The New Lexus ES to Make Its Global Debut at Auto Shanghai 2015
04-18-15, 09:27 PM
#121
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how old was C300?
We just had other member tell us how new C300 is quietest of them all, much better than bad lexus hybrids :-)
I also remember when new Auris was introduced, many Lexus UK CT owners mentioned how it is even quieter than CT200h... performance and NVH are always evolving.
We just had other member tell us how new C300 is quietest of them all, much better than bad lexus hybrids :-)
I also remember when new Auris was introduced, many Lexus UK CT owners mentioned how it is even quieter than CT200h... performance and NVH are always evolving.
04-18-15, 11:37 PM
#122
Lexus Test Driver
Mercedes could make Toyota wet its pants if it releases more cars like the upcoming C350e plugin hybrid. 275 hp total system power, 0-60 in 5.9s, 20 miles electric range from a 6 kWh battery pack, all for less than $50k or the price of a fully loaded ES.
The only issue is reliability, although the new C is supposed to be a lot better than the last one. Come on Lexus , a plugin ES hybrid should be on the cards. It wouldn't cost much more to add a much bigger lithium ion battery pack compared to the current tiny 1.6 kWh NiMH pack.
The only issue is reliability, although the new C is supposed to be a lot better than the last one. Come on Lexus , a plugin ES hybrid should be on the cards. It wouldn't cost much more to add a much bigger lithium ion battery pack compared to the current tiny 1.6 kWh NiMH pack.
04-19-15, 04:11 AM
#123
Lexus Champion
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04-19-15, 04:14 AM
#124
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
Mercedes could make Toyota wet its pants if it releases more cars like the upcoming C350e plugin hybrid. 275 hp total system power, 0-60 in 5.9s, 20 miles electric range from a 6 kWh battery pack, all for less than $50k or the price of a fully loaded ES.
The only issue is reliability, although the new C is supposed to be a lot better than the last one. Come on Lexus , a plugin ES hybrid should be on the cards. It wouldn't cost much more to add a much bigger lithium ion battery pack compared to the current tiny 1.6 kWh NiMH pack.
The only issue is reliability, although the new C is supposed to be a lot better than the last one. Come on Lexus , a plugin ES hybrid should be on the cards. It wouldn't cost much more to add a much bigger lithium ion battery pack compared to the current tiny 1.6 kWh NiMH pack.
Lexus wont do plugin hybrids, german plugins dont sell at all, they make them for PR reasons.... exception is i3 and i8 which do sell, rest of them dont, literally.
04-19-15, 05:27 AM
#125
Lexus Fanatic
Mercedes could make Toyota wet its pants if it releases more cars like the upcoming C350e plugin hybrid. 275 hp total system power, 0-60 in 5.9s, 20 miles electric range from a 6 kWh battery pack, all for less than $50k or the price of a fully loaded ES.
The only issue is reliability, although the new C is supposed to be a lot better than the last one. Come on Lexus , a plugin ES hybrid should be on the cards. It wouldn't cost much more to add a much bigger lithium ion battery pack compared to the current tiny 1.6 kWh NiMH pack.
The only issue is reliability, although the new C is supposed to be a lot better than the last one. Come on Lexus , a plugin ES hybrid should be on the cards. It wouldn't cost much more to add a much bigger lithium ion battery pack compared to the current tiny 1.6 kWh NiMH pack.
04-19-15, 10:39 AM
#126
Pole Position
Regarding refreshed ES I think Toyota has perfect opportunity to replace declining Avensis with it. If Im not mistaken Avensis wont see the successor much like Accord cause the segment is dominated by bare bone 3s and A4s. Buyer wants premium badge so why not offer them Camry with premium badge for affordable price? IS is still waiting on four cylinder which will for sure make it attractive but lack of diesel option will not bring much "premium badge ***** buyers" cause you know .. its not affordable and economic enough for them. Due to ES setup Im sure they can stick small displacement diesel straight from Avensis paired with automatic tranny. Why not offer ES220d in some low trim option for the tick below 30K? I don't think it would cannibalize IS sales at all but again Toyota knows more than all of us what is truly going on but its so freakin obvious that they made 2016 Avensis very Lexus like, taillights have current Lexus shape and even the rims are straight of ES if I am not mistaken.
I think with ES platform they can offer a lot more standard features for less and with a small efficient engines buyers looking for that premium L badge on proper four door will come. ES220d/ES300h on one side of the spectrum and IS200t/IS300h on the other would be a killer combo. You want the badge and features go with ES, you want sporty sedan and looks get the IS.
Last edited by Vladi; 04-19-15 at 10:45 AM.
04-19-15, 01:20 PM
#127
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
They don't sell cause they suck. Specs look good on paper but most of it doesn't translate into reality and the price tag is ridiculous. If they were any good Dutch wood be all over them. Maybe new S-class will be different and Im sure for a fact new XC90 PHEV will sell good but that's about it.
Regarding refreshed ES I think Toyota has perfect opportunity to replace declining Avensis with it. If Im not mistaken Avensis wont see the successor much like Accord cause the segment is dominated by bare bone 3s and A4s. Buyer wants premium badge so why not offer them Camry with premium badge for affordable price? IS is still waiting on four cylinder which will for sure make it attractive but lack of diesel option will not bring much "premium badge ***** buyers" cause you know .. its not affordable and economic enough for them. Due to ES setup Im sure they can stick small displacement diesel straight from Avensis paired with automatic tranny. Why not offer ES220d in some low trim option for the tick below 30K? I don't think it would cannibalize IS sales at all but again Toyota knows more than all of us what is truly going on but its so freakin obvious that they made 2016 Avensis very Lexus like, taillights have current Lexus shape and even the rims are straight of ES if I am not mistaken.
I think with ES platform they can offer a lot more standard features for less and with a small efficient engines buyers looking for that premium L badge on proper four door will come. ES220d/ES300h on one side of the spectrum and IS200t/IS300h on the other would be a killer combo. You want the badge and features go with ES, you want sporty sedan and looks get the IS.
Regarding refreshed ES I think Toyota has perfect opportunity to replace declining Avensis with it. If Im not mistaken Avensis wont see the successor much like Accord cause the segment is dominated by bare bone 3s and A4s. Buyer wants premium badge so why not offer them Camry with premium badge for affordable price? IS is still waiting on four cylinder which will for sure make it attractive but lack of diesel option will not bring much "premium badge ***** buyers" cause you know .. its not affordable and economic enough for them. Due to ES setup Im sure they can stick small displacement diesel straight from Avensis paired with automatic tranny. Why not offer ES220d in some low trim option for the tick below 30K? I don't think it would cannibalize IS sales at all but again Toyota knows more than all of us what is truly going on but its so freakin obvious that they made 2016 Avensis very Lexus like, taillights have current Lexus shape and even the rims are straight of ES if I am not mistaken.
I think with ES platform they can offer a lot more standard features for less and with a small efficient engines buyers looking for that premium L badge on proper four door will come. ES220d/ES300h on one side of the spectrum and IS200t/IS300h on the other would be a killer combo. You want the badge and features go with ES, you want sporty sedan and looks get the IS.
XC90 is also very expensive phev... and heck, even C400 diesel hybrid is something like $10k more expensive than IS300h.
04-19-15, 02:36 PM
#129
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
Yes, Toyota Europe (TMME) operates with different sets of vehicles in Russia, Ukraine, Kazahstan and few other ex-soviet countries... rest of the Europe gets different lineup of both Lexus and Toyota vehicles. Russia gets Camry and we get Avensis.
This is last Avensis tho, so we will see what we end up with in 2018.
This is last Avensis tho, so we will see what we end up with in 2018.
04-19-15, 03:59 PM
#130
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Mercedes could make Toyota wet its pants if it releases more cars like the upcoming C350e plugin hybrid. 275 hp total system power, 0-60 in 5.9s, 20 miles electric range from a 6 kWh battery pack, all for less than $50k or the price of a fully loaded ES.
The only issue is reliability, although the new C is supposed to be a lot better than the last one. Come on Lexus , a plugin ES hybrid should be on the cards. It wouldn't cost much more to add a much bigger lithium ion battery pack compared to the current tiny 1.6 kWh NiMH pack.
The only issue is reliability, although the new C is supposed to be a lot better than the last one. Come on Lexus , a plugin ES hybrid should be on the cards. It wouldn't cost much more to add a much bigger lithium ion battery pack compared to the current tiny 1.6 kWh NiMH pack.
04-19-15, 05:34 PM
#131
Pole Position
ES is way too big for Europe, thats why it isnt sold as Lexus here... and way too plain. I think Toyota might do Avensis out of next generation CT Sedan.
XC90 is also very expensive phev... and heck, even C400 diesel hybrid is something like $10k more expensive than IS300h.
XC90 is also very expensive phev... and heck, even C400 diesel hybrid is something like $10k more expensive than IS300h.
I agree with you, I guess next gen CT will grow in size and be A3 sedan competition.
04-19-15, 06:20 PM
#134
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I checked out prices on German website. Base price is pricy for a hatch but fully loaded CT goes for close to 40k! Holly crap that is not worth the price they are asking. Whats the resale value like? I bet it depreciates big time.
I agree with you, I guess next gen CT will grow in size and be A3 sedan competition.
I agree with you, I guess next gen CT will grow in size and be A3 sedan competition.
lexus sales in germany are low, so that and due to reliability, resale is actually good for europe, better than Audi/BMW/MB which have huge fleet sales.
04-19-15, 09:10 PM
#135
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