spwolf

who knows... maybe there will be new generation small car diesels in few years.... they just released new truck diesels and "new" 1.4 D-4D... I would assume that we will get new 2.0d within 2 years.

RNM GS3

To have a brand new engine thats not compatible with AWD is embarrassing to say the least, not to mention highly inefficient.

I'm all for more engines but not ones that offer the same power and same fuel economy with no real difference than one being for RWD and the other AWD.
Bring back the ISF, IS hybrid etc - that would make more sense.....

3series sales worldwide can allow them to have 100 engines if they want.
IS and RC are low volume models by comparison.

RNM GS3

LOL

Ok so the turbo engines for M3, M5, M6, C63, E63, S63, S550, S600, S65, etc are all outsourced huh...
Well then maybe Lexus should get this amazing supplier bec they got Nothing that can compete with the engines of the models above.

Mr. Burns

Toyota/Lexus initially did not believe in FI, perhaps they misgauged it as a trend and are now getting (reluctantly) swept up in it as the industry marches more confidently in that direction.

Furthermore a Lexus is not a BMW, it has to adhere to certain parameters. A BMW or Audi can get away with oil consumption at the level of one quart every 600-700 miles on a brand new englne, it can get away with batteries that are woefully underengineered for the engine (some of the engines you mentioned above), resulting in manufacturer recommended replacements every oil change period due to underlying engineering flaws, it can get away with sounding like a milk truck at idle. It can get away with consistently below average dependability ratings.

A Lexus can't.

So in addition to being just powerful and efficient, any Lexus turbo will need to be very refined in terms of NVH and very durable - more than any other similar engine in its class. These are the difficult bits of engineering, others can skimp on it to march faster towards more power and variety, but Lexus can't.

Mr Bond

Well lets see about that, there are very few 2.0t out there so far, so let´s wait a year or two. We are seeing ( potential huge ) trouble with fuel pumps and some rear wing failures on the RC-F , typical BMW problems Just read in the RC-F fourm. The difference here is that BMW uses this kind of "hi-tec" technology on a regular car, and not a top end car that sells about 1000 units a year. And thats the real world diffenrence in terms of statistics, Lexus will never suffer in JD powers or other consumer reports for 1000 crappy fuelpumps , but if there was 1 000 000 units they would !

Diesel350

Yes REALLY they are outsourced!!

http://www.caranddriver.com/news/201...-and-info-news


Also look up Borg Warner who also develops turbochargers for the 3 and 5 series and many of the Mercedes AMG models.

And why should Lexus outsource their turbo's like it's German counterparts? So that they can consume and leak oil like crazy? Sure Lexus can't compete with Mercedes and BMW engines but who wants to fork out $12k to fix leaking oil from their turbos like my neighbor had to do.

spwolf

Toyota also outsourced turbos for previous turbo diesels, but new ones have all in-house built technology, including turbos.

Vladi

BMW loves Mitsu's turbos,so does VW.

First gen BMW turbos were all Mitsubishi, then they made their own but retained Mitsu turbos for high spec engines.

Its also very well known fact that quad turbo setup in Bugatti is all Mitsu as well

Mr Bond

Apparently many others as well

Currently, amongst others BMW, FIAT, FORD, GM, ISUZU, IVECO, PORSCHE, PSA, RENAULT, SAAB, VOLVO and VOLKSWAGEN are using MHI turbocharger technology.

http://www.mtee.eu/products/turbocharger/oem-sales

But honestly, I dont see the problem here. It makes no sense at all to spend millions to develop an already existing product. There is no need to reinvent the wheel. Just like all 8 speed gearboxes in BMW and many others are ZF Friedrichshafen.

spwolf

there is nothing wrong with using off the shelf parts... it is still better if you can research something your competitors dont have and beat them.

spwolf

Interesting fact, according to Lexus UK specs, IS200t weight will start at 1590kg... thats 121lbs lighter than IS250 in the UK. Also between 180kg-270 kg (400-600lbs) lighter than NX 2.0t AWD. It is hard to figure exactly since in each country there is slightly different number.

So, IS 2.0t should be pretty quick, more than what official numbers in Europe suggest.

Hoovey689

iTrader: (16)

Agreed, should be pretty punchy

JDR76

That's interesting. The European press release quoted 1590 kg (3505lbs). The US Lexus site quotes the RWD IS250 at 3461 lbs (1570 kg), meaning the IS200t is actually 44 lbs heavier than the IS250 it replaces, which seems odd to me. Not sure about transmission weights, but from what I can find online, the 2.0t engine weighs 14 pounds less than the 2.5l V6 (352lbs vs 366lbs).

The UK Lexus site states that the IS250 starts at 1555 kg (3428 lbs), or 77 lbs lighter than the IS200t.

Sulu

That's what I was thinking. Toyota just released new truck diesels; it would not be that costly to adapt them for cars (if they wanted to do that).

And there is so much talk about how Toyota now has access to Mazda's SkyActiv Diesel from their recent agreement. Personally, I don't think Toyota needs any Mazda engine technology but the auto bloggers sure think so.

Sulu

No, there is no problem going with off-the-shelf parts, if there is something available out there that you need.

But by developing key components (such as transmissions) together with a preferred supplier (and in Toyota's case, there is nothing more preferred than a supplier within its own family of suppliers, such as Aisin) or even building it yourself (such as a turbocharger on an engine especially designed as a turbocharged engine), you get exactly what you want and what you need, especially when it comes to quality.

One of the Americans who helped build up Japanese industry in the post-war years supported a quality management principle that manufacturers should work closely with their suppliers in order to design and build products that met the manufacturer's needs, including and especially quality. Toyota has taken that principle to heart and they are now known as an auto manufacturer that works closely with their suppliers to develop products that Toyota needs, at the levels of quality that Toyota wants.