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Old 05-30-15, 02:57 PM
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mmarshall
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Default MM Full-Review: 2015 Jeep Renegade

By request, a Review of the all-new 2015 Jeep Renegade.

http://www.jeep.com/en/renegade/#mod...egory=standard

IN A NUTSHELL: Cute mini-Jeep styling, but I'm not impressed with some of the materials and build-quality.

CLOSEST AMERICAN-MARKET COMPETITORS: Fiat 500X (soon to be released), Mini Countryman, Nissan Juke

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OVERVIEW:

Most people know that the original Jeep (which came from the letters GP, which stood for General-Purpose) vehicle was originally developed for the U.S. Military in 1941 as a simple, reliable, go-anywhere/anytime vehicle that would also be resistant to battle-damage. It was built by the Ford, ******, and Bantam companies, and became a civilian icon after the war. The British were so impressed with it that, after the war, in 1948, they took the original running-chassis/drivetrain, altered the body and interior, and renamed it the Land Rover....and, of course, for that vehicle, the rest is history, too.

For decades, Jeep products, first under ******/Bantam ownership, then Kaiser, then AMC, then AMC//Renault, then Chrysler, then Daimler (Mercedes)/Chrysler, and now, Fiat/Chrysler, concentrated mostly on niche-market vehicles that were legendary off-road, in the boonies, but were rather crude, uncomfortable, and, in some cases, unreliable on regular pavement. By the 1960s, though, the once-niche market had grown enough to spawn several Big Three competitors......the Ford Bronco, Chevy Blazer, and, a few years later, the Dodge Ramcharger/PlymouthTrail Duster....plus the International Scout. A few attempts at doing nice comfortable family-oriented versions, like the Jeep Wagoneer, were done, but they were not particularly popular outside of Snow-Belt areas. A Jeep pickup truck was briefly marketed, but proved unsuccessful. Later, of course, came the wildly successful Cherokee, Grand Cherokee, and slightly less-successful Liberty models. By then, though, although the off-road Jeep Wrangler still remained popular, the basic market for SUVs had changed from off-roading to Soccer-Mom, all-weather machines for shopping and commuting. In addition, the rise of car-based unibody vehicles that sported full-time AWD with center differentials (originally pioneered by AMC, Subaru, and Audi) was proving to be serious competition for Jeep.

So, as the old saying goes........if you can't beat 'Em, join 'Em. Jeep decided not only to produce classic off-road vehicles, but car-based AWD (and even FWD) models as well to try and cater to the expanding suburban market and get more customers. Indeed, the FWD Jeep Compass, which had the classic Jeep grille/headlights, had little else of Jeep origin....it was essentially a redone FWD Dodge Caliber (a very unimpressive and cheaply-done compact car), with a different body and interior. Not surprisingly, the Compass was not very highly rated by the automotive press or Consumer Reports (and I myself was also very unimpressed with it), even after some slight interior upgrades. A variation of the Compass (the Jeep Patriot), which used the same basic platform but was a little more rugged, had classic Jeep squared-off styling, and an off-road-rated version, was also marketed, with a little more success.

Now, under Fiat ownership, Jeep is again trying to market a small, partly car-based model......the Renegade, although the Compass and Patriot still remain in production. The Renegade is quite small by Jeep standards...noticeably smaller than any other American-market Jeep model, though the wider 2-door Wrangler seems roughly about the same length, depending on accessories. The Renegade, which has already been released at U.S.-market Jeep dealerships, uses the same platform, drivetrains, and much of the chassis of the FWD/AWD Fiat 500X, which has not yet been released in the U.S. as I write this...a late June launch is scheduled (I plan to look at a 500X, but may or may not do a full-review). However, the Renegade's body and interior are markedly different from the Fiat's, as the Renegade is an attempt to market to both those who want a traditional small Jeep (with Jeep styling) and and/or small suburban wagon/commuter in one package. The 500X would not fill that role, as it is obviously being primarily marketed to a different type of buyer altogether.

For 2015, the Renegade comes in four model/trim versions.......Sport, Latitude, Trailhawk, and Limited. The Trailhawk comes only with 4WD...the other three offer a choice of FWD or 4WD. Sport and Latitide models come with a choice of two Fiat-supplied engines...a 1.4L Turbo MultiAir in-line four (requiring Premium gas) of 160 HP and 184 ft-lbs. of torque, and a 2.4L normally-aspirated MultiAir "Tigershark" in-line four of 180 HP and 175 HP...so you see that, despite the size difference, there is very little power difference between the two engines, though the larger 2.4L obviously doesn't have to work as hard or is as highly stressed. Trailhawk and Limited models come with the 2.4L standard.

(And, if Fiat can do a 1.4L turbo with these kind of power figures, why does the same-sized GM 1.4L turbo used in the larger Chevy Trax / Buick Encore have only 138 HP and 148 ft-lbs. of torque? Only reason I can think of is that the Fiat Jeep 1.4L uses premium gas, but fuel alone wouldn't make that much of a difference).

Sport and Latitude models come with a choice of a 6-speed manual transmission or a nine (yes, that's right....NINE speed automatic)...talk about overkill. Trailhawk and Limited models come only with the automatic. The Trailhawk, as the name suggests, is the only version certified for roughing it out in the Boonies like a traditional off-road Jeep (a Trail-Rated badge on the front fenders proudly displays that). So, of course, it comes with number of off-road features missing on the other models.....underbody skid-plates, tow hooks, higher ground clearance sharper approach/breakover/descent angles, Hill-Descent-Control, fuel-tank-protectors, and more. The other Renegade models, though able to do some mild off-roading, are not certified for the harder-core stuff....and are essentially just Fiat 500X models with a different body and interior. Base prices rum from $19,995 to $26,795 depending on model and configuration. Jeep, of course, seems to be doing this same type of marketing on most of its U. S.-market vehicles now....offering a TrailHawk/Trail-Rated version for the hard-core traditional Jeep enthusiasts, and milder versions for those who simply want a Soccer-Mom or commuter SUV for paved roads and occasionally need to go through bad weather and snowstorms. Of course, if you REALLY want the ultimate in hard-core certification, Jeep will gladly sell you a Rubicon version of the ubiquitous Wrangler, whose commando-grade suspension and underpinnings will pound your kidneys like a hammer over bumps, but get you through just about anything imaginable off-road short of a major flood.

For the general review, I looked at and checked out several different interiors, but, for the actual test-drive, picked a bright Look-at-Me Solar Yellow Latitude 4X4 with the 2.4L engine and 9-speed automatic....no other options. Color maybe excepted, I figured that is the model a number of buyers would choose, unless they wanted to rough it out ft-road with the Trailhawk. It listed for $25,690. Chrysler/Jeep dealers in my area, especially the larger dealerships, seem to have a good supply in stock as I write this, so you generally have at least some choice if you go shopping.


MODEL REVIEWED: 2015 Jeep Renegade Latitude 4X4

BASE PRICE: $23,295


OPTIONS:

2.4L Engine (includes the automatic transmission): $1400


DESTINATION/FREIGHT: $995 (slightly too much, IMO, for a vehicle this size)

LIST PRICE AS REVIEWED: $25,690


DRIVETRAIN: 4WD with Locking differential, Transversely-mounted 2.4L in-line four, 180 HP, Torque 175 Ft-lbs. (Jeep apparently doesn't list the RPM power-peaks), 9-speed Sport-Shift automatic.


EPA MILEAGE RATING: 21 City, 29 Highway, 24 Combined



EXTERIOR COLOR: Solar Yellow (this is actually more of a Chrome Yellow)

INTERIOR: Black cloth




PLUSSES:


Decent handling by Jeep standards, primarily from the small size.

2.4L four reasonably refined.

Small exterior size easy to maneuver and park at close quarters.

Flexible, adjustable 4WD system for both pavement and off-road.

Extremely flexible nine-speed automatic transmission (might even be overkill).

Square, shoe-box design means good interior space efficiency and good outward visibility.

Good-sized cargo for the small exterior size.

Decently-finished cargo area.

Good ground clearance with high approach/breakover/departure angles.

Classic Jeep styling for those so inclined.

Some nice paint colors, with a fairly wide choice.

Nicely done steering wheel.




MINUSES:

(Inconsistant)? quality control at the assembly plant.

Base 1.4L Turbo requires premium gas.

Smooth but cheaply done paint jobs.

Tinny-sounding doors when closing.

Cheap-looking flat black plastic exterior trim.

Hard, flat, uncomfortable seats.

(Mostly) cheap-quality interior switches/hardware.

Hard, cheap sun visors.

Cheap-looking interior painted silver interior door handles and gauge-faces.

Poor-quality interior trim (except for the dash-padding and steering wheel).

Poorly-placed brake pedal for large feet.

Electronic pull-tab parking brake not compatible with manual transmissions.




EXTERIOR:

Score one for the Jeep Enthusiasts here. There is no question of the Renegade, looks-wise, being part of the Jeep family. It is probably the most pure-looking Jeep next to the Wrangler itself....though the Patriot is also close. The other Jeeps all have the same slotted-grille design (a long Jeep tradition), but their headlight shapes vary from round to square, or even tiny-slot (which, IMO, makes the latest Cherokee's front end look like an insect). So, it you want a Jeep that LOOKS like a Jeep, is sized small like the original ones, and cost less than the Wrangler, then the Renegade may fit the bill. There are also some good features on the exterior, like a very wide, thick strip of black-cladding that runs around the whole base of the vehicle ad wheel-wells, protecting the lower-body from damage. The nice compact (even sub-compact)? exterior size also means relatively easy maneuvering and parking at close quarters.....which can also be a help when going off-road into small narrow areas. And, on some versions, the twin side-mirror housings have side-marker turn signals. The squared-off body shape means relatively good interior space efficiency and outward visibility, despite the fairly large D-pillars.

But, however, sharp looks or exterior styling does not necessarily mean solidness or good quality, either in the skin itself or what's under it. And, to me at least, it's obvious that this vehicle, unlike the much more substantial Cherokee and Grand Cherokee, was clearly built to a low budget. The exterior sheet metal is quite thin, and the doors all close with a tinny, lightweight flimsy sound. Aluminum is used for the hood, but it still feels very flimsy....more on that below. The paint colors cover a wide choice, but some of the brightest colors (bright yellow and bright orange) are not available on some versions. There is a so-called "Commando Green" for for Jeep enthusiasts, but it is a dull, somewhat ugly-looking light greenish-brown.......nothing like the traditional military olive-green. The paint jobs themselves are smooth, without orange-peel, but otherwise look rather cheaply-done, with no metallic, pearl, or mica effect to them....just base color. At least Jeep doesn't charge extra for some Renegade colors some like other manufacturers do...even its sister Dodge and Chrysler divisions. I wasn't impressed with the cheap-looking/feeling flat-black exterior trim. Nor was I impressed with the way the twin outside mirror-housings snap/swivel and lock....they lacked the smooth/slick feel that some other vehicles had. So, all in all, a Jeep-like, but clearly cost-cutting exterior.



UNDERHOOD:

Open the very thin lightweight aluminum hood (aluminum, of course, is not a cheap material, but the hood feels almost as thin as a soda can), and it is held up with a (not surprising) manual prop-rod. At least there is an underhood insulation pad to absorb some of the noise and vibration. The available transversely-mounted engines generally fit in well, with room to spare. On the 2.4L MultiAir 4, a large black plastic engine cover blocks a lot of the top engine access. The filler caps, fluid reservoirs, and dipsticks are easily accessible, but the battery, on the right and towards the back, is only partly exposed, and the terminals are not easily reached.



INTERIOR:

With a couple of minor exceptions, the loose and El Cheapo feel of the exterior also extends inside as well. The steering wheel is nicely done with solid materials, and the padded dashboard surface (it feels like rubber) is decent. The climate-control ***** and AWD adjustment *****, under the center-dash, have a fairly substantial feel and nice chrome rings. The radio knocks also feel and operate fairly solid. Otherwise, IMO, the rest of the interior was built to a low-budget, just like the exterior. Starting up top, the sun visors are thick, hard plastic and feel loosely-attached in their snap-holders. The headliner, likewise, is not hard but uses a very thin whitish fabric. The primary gauges are well-designed and easy to read from a graphic point of view, but the gauge-housings (and the interior door handles) are done in a super-cheap-looking matte-silver paint. The fabric-covered seats (leather is available on Trailhawk and Limited versions) feel as hard and uncomfortable as a park bench (the Ford Escape's fabric rear seats have the same problem, only they are a little wider). The front seats, IMO, are a little better but, for me, still somewhat uncomfortable, and lack side support. The power-mirror and power-window switches look and feel like something even WalMarts wouldn't sell. Much of the hardware has a similar cheap look or feel to it. The lid itself on the glove box feels fairly solid, but has a very flimsy latch that seems to barely hold it closed. The two-tone interiors, to me, look a little nicer overall than the monotone-black, but most of the interior trim, regardless of color, seems to have a cheap and loosely-fitted look and feel. The stereo had a decent sound quality, but you couldn't consider it a killer.

Two other things about the interior also need to be noted here. First, given the fact that a number of Renegade owners, especially with the off-road Trailhawk version, are likely to get their interiors quite dirty or muddy (like with Wranglers), perhaps that is one reason why Jeep didn't use nicer materials inside. Second, on the yellow Renegade I actually test-drove, the Latitude-grade interior on that particular vehicle, overall, for some reason, seemed tighter-assembled, with fewer loose-feeling parts, than some of the other Renegade interiors I looked at. But, at the same time, it had what appeared to be a partially-defective switch (or motor) for the left-side mirror, so it was very difficult to get the mirror just where I wanted it. And the overhead mirror in the center of the windshield wouldn't stay manually-adjusted where I set it....it kept tilting down. This, to me at least, suggests inconsistent quality-control, either in the Renegade's plant and/or with some of Jeep's suppliers.



CARGO COMPARTMENT/TRUNK:

Raise the rear hatch, and the cargo compartment, considering the small exterior size, is quite roomy.....that's what traditional square body-styling gives you. It is also decently-finished, or at least, compared to the rest of the interior, better than I expected. The split-rear seats, of course, fold down to form a fairly flat extended-floor for added cargo. Somewhat thin but still nice-grade black carpeting covers the floor...it feels surprisingly plush considering its thinness. The side walls are covered in black plastic, have speaker-grilles for the stereo, and also have plastic cargo-hooks on them. On the floor are two durable real real metal cargo-loops with a real chrome finish...not plastic. There is no standard cargo-cover to hide valuables in back from prying eyes.....either use a blanket to cover it, or you can (probably) get a cover as a dealer accessory, though I didn't see one specifically listed on the web-site. Under the floor is a dark gray styrofoam multi-compartment tray for carrying number of small items. Underneath the tray, Sport, Latitude, and Limited models have a Fix-a-Flat bottle as standard, with a temporary spare as optional. Latitude and Limited models also have the option of a real spare tire/wheel. Only the Trailhawk model, IMO, does it correctly....with a real spare tire/wheel standard.


ON THE ROAD:

Start up the 2.4L in-line four with a conventional ignition key and side-column ignition switch, and the engine fires to life and idles fairly smoothly and quietly, with a fair amount of refinement. On the road, it remains fairly smooth and refined, and the power level is adequate for most normal driving (I didn't test it off-road, of course). The noise level from both the engine and exhaust is rather low unless you push it (and, of course, I don't take brand-new engines over 4000 RPM). The 9-speed automatic, of course, is quite flexible (perhaps even overkill) but much of the flexibility is actually built in at higher speeds rather than in stop and go driving, where it doesn't behave much differently than a typical 6-speed automatic. Shifts are generally smooth, but not always seamless....the transmission, despite its flexibility, doesn't feel totally synchronized with the engine sometimes. The 4WD system in my test car had a Lock mode for the differential for tough slippery conditions. Trailhawk models have a multi-adjustable system for various terrain conditions, and a Hill-Descent Control...that system is an option on other models.

Handling is OK for a compact-size Jeep. The overall steering response is not particularly quick, and almost totally lacks road feel, but body roll is kept in check considering the high center of gravity, and the small exterior size allows easy maneuverability and parking in tight spaces. Ride comfort is reasonably good considering its size and short wheelbase, but there are some small proposing motions here and there. Wind noise is fairly effectively sealed, but the tires produce noticeable road noise...probably because of a combination or their limited off-road capability and a cost-cutting lack of insulation in the wheel-wells. The brakes are generally effective, but the brake pedal is small, high, and placed closed to the gas pedal, so my big circus-clown, Men's-size-15 right shoe gets caught on the tip of brake pedal when shifting from the gas pedal to rake.....it requires a little care.



THE VERDICT:

OK....perhaps I've been a little hard on this little Cute-Ute......I did pan it in several places, more so than in some other reviews I've done. But that doesn't necessarily mean that I've been unfair. An auto reviewer has to be objective, and I honestly feel that, considering the other excellent Jeep redesigns we've seen recently in the Cherokee and Grand Cherokee since Fiat took over, Jeep could have done better on this one. The Renegade was obviously done to a strict budget, and, of course, unlike other Jeeps, had to be designed in conjunction with Fiat and its upcoming 500X. Yes, it sells for a fairly low price...even top-line Limited models start out around 27K. But, I've seen other vehicles, roughly in the same price range, come from the factory with substantially nicer materials inside and out, and with better, more consistent quality control. But that doesn't mean that the Renegade is not worth considering. It can be parked and maneuvered in tight places, offers all-weather capability, is space-efficient, has good outward visibility (which IMO is a good safety feature), gets reasonably good mileage for an AWD Jeep (though it's not an economy car by any means), has a nice paint-color choice, and will probably offer a big line of factory and aftermarket accessories.

And, as always......Happy car-shopping.

MM

Last edited by mmarshall; 05-30-15 at 04:35 PM.
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Old 05-30-15, 04:00 PM
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Hoovey689
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Nice review. Overall a decent and when equipped, competent package especially for its segment.
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Old 05-30-15, 04:08 PM
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mmarshall
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Originally Posted by Hoovey2411
Nice review.
Thanks.

Overall a decent and when equipped, competent package especially for its segment.
Decent, yes, and fairly competent, but, even with some expensive features like the 9-speed automatic and aluminum hood, you can still tell it was designed and built to a strict budget.
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Old 05-30-15, 04:18 PM
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Originally Posted by mmarshall
Thanks.



Decent, yes, and fairly competent, but, even with some expensive features like the 9-speed automatic and aluminum hood, you can still tell it was designed and built to a strict budget.
Sure thing, though if my options are the 500X, Countyman, Juke and Renegade, you'd still likely find me at the Jeep dealer
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Old 05-30-15, 04:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Hoovey2411
Sure thing, though if my options are the 500X, Countyman, Juke and Renegade, you'd still likely find me at the Jeep dealer
Although I can't comment on the 500X because it isn't out yet and i haven't seen or reviewed it, I basically share your thoughts on the other two. Style-wise, I wouldn't be caught dead in a Juke as a daily driver (though I did review one several years ago), and the Mini is too quirky, stiff-riding, and too shoddily-built....it has had reliability problems for years.
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Old 05-31-15, 01:23 AM
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Nicely written out and very informative. I'd conclude if other makers can produce entry level vehicles that appear to be well assembled, so could Jeep. Basically, it is indeed possible to pull off.
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Old 05-31-15, 02:31 AM
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For the same price you can get a much roomier and IMO way better built Rav4. I think my sister paid $23,000 for a base model Rav4 in 2013, it was the "new" model and had such standard features as the touch screen audio, bluetooth, backup camera, the screen syncs with your ipod, tan cloth interior, rubber floor mats, decent looking wheels(they are steelies but have decent looking 5 spoke wheel covers that actually look like alloy wheels).
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Old 05-31-15, 03:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Fizzboy7
Nicely written out and very informative.
Thanks. I like to basically stick to a regular format-type and layout for the Full-Reviews, though I vary the text as necessary to fully describe the vehicle and its history, and write in my own style. On Partial or Condended-Reviews, I sometimes vary the format and its layout more.

I'd conclude if other makers can produce entry level vehicles that appear to be well assembled, so could Jeep. Basically, it is indeed possible to pull off.
I've also seen some assembly-goofs on modern BMWs.......vehicles that cost considerably more than a Renegade. The last M3 I test-drove, for example, at more than 60K, had two rather serious ones.
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Old 05-31-15, 03:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Aron9000
For the same price you can get a much roomier and IMO way better built Rav4. I think my sister paid $23,000 for a base model Rav4 in 2013, it was the "new" model and had such standard features as the touch screen audio, bluetooth, backup camera, the screen syncs with your ipod, tan cloth interior, rubber floor mats, decent looking wheels(they are steelies but have decent looking 5 spoke wheel covers that actually look like alloy wheels).
No question the RAV-4 is more solidly-built...I'd probably go with it too, under most circumstances, though the Renegade's toy-car maneuverability comes in handy in tight spaces, outward visibility is better, it's probably more capable off-road even without the Trailhawk version, and you can get it in some bright, rainbow, Look-at-Me colors that aren't available on the RAV-4. I say "probably" because I did not actually sample it off road.
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Old 05-31-15, 11:21 AM
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While it's a total loss for real off-roading, thanks to the massive lack of torque and a few features like the electronic "hand" brake, the Renegade is probably right for its market segment: a grocery-getter with country-club pretensions - so long as you park in the staff lot. I applaud the default to an automatic transmission for off-road use - that's a little known secret among offroaders that it's the way to get power to the ground efficiently, allowing the vehicle to slowly walk away from the big dogs spewing roostertails of dirt and rocks - with a terminal inability to get the tires to hook up. Still, I can't understand how ANY Renegade could be opted up to win the coveted Jeep "Trail-Rated" badge, but maybe that was an oversight.

It has to be more competent than it's competitors, the Countryman and the Fiat 500X, that's pretty much a given in the segment. The Joke - er, Juke, loses points simply on style. regardless of capability, thus the Renegade wins by default. We'll see how well it holds up at the low end of the market - at least it's going to be a LOT more comfortable than a Wrangler on the road - and a good deal less money too. Just don't point it off road and into the boonies . . . it could get embarrassing.
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Old 05-31-15, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Lil4X
While it's a total loss for real off-roading, thanks to the massive lack of torque
Yes, the engine is only 2.4L, but it is also a small and fairly light vehicle, so there seems to be an adequate amount of power. Keep in mind that the original WWII Jeeps, which went anywhere, even under battle conditions, had only some 70 HP and 85 ft-lbs. of torque. Much of the off-road power in Jeeps comes not from large engines, but from low-range gearing and differentials. Do it correctly, and a small four-cylinder can practically pull out stumps. (The Trailhawk version does have an electronically-activated Low Range transfer-case)


and a few features like the electronic "hand" brake, the Renegade is probably right for its market segment: a grocery-getter with country-club pretensions - so long as you park in the staff lot. I applaud the default to an automatic transmission for off-road use - that's a little known secret among offroaders that it's the way to get power to the ground efficiently, allowing the vehicle to slowly walk away from the big dogs spewing roostertails of dirt and rocks - with a terminal inability to get the tires to hook up. Still, I can't understand how ANY Renegade could be opted up to win the coveted Jeep "Trail-Rated" badge, but maybe that was an oversight.
A Hill-Start-Assist feature is standard on all Renegade models, with Hill-Descent-Control on the Trailhawk. I agree that an automatic is better in some ways off-road...with a torque converter, you usually get smooth power delivery unless you slip the heck out of the clutch pedal and eat up the clutch-linings.

The Renegade, BTW, is not the only small FWD/car-based Jeep product to get a Trail-Rated badge for one of its versions. The similiarly-styled but slightly larger Patriot, derived from the old Dodge Caliber, also has one. The Compass, however, does not...it is clearly a FWD compact car, and makes no bones about it.

pretty much a given in the segment. The Joke - er, Juke, loses points simply on style. regardless of capability, thus the Renegade wins by default. We'll see how well it holds up at the low end of the market - at least it's going to be a LOT more comfortable than a Wrangler on the road - and a good deal less money too. Just don't point it off road and into the boonies . . . it could get embarrassing.
The Countryman and 500X, though, aren't going to have Trail-Rated versions. They are, as you note, essentially soccer-mom grocery-getters for bad weather. Even a lot of soccer-moms, though, stay away from the Juke.....it's just too weirdly styled.

Last edited by mmarshall; 05-31-15 at 01:25 PM.
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Old 06-01-15, 09:41 AM
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The original ****** Jeep ("MB" built by ******-Overland during WWII) was a truly minimalist vehicle. Weighing in at about 2400 lbs and sporting the ****** proprietary Go-Devil 4cyl engine that checked in with 45 (later 55) hp and 107 lb-ft of torque - out of 134 CID or about 2.2 liters. That's pretty massive torque behind a ton and a quarter vehicle - and that was the secret of its success. But on a paved surface, that was it's Achilles heel.

I've had a chance to drive a restored '44 Jeep on the flight line down at the Lone Star Flight Museum in Galveston, and it's a real pain for guys who shop in the Big and Tall department. The thing was designed for someone about 5'6" and 120 pounds. Mike, you and I just don't fit. Once you do lever yourself in, it's like of like driving a very cramped tractor - viewing the world almost from between your kneecaps. Although claimed to be capable of 65 mph, I'd think that's out of reach for all but the bravest drivers. I ran out of guts long before I ran out of throttle. 45 is plenty fast for me, considering the buckboard springs, high CG, and very direct steering.

As if the handling weren't enough to caution you from executing death-defying maneuvers with your MB Jeep, the fuel tank was located directly under the driver's seat, assuring you a butt-flambé - if not a full human torch - should you survive the initial impact.

Last edited by Lil4X; 06-01-15 at 09:48 AM.
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Old 06-01-15, 11:44 AM
  #13  
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Originally Posted by Lil4X
The original ****** Jeep ("MB" built by ******-Overland during WWII) was a truly minimalist vehicle. Weighing in at about 2400 lbs and sporting the ****** proprietary Go-Devil 4cyl engine that checked in with 45 (later 55) hp and 107 lb-ft of torque - out of 134 CID or about 2.2 liters. That's pretty massive torque behind a ton and a quarter vehicle -
Still, a lot of it was in the short gearing, wasn't it? That was one reason why it only had a 65 MPH top speed......by then, even in high gear, the engine was running out of RPMs.

I've had a chance to drive a restored '44 Jeep on the flight line down at the Lone Star Flight Museum in Galveston, and it's a real pain for guys who shop in the Big and Tall department. The thing was designed for someone about 5'6" and 120 pounds. Mike, you and I just don't fit. Once you do lever yourself in, it's like of like driving a very cramped tractor - viewing the world almost from between your kneecaps.
Still, that must have been fun. I've heard a lot of good things about that museum...but have never actually gotten there myself.

As far as fitting into small cars, at 6' 2" and 280 lbs., I managed to shoehorn myself into a Lotus Elise for a full-review (and, years ago, an MG Midget) and drive them, even with a clutch pedal. Believe me, if you can get into an Elise, you can get into just about anything. You point, though, is well taken.......physically getting into and out of a vehicle is one thing; but doing it easily and comfortably is sometimes another matter.


As if the handling weren't enough to caution you from executing death-defying maneuvers with your MB Jeep, the fuel tank was located directly under the driver's seat, assuring you a butt-flambé - if not a full human torch - should you survive the initial impact.
I think, on some versions intended for use in battle areas, some attempt was made to add a layer of light armor around the body to protect the fuel tank, gasoline Jerry-Cans, and any light ammo the Jeep was carrying from enemy fire, but, of course, that added weight and cut down on both speed and payload.
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Old 06-01-15, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Lil4X

It has to be more competent than it's competitors, the Countryman and the Fiat 500X, that's pretty much a given in the segment. The Joke - er, Juke, loses points simply on style. regardless of capability, thus the Renegade wins by default.
I have a Countryman, so I can provide this insight. This thing is fun as all hell to drive. I'll be surprised if the Renegade will come close to the fun factor. None of the cars in this field are really practical. My All4S has proven to be quite capable in the snow, too. And I'm pretty sure that's all the 4wd system on this car will handle. It does handle like it's on rails. I'm not quite sure the jeep will fall into the premium compact car scene that the Mini occupies though. I think that's more for the 500X since the fiat is basically $5k more than the renegade and the Mini is about $7k more with similar specs.
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Old 06-01-15, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by T0ked
I have a Countryman, so I can provide this insight. This thing is fun as all hell to drive. I'll be surprised if the Renegade will come close to the fun factor.
I agree that almost any Mini version can be fun to drive (I did a full-review several years ago on the Clubman version). Has your Mini been reliable, though? To me, many of them feel loosely-assembled, with squeaks/creaks and rattles.
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