Just drove the new Hyundai Genesis...5.0 V8 and 3.8 V6 AWD...my thoughts
10-29-14, 09:08 PM
#16
but still...the dealer has plastic chairs and big banners about lojack and its just not a premium experience at all. While the product is really great, the "event" of buying and servicing your car is greatly diminished, and luxury is a great deal about the event and the experience. .
Lexus service is more consistent across dealers probably because Lexus HQ makes it that way.
mainstream dealers are hit and miss.
10-29-14, 09:23 PM
#17
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I cannot speak on the new Genesis specifically but we were twenty year Toyota/Lexus owners and switched to Kia / Hyundia in 2012. We have had a 12 Loaded Optima, 12 Loaded Azera, and a 14 Loaded Sorento SXL. Going from / Kia / Hyundai to a 15 Subaru Legacy right now and all I can see is I want me Sorento SXL back! From most materials, build quality, drive experience and especially infotainment... Hyundai and Kia smokes comparable Toyota/Subaru models and matches or beats many Lexus models. Subaru uses almost all Toyota electronics/infotainment... they look identical to Toyota and are easily 5 years behind Kia/Hyundai in this regard. I will say the Subaru Legacy is an unbelievable driving experience, they really have that nailed down... but all the little things really add up. Fit an Finish on all three of our Kia/Hyundias was second to none... the Subaru I keep noticing all these little cost cutting areas and it's driving me nuts. As for dealership experience, our local Hyundai dealership is amazing, and they really treat you well and have a great loaner program. The Kia dealerships in the area have a long way to go, but most are upgrading and / or getting brand new space to conduct business. Tell your friend good luck with the Genesis, I'm holding out for the 17' Kia GT(which will be based on the Genesis platform) and am considering taking a bath on the Subaru to get back with the Kia/Hyundai brand. Their product really speaks for itself now.
10-30-14, 03:34 AM
#18
Good friend of mine is looking to replace his 2011 GS350, went out with him and another friend of ours today and drove a couple cars, the 2014 Infiniti Q70 L (will post another thread on it) and the 2015 Hyundai Genesis.
First off...I've been a Lexus owner a long time. I love my GS, as I have all the Lexus vehicles I've owned. I had seriously considered the 2010 Genesis instead of my 2010 ES. Mainly brand snobbery kept me from doing that. I've been a vocal detractor from Hyundai's ability to sell a legitimate luxury car with a mainstream brand.
So don't take it lightly when I say...if I had been in my GS (we were in his GS) and had I been within a time in the lease when it would be doable...I would have traded the GS in on the Genesis V8 on the spot. It is simply one of the best, most appealing cars I have driven in a long, long time...and is every bit the equal, and in many ways superior to everything else in this segment including my beloved GS.
First off, in person the car is very attractive. Its wide, long and low and really has a lot of presence in the parking lot. Paint quality is excellent, trim is a modern matte metal finish. Very nice looking. The first one we drove was a black on black 5.0 V8 model. The interior is very spacious, and very high quality. No cheap plastics anywhere, soft touch plastics throughout, felt lined map pockets in the doors. Really great. The black interior we thought was a little austere, but very high quality. Seats are covered in leather easily equaling the quality of the semi-aniline leather in my GS. All the displays and readouts are sharp, electroflourescent, LED, or TFT.
The real bread and butter of this car is the ride and drive. It reminded me instantly of the LS. So vault-like and solid, so glasslike and creamy on the road. Everything it does is muted, refined, and smooth. The V8 is strong and smooth. Vault quiet. It passed what I call the "speed bump" test with flying colors. Driving down a neighborhood road, hit a speed bump at 40MPH. No other car I've had other than the LS, will just glide over the speed bump with little drama...until the Genesis. The most incredible thing is that despite a ride that I would give a 9/10 in the V8 and a 10/10 in the V6 (18s in the V6 19s in the V8), the car isn't wallowy or bargelike. Its not as crisp and tossable as the GS, but the tradeoff for ride comfort is a no brainer IMHO.
Next we drove the V6 AWD which is what my friend is considering. This car had the ivory/black interior which we found much more attractive. Ride was even better due to higher profile tires. The V6 is almost as smooth as the V8. but not quite. Easily as smooth as the 3.5 in the GS, and much quieter at idle.
I am really floored by how much I liked the car. We had driven the Q70L right beforehand, and I would not even consider buying that vs the Genesis.
Its probably what he is going to get...and might very honestly be what I wind up in a year from now as well. The only issue with me is brand, but instead of being able to say that the Genesis is as good as the competition just without the badge, I might just say that the Genesis is actually better. Its one thing to pay $10k more for a car that is no better but has a badge, better resale, better dealers....but to pay $10k+ more and wind up with a car that is actually less car? Harder to do that.
Spending nearly $50k for an ES when one could buy a Genesis? That would be tough...
First off...I've been a Lexus owner a long time. I love my GS, as I have all the Lexus vehicles I've owned. I had seriously considered the 2010 Genesis instead of my 2010 ES. Mainly brand snobbery kept me from doing that. I've been a vocal detractor from Hyundai's ability to sell a legitimate luxury car with a mainstream brand.
So don't take it lightly when I say...if I had been in my GS (we were in his GS) and had I been within a time in the lease when it would be doable...I would have traded the GS in on the Genesis V8 on the spot. It is simply one of the best, most appealing cars I have driven in a long, long time...and is every bit the equal, and in many ways superior to everything else in this segment including my beloved GS.
First off, in person the car is very attractive. Its wide, long and low and really has a lot of presence in the parking lot. Paint quality is excellent, trim is a modern matte metal finish. Very nice looking. The first one we drove was a black on black 5.0 V8 model. The interior is very spacious, and very high quality. No cheap plastics anywhere, soft touch plastics throughout, felt lined map pockets in the doors. Really great. The black interior we thought was a little austere, but very high quality. Seats are covered in leather easily equaling the quality of the semi-aniline leather in my GS. All the displays and readouts are sharp, electroflourescent, LED, or TFT.
The real bread and butter of this car is the ride and drive. It reminded me instantly of the LS. So vault-like and solid, so glasslike and creamy on the road. Everything it does is muted, refined, and smooth. The V8 is strong and smooth. Vault quiet. It passed what I call the "speed bump" test with flying colors. Driving down a neighborhood road, hit a speed bump at 40MPH. No other car I've had other than the LS, will just glide over the speed bump with little drama...until the Genesis. The most incredible thing is that despite a ride that I would give a 9/10 in the V8 and a 10/10 in the V6 (18s in the V6 19s in the V8), the car isn't wallowy or bargelike. Its not as crisp and tossable as the GS, but the tradeoff for ride comfort is a no brainer IMHO.
Next we drove the V6 AWD which is what my friend is considering. This car had the ivory/black interior which we found much more attractive. Ride was even better due to higher profile tires. The V6 is almost as smooth as the V8. but not quite. Easily as smooth as the 3.5 in the GS, and much quieter at idle.
I am really floored by how much I liked the car. We had driven the Q70L right beforehand, and I would not even consider buying that vs the Genesis.
Its probably what he is going to get...and might very honestly be what I wind up in a year from now as well. The only issue with me is brand, but instead of being able to say that the Genesis is as good as the competition just without the badge, I might just say that the Genesis is actually better. Its one thing to pay $10k more for a car that is no better but has a badge, better resale, better dealers....but to pay $10k+ more and wind up with a car that is actually less car? Harder to do that.
Spending nearly $50k for an ES when one could buy a Genesis? That would be tough...
I cant believe people were getting 2013 V8 with everything for 33k last year - brand new!
Also check Kia K900 as well, it is Equus material and sales are horrible so they will likely give huge discounts.
Problem with value, resale and brand recognition is that they really need to start a luxury brand if they want these to be fixed. It is crazy that they gave 35% discount for last year models, poor people who bought them few years ago lost a lot of value... I also saw some V8 dealer demos with 6k on clock going for 26k. Thats Camry money!
But of course, to start a brand, you have to spend few billion and that will mean that the pricing will come really close to everyone else. Thats how it goes.
10-30-14, 05:36 AM
#19
Lexus Test Driver
SW13, tell your friend to take the car over night for a test drive, just to make sure, its a big decision.
I have bought myself a brand new 2012 Genesis sedan 6cy back in 2012, I did not like 2 things:
1, The info/nav touch screen was not working well, had glitches, I went on the forum to see if this is a single issue, apparently it was not. Most people have experienced the same things.
2, There was a long throttle delay, regardless of the speed. When I hit the gas, it would take a few seconds before the car start moving, very dangerous and very disturbing. I also found that it was an issue for all the 2012 Genesis of that year.
I returned the car the next day, I just could not stand the fact that I could not use the NAV when I need it to, nor the throttle delay.
I don't know if Genesis fixed those issue, I really hope that they did, as I really like the look and all the toys it came with.
I have bought myself a brand new 2012 Genesis sedan 6cy back in 2012, I did not like 2 things:
1, The info/nav touch screen was not working well, had glitches, I went on the forum to see if this is a single issue, apparently it was not. Most people have experienced the same things.
2, There was a long throttle delay, regardless of the speed. When I hit the gas, it would take a few seconds before the car start moving, very dangerous and very disturbing. I also found that it was an issue for all the 2012 Genesis of that year.
I returned the car the next day, I just could not stand the fact that I could not use the NAV when I need it to, nor the throttle delay.
I don't know if Genesis fixed those issue, I really hope that they did, as I really like the look and all the toys it came with.
10-30-14, 06:18 AM
#21
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
I'm not buying anything for a year, I have 13 months left on my lease. But, sales of the new car are stronger than the old car, and the new car is a much better car than the old car, I expect this car to do better. The K900 brand issue is even worse IMHO, and I don't like the Kia look. If I were looking at a K900 I'd consider an Equus.
I wouldn't buy one because of resale, but if you lease as long as the residual is good resale doesn't really matter. What remains to be seen is what the residuals and money factors look like.
Originally Posted by FastTags
SW13, tell your friend to take the car over night for a test drive, just to make sure, its a big decision.
I have bought myself a brand new 2012 Genesis sedan 6cy back in 2012, I did not like 2 things:
1, The info/nav touch screen was not working well, had glitches, I went on the forum to see if this is a single issue, apparently it was not. Most people have experienced the same things.
2, There was a long throttle delay, regardless of the speed. When I hit the gas, it would take a few seconds before the car start moving, very dangerous and very disturbing. I also found that it was an issue for all the 2012 Genesis of that year.
I have bought myself a brand new 2012 Genesis sedan 6cy back in 2012, I did not like 2 things:
1, The info/nav touch screen was not working well, had glitches, I went on the forum to see if this is a single issue, apparently it was not. Most people have experienced the same things.
2, There was a long throttle delay, regardless of the speed. When I hit the gas, it would take a few seconds before the car start moving, very dangerous and very disturbing. I also found that it was an issue for all the 2012 Genesis of that year.
Originally Posted by Joeb427
I priced a V6 AWD on Edmunds with options I'd want and the sticker was $52635.
That's a big number even with a 10% discount if available.
That's a big number even with a 10% discount if available.
10-30-14, 06:26 AM
#22
I'll definitely test drive one.
The new generation Genesis will be out a year and maybe good lease deals will be available.
Hyundai service is hit or miss.
My son had a Elantra and his dealer was awful.
My Mazda dealer is both Mazda and Hyundai service and so far so good.
10-30-14, 06:28 AM
#23
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Thread Starter
The dealer I drove them at is a no-haggle dealer, prices were about $4k off on each, so deals on price can be had, no idea about leases...my buddy purchases so we wont get any info there.
10-30-14, 07:25 AM
#25
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
I spend a fair amount of time in the 3GS, in fact its what the friend of mine who is looking has and what we were driving when we went to go drive the Genesis. The 4GS is an improvement in ride, handling, quietness, comfort, quality, and a HUGE improvement in interior over the 3GS. I drove the 3GS in 2010 before I bought the 2010 ES, it didn't appeal to me over the ES at all, when I drove the 2013 4GS though immediately I saw the benefit and upgraded.
He doesn't care for the styling of my 4GS (and thats fair, I love it but styling is subjective) but he rides in it all the time and has driven it and he always comments on how much nicer it is than his 3GS to be in and drive. Anybody who says otherwise either isn't being honest, or has never driven a 4GS and directly compared it to the 3GS.
We were discussing the V8, and the fact that I said that I would want the V8 in the Genesis, but wouldn't in the GS or the Q70L. I think its because the V8 makes up for the fact that the Genesis is a Hyundai lol, in a BMW or Lexus or Infiniti I would never consider the V8. Cost of entry is really low in the Genesis too. The Infiniti the V8 costs $12k.
10-30-14, 07:47 AM
#26
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But regarding the Genesis, I didn't find the interior to be as good as I initially thought . The dashboard is very bland, very similar looking to BMW and the material were ordinary plastics with strange colour schemes.
The doors felt too thin for a luxury car, my IS350 doors feel far more solid and they shut with a smooth solid thump.
The lower door panels were super cheap; black plastics without any form of retractable door pockets or colour coding.
We don't get the V8 here (unfortunately) but the 3.8L was on the lean side of anaemic, I guess the weight of the vehicle is too much for a V6 to comfortably overcome. I also felt that it needed much more pedal travel than what I'm usually used to with other vehicles.
Overall I don't think the competition has much to worry about, and pricing hasn't been announced here, but if it's anything over $60,000 for a V6 then they can forget about selling beyond rental companies at discounted prices..
The doors felt too thin for a luxury car, my IS350 doors feel far more solid and they shut with a smooth solid thump.
The lower door panels were super cheap; black plastics without any form of retractable door pockets or colour coding.
We don't get the V8 here (unfortunately) but the 3.8L was on the lean side of anaemic, I guess the weight of the vehicle is too much for a V6 to comfortably overcome. I also felt that it needed much more pedal travel than what I'm usually used to with other vehicles.
Overall I don't think the competition has much to worry about, and pricing hasn't been announced here, but if it's anything over $60,000 for a V6 then they can forget about selling beyond rental companies at discounted prices..
Last edited by yowps3; 10-30-14 at 07:59 AM.
10-30-14, 07:57 AM
#28
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The door felt too thin for a luxury car, my IS350 doors feel far more solid and they shut with a smooth solid thump.
The lower door panel was super cheap; black plastics without any form of retractable door pockets or colour coding.
We don't get the V8 here (unfortunately) but the 3.8L was on the lean side of anaemic, I guess the weight of the vehicle is too much for a V6 to swallow. I felt that it needed much more pedal travel than what I'm usually used to with other vehicles.
Considering that you thought the 4GS was a step back from the 3GS though and thats so drastically different from my view, obviously we have entirely different viewpoints. If you want "cocooned in luxury" as you said before and you didn't like the way the Genesis drove...you either havent driven one or I don't think your definition of what refined luxury is matches anywhere close to what mine is. The car rides and drives very similarly to an LS. Like I said, sitting in the car in the parking lot I wasn't overly impressed, then I pulled out on the road and didn't want to give it back.
Last edited by SW17LS; 10-30-14 at 08:05 AM.
10-30-14, 08:27 AM
#29
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Yes, by far the most compelling factor of the Genesis was quietness. The Genesis is quiet, but that doesn't come as a surprise as its a large car with plenty of sound insulation & padding.
But regarding interior design & quality I stand by my statement. Nothing special there, which is a shame as so much could've been done.
Performance from the V6 is sub-par, it won't be winning any drags and it's probably one of the slowest of the big six-cylinder cars on the market
Headliner material is not consistent, as the Genesis I looked at had nice sued-like material while the one I test drove had the same headliner you find in the Elantra..
And while evetything is quiet inside at idle, but when you rev the engine the sounds it makes just don't sound good. While my IS may emit more dB, but the accoustic emissions from the engine and drivetrain are pleasant to the ear. The Lexus/Toyota engines have a smooth sewing machine-like noise compared to the Genesis that has a cacophonous, drone sounding engine / drivetrain.
But regarding interior design & quality I stand by my statement. Nothing special there, which is a shame as so much could've been done.
Performance from the V6 is sub-par, it won't be winning any drags and it's probably one of the slowest of the big six-cylinder cars on the market
Headliner material is not consistent, as the Genesis I looked at had nice sued-like material while the one I test drove had the same headliner you find in the Elantra..
And while evetything is quiet inside at idle, but when you rev the engine the sounds it makes just don't sound good. While my IS may emit more dB, but the accoustic emissions from the engine and drivetrain are pleasant to the ear. The Lexus/Toyota engines have a smooth sewing machine-like noise compared to the Genesis that has a cacophonous, drone sounding engine / drivetrain.
10-30-14, 08:46 AM
#30
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Thread Starter
And while evetything is quiet inside at idle, but when you rev the engine the sounds it makes just don't sound good. While my IS may emit more dB, but the accoustic emissions from the engine and drivetrain are pleasant to the ear. The Lexus/Toyota engines have a smooth sewing machine-like noise compared to the Genesis that has a cacophonous, drone sounding engine / drivetrain.
How did you get your hands on a Genesis to drive before pricing was even released in your market?
I agree theres nothing "special" about the interior's design, but its a very high quality interior comparable with anything at a starting price point below $70k.
Last edited by SW17LS; 10-30-14 at 08:51 AM.