Allen K

iTrader: (4)

I'm surprised the Legacy scored so well in Tech & Entertainment. I thought the head unit w/ nav on it was really bad...

Toys4RJill

Whatever....I like GM products for example, but when it comes to buy them I never would. Way too many problems and issues. Just look at the key problem.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

thought maybe it was improved this year?

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

the difference between this shoot out result and the buying public is these reviewers are into cars and like comparing details and value and features, etc. they know what they're talking about.

a vast number of camry buyers want something they consider safe, reliable, easy to drive, comfortable, scores well in consumer (not car) comparisons like consumer reports, and has good resale. camry checks all those boxes so for people who hate shopping for cars (just about everyone), it (and the accord) are the safest, easiest, laziest choices. they're certainly not bad cars, and i think the '15 refresh is excellent.

having said that, cars (sedans) are quickly shrinking in market share compared to the hotter cuv/suv market.

mmarshall

Although that's not necessarily the case here, the problem, though, with many reviewers (not all by any means), is that they are too strongly sport-oriented, especially those associated with auto-magazines. They are usually so concerned with acceleration, handling, braking, and Hold-'Em-In seat bolsters that they often forget that those are not the features that typically sell most of the new cars on the market. What it sells is magazines.

In this specific review, though, having driven most of these cars myself, I don't know how some of these guys came up with the conclusions they did....though I do agree with them that today's Camry tends to be overrated...both it and the Honda Accord, IMO, reached their peaks in the mid-1990s. But they complain about the Malibu being noisy when most GM vehicles (including the Malibu, according to most reviewers) are known for their quietness. And think they would have rated the Chrysler 200 quite a bit higher with the V6 (the way I reviewed it) instead of the four. Consumer Reports also agrees that the V6 version is far better than the four.

That's true....but mid-size family-sedans are still the top-selling single category as a group.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

compared to trucks? i don't think so.

mmarshall

You're correct that the Ford F-150 and Silverado are the top two selling vehicles in the American market ( and have been for many years)....with the Dodge Ram less so. But if you take the sales figures of ALL of the mid-sized family sedans in the American market together, in the past, they together were the top-selling group, simply because there are so many different models. Of course, that could change......we're almost at the end of 2014, and we'll see final numbers for the year then. (and, of course, I admit I've sometimes been wrong before)

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

crossovers alone outsell all midsize (non-luxury) vehicles. former WAY up for 2014. latter down for 2014.

http://online.wsj.com/mdc/public/pag...autosales.html

http://www.autoalliance.org/auto-mar...pular-vehicles

mmarshall

Yes, that's why I said that we'd have to see the end-of-year figures. But I wouldn't be surprised if you were correct this year....the small crossover segment keeps increasing every year, though some charts include AWD Subarus as crossovers and some don't. And, of course, this year, the Lincoln MKC was added, and the Lexus NX will also be a factor next year.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

there's no chance at all that midsize sedans will outsell crossovers this year, or next, or the next.

'awd subarus' isn't specific because a) they're all awd (except brz), and b) they offer sedans, wagons, hatches, cuvs, etc.

the mkc and nx are luxury crossovers but your point is valid, they will eat into luxury sedans.

Hoovey689

iTrader: (16)

toy4two

What about GM?

Seriously they make lack luster, dangerous cars, poor fit and finish go bankrupt and yet the US taxpayers have to keep bailing them out? Enough already. I've heard lawyers are having a hard time collecting from "old GM" seems they are being blocked by the bankruptcy shield, newer owners with faulty ignitions can go after "new GM" though.

mmarshall

To a large extent, you're living in the past. Auto companies can, and do change. Hyundai and Kia both radically changed for the better 10-15 years ago. Now, GM is also changing for the better....has been ever since the bailout. Chrysler is, too, in fit/finish and drivetrain refinement, though we're still not seeing it yet in the overall reliability of some of their products like the Jeep Grand Cherokee.

That's not GM's fault. That's our American bankruptcy laws. Only state and Federal government can change that.

FrankReynoldsCPA

It is GM's fault for going bankrupt though.

Aron9000

At $27,000, I think I'd stretch my budget up to about $30k and buy and Impala. Much more car for not a lot more $$$$