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Old 04-15-16, 06:50 PM
  #16  
Aron9000
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Originally Posted by mmarshall
Though Mazda, a Japanese manufacturer, has had the most successful use of rotary engines over the years, the basic design was actually traced to a German, Felix Wankel. In fact, Mercedes did a experimental four-rotor car in 1970 called the C-111.
Rotary engines are great in race cars, they don't really work in road cars. You can rev the **** out of them all day long and they don't break on a race track. Mazda won the 24 Hours of LeMans in a 4 rotor prototype car. That car made 900hp naturally aspirated out of 2.6 liters of displacement. They then banned rotary engines the next year.

The thing is they don't like the type of use a street car gets put through. They never could figure out how to keep the apex seals together on street cars(think of it as the piston rings on a normal engine). The engines use a lot of oil(by design), so that is another reason they fail, people don't check the oil. The apex seals can also fail from excessive carbon buildup, this is caused by sedate driving and not revving the **** out of it. There are a number of other ways to break them as well, including a clogged cat converter.
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Old 04-15-16, 07:19 PM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by Aron9000
Rotary engines don't have pistons. They have the spinning dorito of death instead

I know it was a trick question though.

This was beyond easy though IMO. It wasn't like there were two answers that looked correct, there were two obviously wrong ones and one correct one.
There is, in fact, such a thing as a rotary piston engine, but because of its large frontal area, it was not used in automobiles (that I know of). It featured a odd number of cylinders arranged in a circle around the central crankshaft but the strange thing was that the crankshaft remained stationary and the whole crankcase and the cylinders spun around it.




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Old 04-15-16, 07:41 PM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by Aron9000
Rotary engines are great in race cars, they don't really work in road cars. You can rev the **** out of them all day long and they don't break on a race track. Mazda won the 24 Hours of LeMans in a 4 rotor prototype car. That car made 900hp naturally aspirated out of 2.6 liters of displacement. They then banned rotary engines the next year.
Rotary engines also get poor gas mileage, mainly due to the fact that the rotors, as they spin, have more spark-plug-firings per rotation than you find in typical four-stroke piston engines. Lousy gas mileage will work against you in racing, as you obviously can't make time on the track if you're constantly in the pits refueling.

The thing is they don't like the type of use a street car gets put through. They never could figure out how to keep the apex seals together on street cars(think of it as the piston rings on a normal engine). The engines use a lot of oil(by design), so that is another reason they fail, people don't check the oil. The apex seals can also fail from excessive carbon buildup, this is caused by sedate driving and not revving the **** out of it. There are a number of other ways to break them as well, including a clogged cat converter.
They burn oil because the small lubricating film of oil on the apex tip-seals constantly burns off and gets replaced as the seals whirl around during each rotation and are exposed for a split-second as the spark plugs light off in the combustion chambers. That's why constant oil pressure (and oil-supply) in a rotary is even more critical than for a piston engine. The small amount of (normal) oil smoke, of course, is usually burned up in the catalytic converter after it warms up...but that's why rotary-engined cars need strong efficient converters.

Last edited by mmarshall; 04-16-16 at 05:30 AM.
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Old 04-15-16, 07:49 PM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by Sulu
There is, in fact, such a thing as a rotary piston engine, but because of its large frontal area, it was not used in automobiles (that I know of). It featured a odd number of cylinders arranged in a circle around the central crankshaft but the strange thing was that the crankshaft remained stationary and the whole crankcase and the cylinders spun around it.
Rotary aircraft engines, which spun around their own crankshafts, were installed in a few early aircraft dating up through World War I, but were almost never used after that. They were horrendous for early pilots, because the aircraft had to contend with not only propeller-torque from the spinning prop-mass, but also the huge torque from the spinning engine-mass as well. This naturally made the plane want to do constant banks and rolls in one direction, unless corrected by strong aileron and rudder action...especially at low airspeeds when the flight-controls were less effective. It also made the plane highly unstable in some handling maneuvers, and prone to vicious stall/spin characteristics.
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Old 04-15-16, 09:28 PM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by mmarshall
Rotary engines also get poor gas mileage, mainly due to the fact that the rotors, as they spin, have more spark-plug-firings per rotation than you find in typical four-stroke piston engines. Lousy gas mileage will work against you in racing, as you obviously can't time on the track if you're constantly in the pits refueling.



They burn oil because the small lubricating film of oil on the apex tip-seals constantly burns off and gets replaced as the seals whirl around during each rotation and are exposed for a split-second as the spark plugs light off in the combustion chambers. That's why constant oil pressure (and oil-supply) in a rotary is even more critical than for a piston engine. The small amount of (normal) oil smoke, of course, is usually burned up in the catalytic converter after it warms up...but that's why rotary-engined cars need strong efficient converters.
I think you hit the nail on the head as to why we will never see another rotary engine in a production car. With current regulations, they use too much gas and pollute too much. Cat converter failures on the Mazda RX-8 are common, and can lead to increased exhaust gas temperatures, which once again can lead to apex seal failures on the rotary engine.
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Old 04-18-16, 03:07 AM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by Aron9000
Rotary engines don't have pistons. They have the spinning dorito of death instead

I know it was a trick question though.
Ah, I must have missed the word piston in the question. Thanks for pointing that out.
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Old 04-18-16, 08:59 AM
  #22  
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Except for the steam engine questions I think I had this quiz in 8th grade shop.

30/30 in bed, half asleep. Maybe that's the formula.
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Old 04-18-16, 01:12 PM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by Lil4X
Except for the steam engine questions I think I had this quiz in 8th grade shop.

30/30 in bed, half asleep. Maybe that's the formula.
I agree it wasn't particularly difficult (the majority of posters here got all or almost all of them), but the really difficult tests don't seem to published on-line.
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Old 04-20-16, 07:02 PM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by mmarshall
Well, of course, liquid-cooled, front-engined, FWD beetles (essentially VW Golf/Jettas with a different body/interior) have been produced since 1997. But the original air-cooled, rear-engined RWD Beetles were produced in the 1930s......it was actually first designed in **** Germany, under Hitler's orders, as a cheap ubiquitous car for the German public. It was produced up to the late 1970s for the U.S. market, and in Mexico until 2003.
Designed by some guy named Ferdinand Porsche, I wonder what he did after the war?
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Old 04-20-16, 07:43 PM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by Byprodrive
Designed by some guy named Ferdinand Porsche, I wonder what he did after the war?
Though it is not particularly well-known except among auto-historians, Dr. Porsche actually used an earlier Czech vehicle-design called the Tatra as a reference for the first VW Beetle. The Tatra was also rear-engined, air-cooled, with a swing-axle.



Dr. Porsche died in 1951, so he wasn't really around that long after the war. He was spared what probably would have been great sorrow for him to see the famous young actor James Dean get killed in a Porsche Speedster. In 1955, a Ford sedan pulled out right of an intersection in front of him, and Dean couldn't stop in time, even with the Porsche's good (for the time) brakes That, of course, was before the era of seat belts for most street cars.
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