is, we let the customer know about it and usually take care of it the same day. They may need to leave it with us for a day or two since its a pretty big job. I find it makes them happier about the situation if we notice it before they do.

MD350

So, basically it pays to have your oil changes and other services done at the dealer. Because they will look for issues that Lexus commonly sees, where the owner may not, and if they see the issues present will go ahead and do the repair under warranty. For example, this TSIB.

Is there anything, as an owner, to look for this? Would I expect to see oil on the driveway after being parked overnight?

onepointon

Yes and no, in the aspect of that. Yes, included with every oil change is a general look over the car. Oil leaks, tire condition, brakes, fluid levels, ect. Some techs will simply let something like this go because they dont feel like pulling an engine out under warranty, but some wont. Also, sometimes if a dealer's warranty costs are high, they are likely to just let the customer come in with an issue over letting them know about it. Technically speaking, that is the way Lexus wants it to be properly done anyway. TSIB's are only for customer's actual complaints.

Yes, your car does get looked over and if something is obviously wrong, it should be noted. Now Im not going checking VIN numbers for TSIBs on dash rattles and ect. I am just trying to save a customer from being unhappy about oil on his garage floor and the like.

ES350Bob

MD,

As to recall or lack of one, it boils down to dollars interfering with better business sense from what I can see. This in turn places a lot of STRESS on service pros from my own observations and actual experiences.

To fix (50,000 +/-) of these potentially prone to just this would likely cost Lexus in excess of 30 million dollars or perhaps double that if they mailed out a notice to everyone.

I'd recall them or Special Service Campaign them pronto, too risky not to just for the fact people can discover this on their own without any heads up from Lexus which will anger people. Or, a couple of engine compartment fires from oil that has leaked making national news and it's toast for reputation which is otherwise worth far more than the cost of asking techs to check them all and repair those prone to this. A tech feeling he or she has to walk away from a repair they can see is needed is stress they do not need.

In defense of Lexus: There may have been instances where dealers got carried away and warranty charged themselves into a nice profit at Lexus' expense, but this and a few other issues with the ES clearly don't fall under that.

ALALEX

I had the same thing happen - started noticing oil on the garage floor. Took it in, my shop said it was a "known problem" caused by poor sealant around the timing chain cover. They handled it, no more leak after about four months.

onepointon

Jackpot. Dealers are watched on their warranty expense. You are required to hold onto the parts in question incase they want to call it back to either verify it was defective, or examine it for possible product problems that need to be corrected. Some techs may say "Hey, its kind of leaking, we are slow, lets do this under warranty to try to make some money." Its a bad all around deal to do that. Not all cars in the VIN range will leak, which is another reason to not do this. More money in warranty repairs, and a lot of engine pulls that aren't necessary.


I wouldn't worry about the vehicle catching fire. A.) It isnt near leaking onto the exhaust, B.) I have never seen an engine fire due to engine oil on the exhaust system, it just doesnt get that hot.

MD350

I don't want to bother you on all TSIBs, but since this is a major one, would you mind posting the VIN range for it? If not, no big deal. Thanks!

onepointon

No, I do not mind. However, I am out of the dealership until Friday morning. It will have to be then. Sorry for the wait.

When I get back I will post up a copy of the TSIB.

justfixit

Here is copy: