Getting off the leasing merry go-round
03-29-15, 12:34 PM
#17
Lexus Test Driver
I will
Probably get some heat for saying this, I LOVe Acura TL. I owned a 2012 TL Advance and by far my favorite car of all. Even Lexus could not satisfy me as Acura did. excellent Navigation, Extremely Fast, steering is precise. The only thing it did not have was the AWD which would have mad this ride even better! The car had only 1 negative IMO is too muh chrome.
Probably get some heat for saying this, I LOVe Acura TL. I owned a 2012 TL Advance and by far my favorite car of all. Even Lexus could not satisfy me as Acura did. excellent Navigation, Extremely Fast, steering is precise. The only thing it did not have was the AWD which would have mad this ride even better! The car had only 1 negative IMO is too muh chrome.
I'm i interested to see what conclusion you come to! Because as you stated its a complex and dynamic situation.
I started leasing many moons ago after getting a lemon ( no lemon laws back then). Then buying the car out after the lease was up and the car was still to my liking. Bought all of them after the lemon lol
This has served me well and I've usually kept the vehicles for 4-10 years depending on the situation. Selling them afterwards was never an issue as I take good care of my vehicles.
My 2005 Acura TL was my last lease and again I bought it out. Could have turned around and sold it for much more than residual value.
But it's a great vehicle, in good shape with 80k miles on it now. So after 10 years of driving it's worth about $10k, paid $40k for it all said and done. It's getting old ( but so am I ) but it's a darn good car and has NEVER let me down and has everything I need in a vehicle! Even the technology in the car is great to this day!
But I got it in my head I wanted to buy a new vehicle before I retire sometime in the next year, so I figured I would just pay cash, buy the GS350 AWD luxury with the 10 year warranty that covers everything, sell the Acura TL and call it a day.
But I still like my Acura TL ! Sure it has a few beauty marks, but the interior is pristine and mechanically very sound. Now I'm having a hard time deciding to sell it lol
Took Collision off the ins. so now it's $181 a yr. to insure as well.
What to do Is always the million $$ question LOL
I started leasing many moons ago after getting a lemon ( no lemon laws back then). Then buying the car out after the lease was up and the car was still to my liking. Bought all of them after the lemon lol
This has served me well and I've usually kept the vehicles for 4-10 years depending on the situation. Selling them afterwards was never an issue as I take good care of my vehicles.
My 2005 Acura TL was my last lease and again I bought it out. Could have turned around and sold it for much more than residual value.
But it's a great vehicle, in good shape with 80k miles on it now. So after 10 years of driving it's worth about $10k, paid $40k for it all said and done. It's getting old ( but so am I ) but it's a darn good car and has NEVER let me down and has everything I need in a vehicle! Even the technology in the car is great to this day!
But I got it in my head I wanted to buy a new vehicle before I retire sometime in the next year, so I figured I would just pay cash, buy the GS350 AWD luxury with the 10 year warranty that covers everything, sell the Acura TL and call it a day.
But I still like my Acura TL ! Sure it has a few beauty marks, but the interior is pristine and mechanically very sound. Now I'm having a hard time deciding to sell it lol
Took Collision off the ins. so now it's $181 a yr. to insure as well.
What to do Is always the million $$ question LOL
03-29-15, 12:47 PM
#18
Lexus Fanatic
03-29-15, 01:00 PM
#19
Rookie
Thread Starter
I must admit; despite having leased a lot of cars, I don't fully understand all of the moving parts. My simplistic approach has been to negotiate the lowest price of a 'one pay' lease payment for the 36 month lease period without regard for all that other 'noise' such as; rental charge, acquisition fee, documentary fee, depreciation, etc. etc. If I get the 'one pay' amount I want, and the vehicle I want, the rest of it seems unimportant. They can reverse engineer the other charges as long as my single payment is right. Heck, I don't even care what the vehicle costs (capitalized cost) as long as the single payment covers everything.
03-29-15, 01:31 PM
#20
Lexus Test Driver
You can pay off the car any time of your term, you call Lexus and ask fot 10 day payoff. Then you send them a check for that amount. Done! Dealer doesn't play any part in this! The only thing you may need to worry about is paying Tax! Depending on your state.in some states you pay for the full amount upfornt in some you only pay on the financed amount. In some they have what called double tax: Even if you paid the full tax when you leased the car, when you decide to keep it, you may have to pay again.
About 20 years ago I leased my first Lexus and I've leased seven consecutively since then. Can't remember why I decided to lease rather than buy; probably because I liked the idea of having a 'settled' transaction at the end of three years rather than haggling on both the purchase price and the trade-in value. Several times at the end of the lease (I've always done 'one pay' leases), I intended to purchase the next Lexus rather than lease it because they were always in perfect shape and I usually still enjoyed the car. I was always seduced into leasing a new model rather than buying my 'old' car. The logic of leasing a new car for +/- $25k rather than paying $40k to buy my current car made sense.
So I've only got 3 months left on my current lease, a 2013 GS350 F-Sport, so I went to a dealership and looked around for a replacement vehicle. The 2015 GS350 is too similar to my current ride so I nixed that option. I looked at the NX, but that seemed like a step down, which I'd be willing to take, except it's a first year for the model and the options list is thin. Bottom line, this year I think I'll just buy my current car at the end of the lease since nothing out there excites me and I still like my current car (only 10k miles).
Is there anything inherently wrong with this decision?
Thanks for any insight/discussion on the topic.
Any pitfalls I should avoid when paying off the lease.
Can I complete this transaction mostly with LFS or do I have to go to the dealer? I'd prefer to complete all the steps on-line with LFS... remember, I've fallen victim to "new care seduction" numerous time previously so I need to avoid that temptation.
So I've only got 3 months left on my current lease, a 2013 GS350 F-Sport, so I went to a dealership and looked around for a replacement vehicle. The 2015 GS350 is too similar to my current ride so I nixed that option. I looked at the NX, but that seemed like a step down, which I'd be willing to take, except it's a first year for the model and the options list is thin. Bottom line, this year I think I'll just buy my current car at the end of the lease since nothing out there excites me and I still like my current car (only 10k miles).
Is there anything inherently wrong with this decision?
Thanks for any insight/discussion on the topic.
Any pitfalls I should avoid when paying off the lease.
Can I complete this transaction mostly with LFS or do I have to go to the dealer? I'd prefer to complete all the steps on-line with LFS... remember, I've fallen victim to "new care seduction" numerous time previously so I need to avoid that temptation.
Last edited by FastTags; 03-29-15 at 01:37 PM.
03-29-15, 03:20 PM
#21
Lexus Fanatic
I must admit; despite having leased a lot of cars, I don't fully understand all of the moving parts. My simplistic approach has been to negotiate the lowest price of a 'one pay' lease payment for the 36 month lease period without regard for all that other 'noise' such as; rental charge, acquisition fee, documentary fee, depreciation, etc. etc. If I get the 'one pay' amount I want, and the vehicle I want, the rest of it seems unimportant. They can reverse engineer the other charges as long as my single payment is right. Heck, I don't even care what the vehicle costs (capitalized cost) as long as the single payment covers everything.
I don't do one pay leases, but I have never been quoted a lease that I haven't wound up $50-$100 a month less once I've negotiated the nuts and bolts of the lease, after the price was negotiated. One pay lease is the same way.
03-30-15, 07:11 AM
#22
Lexus Test Driver
About 20 years ago I leased my first Lexus and I've leased seven consecutively since then. Can't remember why I decided to lease rather than buy; probably because I liked the idea of having a 'settled' transaction at the end of three years rather than haggling on both the purchase price and the trade-in value. Several times at the end of the lease (I've always done 'one pay' leases), I intended to purchase the next Lexus rather than lease it because they were always in perfect shape and I usually still enjoyed the car. I was always seduced into leasing a new model rather than buying my 'old' car. The logic of leasing a new car for +/- $25k rather than paying $40k to buy my current car made sense.
So I've only got 3 months left on my current lease, a 2013 GS350 F-Sport, so I went to a dealership and looked around for a replacement vehicle. The 2015 GS350 is too similar to my current ride so I nixed that option. I looked at the NX, but that seemed like a step down, which I'd be willing to take, except it's a first year for the model and the options list is thin. Bottom line, this year I think I'll just buy my current car at the end of the lease since nothing out there excites me and I still like my current car (only 10k miles).
Is there anything inherently wrong with this decision?
Thanks for any insight/discussion on the topic.
Any pitfalls I should avoid when paying off the lease.
Can I complete this transaction mostly with LFS or do I have to go to the dealer? I'd prefer to complete all the steps on-line with LFS... remember, I've fallen victim to "new care seduction" numerous time previously so I need to avoid that temptation.
So I've only got 3 months left on my current lease, a 2013 GS350 F-Sport, so I went to a dealership and looked around for a replacement vehicle. The 2015 GS350 is too similar to my current ride so I nixed that option. I looked at the NX, but that seemed like a step down, which I'd be willing to take, except it's a first year for the model and the options list is thin. Bottom line, this year I think I'll just buy my current car at the end of the lease since nothing out there excites me and I still like my current car (only 10k miles).
Is there anything inherently wrong with this decision?
Thanks for any insight/discussion on the topic.
Any pitfalls I should avoid when paying off the lease.
Can I complete this transaction mostly with LFS or do I have to go to the dealer? I'd prefer to complete all the steps on-line with LFS... remember, I've fallen victim to "new care seduction" numerous time previously so I need to avoid that temptation.
03-30-15, 07:23 AM
#23
Lexus Fanatic
The bottom line is, in general if you're going to buy...buy from the start. Leasing and then buying it out seldom makes sense, because you're always faced with that value proposition, do I keep mine for a price thats probably more than its worth, even though its nearer the end of the warranty, may need tires, brakes, etc...or do I lease something new for basically the same cost?
03-30-15, 07:53 AM
#24
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
there's no free lunch...
buy and you're financing or paying for the whole thing, the car depreciates, you sell at some point for what it's worth and start over.
lease and you're financing or paying the depreciation for the term and end up with nothing at the end.
if you keep a car longer than say 4-5 years, then buying can make sense. if you want a new car every 2-4 years then leasing is the way to go, but there isn't a whole lot in it either way, EXCEPT if you drive a lot of or very few miles. in your case you drive very few so leasing has probably cost you more than it should (plus you negotiate by 'feel' and not data
). if you drive a lot it may or may not make sense to lease.
but overall, for most people, it doesn't make a whole lot of difference in the long run. i've always bought, but this time i seriously had a hard time justifying buying (but did anyway, probably because i find leasing so confusing).
i've said for years though as cars get more complex and expensive, eventually MOST people will rent/lease a car. but in urban areas with services like uber and lyft, more and more people won't bother at all with the HUGE expense of owning/leasing.
buy and you're financing or paying for the whole thing, the car depreciates, you sell at some point for what it's worth and start over.
lease and you're financing or paying the depreciation for the term and end up with nothing at the end.
if you keep a car longer than say 4-5 years, then buying can make sense. if you want a new car every 2-4 years then leasing is the way to go, but there isn't a whole lot in it either way, EXCEPT if you drive a lot of or very few miles. in your case you drive very few so leasing has probably cost you more than it should (plus you negotiate by 'feel' and not data
). if you drive a lot it may or may not make sense to lease.but overall, for most people, it doesn't make a whole lot of difference in the long run. i've always bought, but this time i seriously had a hard time justifying buying (but did anyway, probably because i find leasing so confusing).
i've said for years though as cars get more complex and expensive, eventually MOST people will rent/lease a car. but in urban areas with services like uber and lyft, more and more people won't bother at all with the HUGE expense of owning/leasing.
03-30-15, 08:05 AM
#25
Lexus Fanatic
Originally Posted by bitkahuna
if you want a new car every 2-4 years then leasing is the way to go, but there isn't a whole lot in it either way, EXCEPT if you drive a lot of or very few miles. in your case you drive very few so leasing has probably cost you more than it should (plus you negotiate by 'feel' and not data ). if you drive a lot it may or may not make sense to lease.
). if you drive a lot it may or may not make sense to lease.
(because I find leasing so confusing).
Last edited by mmarshall; 03-30-15 at 08:10 AM.
03-30-15, 09:25 AM
#26
Lexus Fanatic
f you buy it out after 2 or 3 years, you're not only paying for the car's residual value (and perhaps more dealer profit or markup on that residual) after already paying the dealer's original profit on the lease itself and any extra fees like damage from the wear-and-tear clause, extra mileage, etc.....
You have to look at it as buying a used car, and decide if that purchase at that residual number makes sense or not and take the original lease out of it ...
03-30-15, 09:29 AM
#27
Lexus Test Driver
Thats right!
Thats not the case. If you buy the car out of the lease, you don't owe anything for damage, wear and tear or excess mileage. You don't owe those things if you trade the car in either, only if you turn it in.
You have to look at it as buying a used car, and decide if that purchase at that residual number makes sense or not and take the original lease out of it ...
You have to look at it as buying a used car, and decide if that purchase at that residual number makes sense or not and take the original lease out of it ...
03-30-15, 09:32 AM
#28
Lexus Test Driver
One pay lease is the same as any lease the only major difference is that you dont pay rent charge! Everything is the same, sale price, fees all calculated in one pay lease.
The issue is when you negotiate a lease this way the dealer can and will hide profit in the lease that you don't realize is there. If you negotiate each facet of the lease individually, you'll find in the end you pay a lot less.
I don't do one pay leases, but I have never been quoted a lease that I haven't wound up $50-$100 a month less once I've negotiated the nuts and bolts of the lease, after the price was negotiated. One pay lease is the same way.
I don't do one pay leases, but I have never been quoted a lease that I haven't wound up $50-$100 a month less once I've negotiated the nuts and bolts of the lease, after the price was negotiated. One pay lease is the same way.
03-30-15, 09:46 AM
#29
Lexus Fanatic
But....if you buy do it out, doesn't that ALSO include a profit on the buyback price, in addition to whatever profit the dealer already got on the lease itself? The dealer is not likely going to let you have it for straight-residual, is he, without a mark-up, even after the lease-profits? Maybe so...(I haven't actually been in that situation myself yet). That's one thing they found out at Nissan, years ago, when residual values for Nissan products tanked, sank way below what was projected on the leases, and both dealerships and the manufacturer lost lot of money. And consistently high residual values, of course, from the brand's cult-like following, allowed BMW dealers to give very attractive lease-rates for years.
03-30-15, 11:33 AM
#30
Lexus Fanatic
But....if you buy do it out, doesn't that ALSO include a profit on the buyback price, in addition to whatever profit the dealer already got on the lease itself? The dealer is not likely going to let you have it for straight-residual, is he, without a mark-up, even after the lease-profits? Maybe so...(