koreywill

I need some help. My 2003 ES300 with 283k miles needs new struts. No leaks that I can see but it does bounce as I drive down the road. There are no noises from the strut mounts that I can hear.
I've gone through seemingly a gazillion threads but I don't seem to find a consensus on the best brand and parts to use. Tokico, Bilstein, SenSen, Monroe Quick Struts, Monroe oespectrum, KYB, KYB Excel, Lexus original strut, and others are all names that I've found in my search with both good and bad reviews.
It sounds like if Monroe put an oespectrum strut into their Quick Strut that would be a good combination but they don't do that.
Can you all give me some suggestions as to which way to go? It would be greatly appreciated.

Fritz330

If you want the Lexus ride you're going to have to use Lexus struts.

JetsonES

I guess it all depends on what you want out of the car.

Oro

I went through this 1.5 years ago in our 02 at 220k miles. I did a ton of research here and elsewhere. I was pretty sure I'd be unhappy or lack confidence in all the "quick strut" options, so this is what I did:

KYB struts (only one model for this car - Excel and GR-2 are same shock, just different market names) all around. KYB is the OE manufacturer for Lexus, so you are getting OE quality, just slightly different valving internally.

Re-used OE mounts.

Re-used front springs.

New Moog springs in rear - our OE were sagging a bit.

New alignment very soon (or you will ruin your tires).

Didn't change anything else. Total parts bill was about $400 or less I think (I did the work). Very pleased w/results.

While I would have been happy with Lexus OE parts, but at 1/3 to 1/2 the cost, I got the same results as far as I can tell, the car was back to feeling like it did when fresh. It is now 25k later and all feels great still.

koreywill

Hello ORO and thanks for the response. I was leaning towards the KYB's and you've helped me lean a little further. Did you clean out and regrease the mount/bearings or just reuse as is? +1 on the alignment. I don't think my ES has any sag but do you know what the ride height should be and where it should be measured?

speedkar9

As long as your strut mounts are not making any noise, stick with them as there is no better or equivalent aftermarket replacement in terms of build quality. Therefore Monroe quick struts are out.

Hayk

iTrader: (1)

+1 on KYB, Lexus struts even come with KYB stamped in the steel. Keep in mind though, Lexus KYB rides different from regular KYB.

The springs are most likely NOT necessary. The ever famous rear sag is mostly caused by worn out shocks that cannot help support the weight of the rear end on a very soft spring. When I reused my original springs with 200k on the clock and installed brand new Lexus struts, the ride leveled out. No sagging or raised front end to speak of.

lostape45

+1 on what mrbooby said about using stock springs.

My ES was sagging in the rear when it needed new struts and I contemplated replacing the springs. I ended up leaving the original ones in there and just getting new OEM Lexus struts. No more sagging in the rear after the new struts. My car was at 160k when I had this work done.

jakebot88

My cars rear end was sagging and the ride quality wasn't very good. I replace all 4 struts with KYB GR-2's (basically everything included in a quick strut minus the spring) Which helped the standing right height a bit... But I still feel like my car squats too much with 4 people in it and it even bottoms out some when going over bumps even on the interstate. I have wheels from a 2007 es350 which are an inch wider and taller but I feel this really shouldn't affect it THAT much... Are the OEM KYB Lexus struts so different that I REALLY should have gotten those for my car to have a half way decent ride and be able to haul 4 people without affecting the ride and ride height so horribly?

Oro

No, it's just the factory springs are too soft. They are designed to feel plush and soft for about 100k and then they need replacement. While you can depend upon new cartridges to prop up your springs, that's honestly the job of the spring to determine ride height, and the shock to control oscillation (dampening).

The Moog cc273 for the same vintage Camry and Avalon fit perfectly and correct this issue. They are $80/pair delivered from Amazon/prime. You will need to check alignment as it will alter that (as with any major suspension component change). Otherwise you may ruin the rear tires.

One of the reasons I went with this is a) I won't have to replace rear shocks as often because they won't be over-stressed/over-worked, and b) on weekends there are frequently 3/4 people in the car and items in the trunk, and I wanted a competent, balanced ride. I also did not want to buy Lexus springs at twice the price and then be replacing them again in 100k miles. Got what I wanted, great ride, and am very happy.

Presuming you have the correct lower profile tires on your 17" rims, that should not be a cause of your bottoming problem. (Meaning, you have 225/50-17 tires on it now or something compatible).

jakebot88

Oro that's exactly what I was thinking but have been told by multiple mechanics that my springs are fine. I kept saying that my car essentially can't handle 4 people in it? How can that be? My friends Saab does fine!

The tires that are on my car are the exact oem size that would go on those wheels (2007 es350) which are 215/55-17 My oem wheels and tires with these I would imagine they would be about the same height as the original tires had more sidewall and these have slightly less. they're also 1" wider but they don't rub on the strut.

Compared to the OEM springs how much stiffer and how much does the ride suffer?

koreywill

OK. I've been following my own thread and here's what I've come up with so far in regards to replacing the struts:
Go with KYB's Excel G-2 front and rear, new strut bellows and bump stops front and rear, Moog CC273 springs in the rear (even though they're for Avalon and Camry), and reuse all other parts. does that about cover it? If so it looks like about $540 total.

Oro

Korey-

215/55 would be close enough to stock for Gov't. work, so that's not an issue. It will, apples-to-apples on tires, make the resulting ride a little stiffer because you have less sidewall height to flex. I can usually feel a distinct difference in ride from 16 to 17" tires.

The resulting ride in ours, using same stock Yoko Avid 16" tires, was to stiffen it some. The GR-2s are valved 15% stiffer than stock but otherwise identical (from what I've heard from a reputable source). The Camry/Avalon rear springs are not overly stiff, but stiffer than stock. I would compare the ride to what a BMW would feel like vs a floatier lexus. It is a NICE ride, a little firmer but I do not mind that because that is what I am used to (used to German cars and even a lot of miles on horseback!). It is NOT racer-boy stiff, etc. My wife finds it fine, my dad who like a soft ride sees no issues, etc.


Jakebott -

Your prescription is just what I did; if you look at my old posts back about Sept/ Oct. Last year I authored on on the subject and I outlined that. I did not get new bumpstops and I re-used the existing insulators (rubber pads between spring and strut plates/shelves). I was just at $400 total, but I got a blow-out deal on two of the shocks on Ebay. But yeah, $450 should cover it all if you do the work.

If you can scrounge up two of the coil spring compressors (borrow one each from two auto stores for example if you don't have one), it is easier/safer IMO. I had one set, so I borrowed another from the local O'Reillys. 2ndly, if you have or can borrow a 1/2" Dewalt hammer drill or similar, it's a breeze because you can put a 1/2" ratchet extension on it and then just zip around the compressors. No hand-fighting all that torque to compress them.

JetsonES

That's the comparison made in my mind when I put in the beefier rear sway bar, tightened the car up to make it feel more bmw like, really reduced body roll and understeer. On Sunday the brackets on the drivers side gave up though so I pulled it off today, now I'm running no rear sway, pronounced body roll and much more understeer. I didn't like the looks of the brackets during the install so I'm not surprised they gave up. Gotta price those out tonight.

Oro

Exactly. The body roll and understeer were really what annoyed me, it was unacceptable with the stock springs after they aged.

I didn't beef up the sway bar; the Moog springs were enough. I did replace the front and rear sway bar bushings, but it was not really necessary at least in my case, they had worn quite well and were totally serviceable. But we really don't have "winter" here, but likely the same in much of Texas. The fronts in particular were VERY difficult to get at and it was not needed.