Rant: Why can't we buy small, cheap trucks now days????
05-11-16, 07:44 PM
#16
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It is unfortunate but as with most segments, automakers only build what sells enough to justify. Compact trucks nearly died in the states altogether with only the Tacoma pulling in sales until GM relaunched their new ones. Ford, Chrysler, GM all pulling from the market because the majority of the truck market wants full size.
Small and stripped almost can't be found anywhere in the US market. Manuel locks and windows can't be had anymore. The market is just too small for such models. Really, if you were going to spend so little for a car, most choose to buy a used car to get more car. You soon won't be able to buy a car without a backup camera never mind.
Tacoma's now start at nearly $24K and you can get 'em past $40K! The only option is to go used.
Small and stripped almost can't be found anywhere in the US market. Manuel locks and windows can't be had anymore. The market is just too small for such models. Really, if you were going to spend so little for a car, most choose to buy a used car to get more car. You soon won't be able to buy a car without a backup camera never mind.
Tacoma's now start at nearly $24K and you can get 'em past $40K! The only option is to go used.
05-11-16, 08:28 PM
#18
Lexus Fanatic
No, with all due respect, you DON'T want one of today's VW diesels IF you care about emissions....although the company, in response to the scandal, is working on repair and/or re-certifications of existing ones.
05-12-16, 05:55 AM
#20
Super Moderator
Actually, it was the reverse. The full-size models cannibalized sales of compact trucks because, in order to make a profit and cover costs of production, the manufacturers had to price smaller trucks so close to the full-size models that many buyers saw the handwriting on the wall and just went for the full-size models instead
My 2000 Dakota extended cab V8 with literally every single option except auto trans and engine block heater, was $20k. The Ram 1500 I test drove to find out if I'd like the clutch/transmission before placing my order was $23k. It was a stripper work truck, flat white paint, standard cab/short bed, no AC, power nothing, no radio, steel wheels, vinyl seats and rubber floors. Similarly equipped to my Dakota would have been over $30k.
05-12-16, 06:31 AM
#21
Lexus Fanatic
Originally Posted by geko29
Not true at all. Trust me, I actually purchased two of them. My 1996 Ranger extended cab was fairly well-equipped--no power locks or windows, but most other options, sport seats, chrome wheels, automatic and the largest engine. It cost $15.7k new. A comparably-equipped F150 was in the $25k range.
My 2000 Dakota extended cab V8 with literally every single option except auto trans and engine block heater, was $20k. The Ram 1500 I test drove to find out if I'd like the clutch/transmission before placing my order was $23k. It was a stripper work truck, flat white paint, standard cab/short bed, no AC, power nothing, no radio, steel wheels, vinyl seats and rubber floors. Similarly equipped to my Dakota would have been over $30k.
My 2000 Dakota extended cab V8 with literally every single option except auto trans and engine block heater, was $20k. The Ram 1500 I test drove to find out if I'd like the clutch/transmission before placing my order was $23k. It was a stripper work truck, flat white paint, standard cab/short bed, no AC, power nothing, no radio, steel wheels, vinyl seats and rubber floors. Similarly equipped to my Dakota would have been over $30k.
05-12-16, 07:45 AM
#22
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Driving my 2004 Tacoma tonight, I kind of realized that it is an extinct breed, at least here in United States. The truck was $12,000 brand new(dad bought it for that price in 2004, not sure of the actual MSRP). Its 2wd, reg cab, short box, 4 cylinder, 5 speed manual, no options. Standard equipment included a/c, power steering, power brakes, carpet with floor mats, cloth 1 piece bench seat that does not recline, and the Toyota reputation that it is dirt cheap to service and doesn't break.
i know you love it but if such a truck were built today they'd sell almost none.
Granted I do like the new Tacoma, its a great truck provided you get the V6(4 cylinders are a dog considering how big/heavy this truck is), but man its huge, you can't reach into the bed, and with the V6 its $30,000. My 2004 Tacoma, at $12000, adjusted for inflation is $15,000 in 2016.
I just don't get it, we can have stripper Kia Rio sedans for $15,000, but why can't we have a small, workhorse truck for the same price????
Last edited by bitkahuna; 05-12-16 at 07:48 AM.
05-12-16, 10:02 AM
#23
Super Moderator
That same year, the base price range for the F150 was $21,565-$44,355 for the 7 different trim levels, which is 40-76% higher. The well-equipped 4wd XLT (3rd lowest trim level out of 7) SuperCrew that CR tested cost $40k, or 54% more. Granted, there's undoubtedly some equipment differences in there. But that's still a dramatic gap.
05-12-16, 01:48 PM
#24
Lexus Fanatic
Then whats your explanation for why you can't find small cheap trucks here anymore? Where did that consumer go?
05-12-16, 03:05 PM
#25
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
again, the frontier starts at 18k msrp... hardly expensive.
05-12-16, 03:08 PM
#26
Lexus Fanatic
Yes, that's basically what I meant. Geko29 was correct when he described the market of a couple of decades ago....but the pricing structure of smaller trucks changed since then, and because of that, those small and medium sized trucks lost much of their attractiveness. Today, only the Tacoma, Colorado/Canyon, and Frontier survive in the American market, though there is talk of the Ranger maybe coming back.
05-12-16, 03:10 PM
#27
Lexus Fanatic
05-12-16, 07:25 PM
#28
Lexus Champion
I'm just not sure the market is there these days. At various times when I was younger I drove a Mazda B2000 and a Chevy S10 Extended cab. They were crap inside, both with manual transmissions, but they were what I could afford and they were still fun. I think today's young people either really don't care about driving (they wait much longer to get their drivers licenses) or expect to drive something with all the bells and whistle from the get-go. When I was in my late teens my parents pretty much said you can drive what you can afford, so I made the most of it. This also made me appreciate more what I'm driving now.
Last edited by dseag2; 05-12-16 at 07:29 PM.
05-12-16, 07:50 PM
#29
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
I'm just not sure the market is there these days. At various times when I was younger I drove a Mazda B2000 and a Chevy S10 Extended cab. They were crap inside, both with manual transmissions, but they were what I could afford and they were still fun. I think today's young people either really don't care about driving (they wait much longer to get their drivers licenses) or expect to drive something with all the bells and whistle from the get-go. When I was in my late teens my parents pretty much said you can drive what you can afford, so I made the most of it. This also made me appreciate more what I'm driving now.
Man those Chevy S10's were all over the place in the 90's/early 00's, lots of people I went to high school/college with had one. The rich kids had the lowered, always waxed and shiny Xtreme model with the ground effects. I thought about buying one years ago until I drove it, what a giant pile of poorly assembled, sloppy feeling rattling piece of junk.
Then it seems like overnight, I don't see them at ALL on the roads anymore. I'm thinking it was a combo of them being pieces of crap and all the backwards hat crew running them into the ditch.
The Nissan at 18k MSRP is actually a pretty good value provided that it would actually hold together long term. Buddy had a 2009 Frontier(same truck as the 2016). Right at 100k miles, the a/c compressor failed, the heater core went out, the radiator started leaking coolant into the transmission, which then fried the transmission, the cat converter went out along with the oxygen sensor. Nissan used to make good stuff until Renault bought them out.
As for the Tacoma, yes you can buy one with the 159hp 2.7 liter 4 cylinder engine for $24k. That's still a price spread of $9,000 vs the $15k basic model 2004 I have. Not to mention how ungodly slow that truck is, since its saddled with an automatic, 159hp/180lb-ft torque, and 4000lbs of truck to move around. Granted my 2004 Tacoma makes about the same power, but it weighs 900lbs less, and its pretty slow as well. Hopefully Toyota puts a more powerful and fuel efficient base engine in the truck for 2017.
05-12-16, 07:52 PM
#30
Lexus Champion
Man those Chevy S10's were all over the place in the 90's/early 00's, lots of people I went to high school/college with had one. The rich kids had the lowered, always waxed and shiny Xtreme model with the ground effects. I thought about buying one years ago until I drove it, what a giant pile of poorly assembled, sloppy feeling rattling piece of junk.
Then it seems like overnight, I don't see them at ALL on the roads anymore. I'm thinking it was a combo of them being pieces of crap and all the backwards hat crew running them into the ditch.
The Nissan at 18k MSRP is actually a pretty good value provided that it would actually hold together long term. Buddy had a 2009 Frontier(same truck as the 2016). Right at 100k miles, the a/c compressor failed, the heater core went out, the radiator started leaking coolant into the transmission, which then fried the transmission, the cat converter went out along with the oxygen sensor. Nissan used to make good stuff until Renault bought them out.
As for the Tacoma, yes you can buy one with the 159hp 2.7 liter 4 cylinder engine for $24k. That's still a price spread of $9,000 vs the $15k basic model 2004 I have. Not to mention how ungodly slow that truck is, since its saddled with an automatic, 159hp/180lb-ft torque, and 4000lbs of truck to move around. Granted my 2004 Tacoma makes about the same power, but it weighs 900lbs less, and its pretty slow as well. Hopefully Toyota puts a more powerful and fuel efficient base engine in the truck for 2017.
Then it seems like overnight, I don't see them at ALL on the roads anymore. I'm thinking it was a combo of them being pieces of crap and all the backwards hat crew running them into the ditch.
The Nissan at 18k MSRP is actually a pretty good value provided that it would actually hold together long term. Buddy had a 2009 Frontier(same truck as the 2016). Right at 100k miles, the a/c compressor failed, the heater core went out, the radiator started leaking coolant into the transmission, which then fried the transmission, the cat converter went out along with the oxygen sensor. Nissan used to make good stuff until Renault bought them out.
As for the Tacoma, yes you can buy one with the 159hp 2.7 liter 4 cylinder engine for $24k. That's still a price spread of $9,000 vs the $15k basic model 2004 I have. Not to mention how ungodly slow that truck is, since its saddled with an automatic, 159hp/180lb-ft torque, and 4000lbs of truck to move around. Granted my 2004 Tacoma makes about the same power, but it weighs 900lbs less, and its pretty slow as well. Hopefully Toyota puts a more powerful and fuel efficient base engine in the truck for 2017.