speedkar9

I sold my 2005 Lexus ES330 the other day. I had it for almost 4 years.







Here's a summary of my experience with the 4th Gen ES:

The good:
- Reliable, trouble free, cheap maintenance
- Smooth, quiet highway ride
- Outstanding build and material quality, especially the interior which is better than newer ES350's
- Many interchangeable parts with the Camry platform
- Torquey engine (240ft-lb torque @ 3600 RPM) great for highway passing
- Seat comfort (except for thigh support)
- Being a part of the Lexus club

The not good:
- Transmission and throttle lag seriously compromises the driveability. The transmission feels like its in the wrong gear causing the engine to rev up and the car to jerk when you slow down and speed up again in stop and go traffic. The pedal as a dead spot in the beginning making starts very jerky. This was the #1 reason I gave up on my ES and finally got rid of it.

- A lot of body roll in corners, car feels heavy and not maneuverable.

- Poor fuel economy. I averaged 12L/100km (20MPG) in summer and 14L/100km (16MPG) in the winter in mixed driving.

- Unrefined engine: The 3.3L 3MZ-FE is noticeably louder and coarser than the silky smooth 1MZ-FE 3.0L in my Solara and the previous gen ES300.

- Tight back seat compared to the Camry of the same platform. Lexus front seats are fatter to accommodate ventilation. Also wished the front seat traveled back further for taller drivers and I'm only 5'10". The Solara's seat goes back much further relative to the pedals.

- Bad snow traction: no traction control with a powerful V6 and a heavy car make for dicey driving when the weather gets slick in Canada.

- The Lexus brand name brings prestige but also jealousy depending on who your friends are, the neighborhood, and what they appreciate. I mostly got the "oh look a rich guy driving a Lexus" compliment from friends/family.

- We can't have nice things: As much as I tried to keep this car mint, I got bumped in the parking lot and scraped by my brother's bike last year....that really turned my mind around having a nice clean car with all the other careless people on our roads. Its less stressful driving a beater car and not having to worry about it getting dinged in the Wal*mart parking lot.

A note about resale value
Resale value of cars is much lower in Canada than in the US. My car had 229,000 km (142,000 miles) and sold for $5,000 CAD ($3900 USD). A similar car would go for roughly $6000 USD in the states.
The funny thing is I sold it to a guy who was going to import it to California and he drove off with dealer plates With the exchange rate so low, I could see a lot of people making good money off Canadian cars.

Conclusion
Nevertheless, if it wasn't for the transmission being programmed how it was I would have kept the car. I'm a person that really appreciates quality of materials, fit and finish and smoothness and refinement in a car, and a car like the ES fits my driving style.

For now, I'll be driving around my Solara primarily. In the future I look forward to purchasing a Lexus or Toyota again to replace the ES as I will need a decent 4 door car. I'm thinking either a 5th gen ES350, or an RX350, Camry V6 or Highlander. I want something fast, smooth, quiet, but the utility of an SUV would be a nice addition.

crwys

Thanks for the share, it was a nice read.

I do have to agree with the bad gas mileage and body roll. I'm in a es300 though.

Your car looked like a beauty, shame you had to get rid of it.

Oro

Wow, what a different and frustrating experience. Our 1mz 4es is just not like that WRT mileage and driveability.

Did yours have the 6spd?

BDSL

I agree with speedkar9 as I drive a 2006 ES330 now. I used to drive a 97 ES300. I like the 97 ES300 better...

hypervish

The fuel economy is not bad considering the power and size. I can easily get 28-29 MPG highway, and under the right conditions, I can hit 30 MPG. City is usually hovering around 19-20 MPG

hypervish

No 4ES had a six speed. They were introduced on the 5th gen, i.e. 2007.

mmatheny

28-29 HWY??? I don't see it! What speed is that - 60mph? I do agree with the transmission issues though. In miles of stop and go it is REALLY annoying!

GSteg

iTrader: (15)

It's a shame Toyota considered the lag and jerkiness "normal". We gave our 2005 ES330 to my little sister because it got to the point where the car no longer felt luxurious. It was embarrassing whenever we took passengers around.

hypervish

65 MPH yields a solid 28-29 mpg. I tend to cruise at about 75 MPH and depending upon whether it's completely highway (i.e. road trip), I can still manage 27 mpg.

It's all about maintaining a constant throttle position. Using that technique, I've squeezed 26 mpg out of my RX300 that's rated at only 21 highway.

Yeah the transmission can be annoying at times; however, once you learn when it tends to misbehave, you can adjust your driving style to minimize the weirdness.

mmatheny

I get about 26 between Houston and Austin doing around 80. But the speedo is 75 on I-10, so 65 would be too slow!

Oro

Probably you had one or more bad motor mounts. I really think that's the cause of a lot of the complaints. The three-point lower mounting system was a really bad idea and AFAIK Lexus used it only on this generation and quickly abandoned it. The 3es had a four-point lower mounting system I believe, and I think all subsequent ones do, too.

I took out all the motor mounts last fall, found the transmission one bad and replaced it. The upper strut had already been done; those go bad the quickest. Now, no more "clunk" and it's really smooth all the time, and has never hunted or shifted inappropriately. I'm sure there's more going on to this whole issue in general for all year ragnes, and my singular example here is a 2002 1mz-fe, not a 2005 3mz-fe. it has not been re-flashed, which I hear also created it's own new set of problems and I wonder if Speedkar9's was re-flashed. I don't know what year range beyond 02/03 they did that too.

Oro

I thought the 2006 had it but perhaps I'm wrong. I was aware there where issues with it the first year so I made a mental note for the future to look into it if I went for a car around the transition year(s).

GSteg

iTrader: (15)

It's definitely not the engine mounts. Some of the complaints occurred when these cars were brand new in 2003! The issue was just as you described: transmission hunting gears. It's most noticeable during 3rd to 4th shift and the car gets confused. On the highway, it would hesitate to downshift unless you absolutely floor it. I get around it by downshifting manually. Resetting the ECU doesn't help nor does changing all the fluids. I was not the original owner so I don't know whether it was reflashed or not, nor did I want to take it into the dealer just for them to tell me it's normal.

We replaced the ES with an RX450h. No shifting to worry about.

Oro

I wasn't around at the time w/a new one, but I thought the main new complaints was for the clunk? I did not know hunting around was part of it, and it seems the TSB and cure would do nothing about that. As i said, I imagine there is more than one thing going on.

It's really odd that some do it and some do not. It seems there's be a consistent mechanical or electro-mechanical design flaw that would reliably show itself. My SUV will hunt around when on cruise in rolling hills - it did it to me last week crossing eastern WA on US route 2 through farm land. If I had a car doing that routinely it would drive me bananas, too.

KLF

I also sold my '05 ES330, last fall. I sold it for a couple of reasons, mostly because I DD my '87 pickup now after spending 4 years rebuilding it from the frame up. My car sat in the garage for weeks at a time, often with a trickle charger on the battery. I sat for almost 5 months last winter, I only drove it for 1500 miles in the last year I owned it. I mentioned to a coworker last fall that I was thinking of getting rid of it, and he basically said, "tell me what you want for it, I'll buy it". Coincidentally, my daughter got deployed with the US Navy for 11 months, and needed a place to stash her car, so it's in my garage now as a spare car for us. So I needed the ES even less.

I still get to see the car 2-3 times a week parked right outside my office. He and his wife LOVE the car, it was in mint condition when I let it go.

My comments on the ES:

* I agree that the car was extremely reliable. The only non-maintenance items I had on the car in 104K miles was a failed alternator and the hood strut stopped holding the hood open. Both were very easy repairs. The car still had the original factory brakes (pads and rotors) on it when I sold it, and they were still in very good shape.

* I *hated* that annoying throttle and transmission lag BS. What a bunch of crap from such an otherwise nice car.

* I also hated the "automatic" wipers. They were terrible.

* We have the same engine in our Highlander, it rarely gets more than 20 mpg, but I had no trouble getting 25 mpg out of my car (I rarely had it on the highway), but could get 27-28 on long trips. I was OK with that.

* My car originally came from Texas (bought on eBay), and I mistakenly assumed it had traction control (my '98 did). Wow did that car SUCK in the snow with the Michelin Primacy tires.

When my daughter returns from deployment and needs her car back, I'll be looking for another 3rd vehicle. Not sure if it will be a Lexus. But I will have another one some day.