greg3852

Saw this in person tonight for the first time. I have to say I really liked it. I find it to be a very classy looking car, and the interior is not much smaller than my LS. It really impressed me. I may look into one of these used in a year or two.

coolsaber

The cabin in this, and more so in the XC90 are stunning. However the reliability of the tech, and more so SW updates is just **** poor when comparing it to a Lexus. So if your picking these up used, be open to more then just an oil change every so often

LexBob2

Nice looking, understated with good presence.

greg3852

Wow. Just did some reading about their reliability, and i am frightened. There are some horror stories out there.

Vladi

Every manufacturer is in hurry to introduce another cool technology to follow with the consumer tech boom and every time they do that they expose themselves as dinosaurs they truly are. All that technology needs a proper driver to hold it all together and that is the software. Software at this point was a fraction of budget because it was all low level coding and it was defragmented. None of the major manufacturers today have enough funds to do proper software development because it will blow out their budget. So glitches and bugs and car thefts will be just some of the growing pains for years to come.

All of them have three options right now: develop in-house with what you have, outsource to cheap labor (Audi) or stay away from complex stuff altogether (Toyota)
Tesla is the only manufacturer that has proper software development and proper business plan that incorporated that development into pipeline and not as an afterthought.

Share your key Volvo wants you to have is a security joke, same goes for MB and their unlock with your smart phone! It's a marketing PR to ride on the wave of booming tech. Your phone's device connectivity hardware can be compromised a lot easier than your standard key remote which in some instance has proper hardware security which also can be overridden. Bluetooth is not meant for things like this, at least not right now.

Sulu

As a safety-critical electronics systems engineer, the problem as I see it is that the thought that software is easy to do is still too widespread. Like driving a 4WD or AWD vehicle, developing software when you do not know what you are doing is an easy way to get yourself deeper (and perhaps dead) in the ditch. Software, especially critical software, has to be developed and managed by trained and experienced professionals.

I do not know what or to whom Audi is subcontracting their work out to, but without knowing more information, I would say that is the right thing to do, which is to have the professionals do it right for you, the first time.

To me, Toyota and Tesla are approaching this from opposite ends. Toyota is taking their usual, cautious, dot all "I"s and cross all "T"s approach, to make sure their product, when released, is reliable. Tesla, on the other hand, seems to be following the commercial software approach, which is the "Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead" mentality of getting to market first; this approach must not be allowed when it comes to safety-critical systems.

coolsaber

I agree of your market assessment. However I also have to give Tesla credit for being a HUGE Market driver. If they had not showed up with autopilot, the urgency to develop or announce what the timetable is on on going projects were.
To a huge degree the approach Tesla is taking is largely dangerous and opens the door to inexperienced, unassuming drivers who read and understand marketing material better then the safety statements and manuals for the autopilot system. This poses a significant risk to the current driver base of Teslas and of course others on the road. But at the same time, this huge gamble is necessary for a business/corporation to push the slow paced industry into the next generation.

Calculated risk sucks. But I guess for Tesla, the risk is more then enough for them to cement a podium in history.

RXSF

I think the rear end is a missed opportunity. I really like the rest of the vehicle

Vladi

http://www.rt-rk.com/

These guys have been contracted by Audi to work on the front end and maybe more. They have setup special team of brute code force to work on the project. I am not aware where the visual design comes from and I doubt they do it cause they are pretty bad at it but who knows. Average salary over there is $3/h but I suppose some seniors that lead the project get around $11/h

UDel

Small complicated over stressed 4 cyl in a fuller sized heavy euro luxury car with questionable to poor reliability, no thanks, sounds like a potential nightmare to own past warranty, doubt that engine will last very long all just to get a little better fuel economy. It should have a 6 cylinder.

RXSF

for that price, id have a hard time not choosing anything german over this.

Vladi

Stressed performance four banger with top notch reliability can be done as every Evo proves it, but to expect refinement and great fuel economy out of it is something that is very unrealistic no matter what specs say. Either its going to get loose and start sipping a lot more fuel or its going to just break apart

But maybe Volvo just pulled it off this time.

coolsaber

Thats the myth, as this drivetrains been pretty solid mechanical wise in their older cars. Mechanically the only issue reported is oil burning for some cars. Noise is ****ty tho. You can tell your driving a 4 banger, but the power is plenty

However the drivetrain is not the issue at all. The software and body, onboard modules, coupled with understaffed and undertrained dealer staff are the Achilles heels on these models.
Numerous sunroof leaks at launch, coupled with Software that was far from finished, or written about in the manuals, but then never got to production.

If you are in the market for a Volvo purchase it in its 2nd MY. I think in a couple of years their operation will be much more smoother, but until then pass

LexBob2

Reliabilty concerns apparantly haven't effected sales of the XC90. Maybe buyers feel as long as they are under factory warranty they don't mind.

UDel

This new generation turbo/super charged 4 cyl engine and hybrid/turbo/super charged 4 cyl has not been in production long enough to determine long term reliability. Reliability data is not encouraging of the vehicles it is in and reviews say the powerplant is a bit harsh and unrefined and disappointing which is expected when you put such a small over stressed engine in larger heavier vehicles, it should have a 6 or 8 cylinder to make 300 or 400hp in these types of vehicles.